This is a comment by Brian Levene on the post “I’m Stark Naked: Deal With It“.
“I look something like you—15 years older and somewhat worse for wear.
I just think it’s a bloody miracle women think we’re sexy.”
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If the clothes don’t make the man, do they at least signal what kind of man wears them?
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I don’t think it’s a miracle at all. The idea that women only like tall, tanned, buff guys is as much a lie as the notion that men only like skinny, big-titted blondes. I bet if you look at the women you’ve been attracted to in your life, you’ll see a diverse range of different types. And I bet half of ‘em think it’s a bloody miracle men think they’re sexy. That’s how low self-esteem works: it’s believing that other people think less well of you than you do of them, and it works both ways.
I think it comes down to what people are thinking but what people are saying, or are “allowed” to say based on cultural narratives. Well on one side of the coin you have men that are demanded to go on and on and about women being sexy and on the other you have women that are demanded to stay silent about men being sexy.
As a result I bet Brian has probably noticed that not many women are talking about what they find sexy.
So after 50 years the fact that women don’t find me sexy is my low self-esteem? Don’t think so…On my worst bullied day I never suffered from low self-esteem. Maybe it’s OK to realize that some people, male and female, just aren’t sexy. There are worse curses. For a long time one of my biggest problems was I thought I had some kind of right to be found attractive. After I got myself straight on that a lot of my suffering ended. Does that concept go against some cultural ideology? I would much rather have zero sexuality than come across as 100% sexual. I’ve heard a bunch of horror stories from women on the other side of that coin.
For a long time one of my biggest problems was I thought I had some kind of right to be found attractive.
Yeah that can be dangerous thinking.
But sometimes its not a matter of being owed attraction but more of strongly desiring something and then seeing other people seemingly attaining it so easily (and just to be clear the strong desire to be considered attractive is not based on seeing other people being considered attractive).
I have a mixed reaction to this.
I appreciate the humility and appreciation in this quote. I like the idea of counting one’s blessings, and I like the recognition that other people see us differently than we see ourselves, sometimes seeing us better than we see ourselves. That part’s all good.
On the other hand, let’s not grovel too much, either. Let’s not envision women as divinely merciful inhuman angels who deserve better than us any more than we envision them to be inferior beings. Those are just two sides of the same coin.
I suggest the common kneejerk genderflip to see how it feels. Just change the quote around: women are very lucky that men find them sexy at all. They should count their blessings that we see their bodies as attractive in the first place. Sounds really condescending and insulting when you put it that way, doesn’t it?
Somehow I don’t think of mself as ‘sexy’ at all. I know my wife loves me and we’re sexually active, but I dont see women paying 25 dollars admission plus buying $10 drinks to hoot and hollar at guys who look like me at some ‘Male Review’ or guys who look like me in some magazine that sells almost 4 million copies a month (Playgirl). I think that when it’s all said and done, we’re the guys they settle for.
bobbt, I think we should delete the words “settle for” from our vocabulary.
Sorry Lisa, but that’s just me being ‘brutally honest’.Like I said, my Wife loves me and treats me great (Istill can’t figure out why), but I know I’m not the guy in those ‘Bodice Ripper’ romantic novels she loves to read. I may be loved (For which I’m grateful), but I’m definately NOT sexy!
Okay I know I’m the last person that should be saying anything like this but I have to ask.
Maybe your wife finds you plenty sexy and that is why she is with you?
Danny, someone recently asked me “Why do you think your Wife married you?” I told him I’m still trying to figure out why she agreed to go on a date with me! I guess I’ll truely never understand, but I really don’t see myself as ‘sexy’ no matter what Noah says.
Believe me bobbt, I understand. Despite the Men and Body Image series and all the eye opening I did because of it I totally understand.
bobbt, I’ve been right where you’re at, man. Rule of thumb I use: Take people’s word for it. Your wife says she finds you attractive, just take her word that it’s true. Maybe you don’t understand why, but that just means she knows her own feelings better than you do. Heck, she’s the world’s leading expert on her own feelings, so don’t argue with her. She sees something in you that she loves, and you’re not required to see the same thing in order to believe her.
I know, easier said than done, but it’s helped me. Just assume she’s telling the truth instead of looking for reasons she’s not. Saves time and energy.
I’m short and chubby. You’re not going to anyone who looks like me on a Top 100 Sexiest Women list, men certainly wouldn’t pay to see me pole-dance and I can count the number of times I’ve seen a women of my proportions cast as a romantic lead on exactly zero fingers. That doesn’t mean I’m not sexy. I’ve known guys who have been ALL about my big ass, my wobbly thighs or my diminutive height. Unless they were all very convincing liars, I can safely assume that there is demand for the kind of sexy I bring to the table. But I only arrived at this conclusion after making a conscious decision to try to ignore the incredibly narrow definition of “sexy” that’s shoved in my face every day and wholeheartedly accept and cherish any compliments I received in this department.
The same is definitely true for men. I know I’ve been attracted to all shapes and sizes, hairy men, bald men, giant men, short men. And while everyone has their own preferences, I think it’s important to assume that you’re always going to be sexy to someone, particularly if that person is your wife! It would make me really sad if my boyfriend or husband thought I was just “settling” for him because he’s not some bulging Adonis. Male beauty (and human beauty in general) is so much more complex and varied and exciting than that!
I understand what you’re all saying, but in my heart, I just don’t see it.
Dear bobbt,
Sexiness goes much further beyond physical attractiveness. People who are of steadfast character and actively contribute to the well-being of those around them are also sexy. Your wife didn’t select you as a mate solely on your superficial characteristics. She married the things you do, say, and the way that you conduct yourself around others. If it were just your looks she cared about, she would have left a long time ago. The things you accomplish, the way your presence completes her home, the way you look at her… all of these things are a part of what makes you personally sexy. And trust me, you can give “the look” without being a supermodel. She loves you, so keep on being you. There is nobody else in the world that can do for her what you can do.
I can remember the first woman to say I looked handsome. Even after we called things off it stayed with me. A second woman called me “cute,” and that made me also feel great.
The important thing is to not give anyone – make or femAle – the power of how you feel about the way you look.
I have to ask, when these women were describing you as “handsome” and “cute” what were their boyfriends/husbands doing? Because in my case they were coming up behind me. So you can imagine what my response would be today if I heard that again. Everyone has different experiences.
Women =/= always in heterosexual relationships.
One of them he mentioned was though – with him.
Oh, your point is absolutely correct. That’s what I’ve learned as well.
I can walk around naked at some parties because I do not experience my body as an aesthetic object. I experience no female gaze. More often my body and male parts are a matter of disgust or indifference to the women I know. Ugly or handsome, women generally wait for you to talk to them either way, so who knows how you measure up? We stick our necks out and accept the risk of rejection because we want them more than they want us unless we can really really prove we’re better than the other guys. I don’t believe for a second the women I’ve dated would have done that for me initially.
In the prototypical heteronormative scenario, men are active and women are passive. A woman who changes her appearance will hopefully expect some shift in how much over male attention we receive, however, a man will not. Working out, new clothes, etc., does nothing for me in the way of the amount of overt advances I receive from women.
I put myself out there as confidently as I can, try to take rejection with some class, etc., but as a man I have no way of gauging how physically attractive or unattractive I am to women in general. I have been with enough women to believe that I might be an ugly guy with an attractive personality, and I have been rejected enough to believe that I might be an OK looking guy with a so so personality. I pour out my soul to women who blow me off with a yawn and handwave, and I’ve had sex with women I barely know at all.