This is a comment by patrick “What Marriage Means to Me“.
Thanks for your thoughts on marriage and divorce. Although I do not agree with everything you write, it is good to hear the experience of someone who has gone down this road. I think you extend, and practice, the idea that marriage is about romantic love. Very much like the majority of Western society.
I’m very old-school in my belief; marriage is not and should not be about romantic love at all, but struggle. Marriage should be hard. It is cutting you out of wood, making you a better person. That process is painful. It goes against our very nature to be in romantic love with someone forever. We are not created this way. We can however love someone for life, as in, want the best for them always, to be truthful and honest and tolerant with another flawed human being as best as we can. This I know.
It saddens me your marriage ended, but it is good to see you are a forgiving person and you are being much more mature about the situation than many men before you and after you. Thanks again.
Photo credit: Flickr / chriswsn
I don’t think marriage “should” be any one thing, or that is has a specific purse over and above what we ourselves make of it.
However, I agree that you be prepared for there to *also* be struggle, to rough periods and hard work. If you’re not prepared for that and not willing to put in the effort to work through, I think you’ll be missing out. The difficult patches of a long-term relationship can offer really great opportunities for personal growth.
If you’re not prepared for that and not willing to put in the effort to work through, I think you’ll be missing out. Missing out on what, I wonder. It all seems like a gamble, doesn’t it? You do the hard work to through the rough periods, and for what? More rough periods? Perennial struggle? Or is it simply the promise of not being alone as we age? At what point do we throw in the towel and say, “you know, I tried, but I’m not willing to try any longer.” I’m starting to sour on the idea of marriage… Read more »
Patrick thank you for your comment. I have to respectfully disagree that marriage “should” be anything. To say it “should” be hard and a struggle is very sad to my mind. Marriage is hard, it can and often is a struggle as are most things worth having and doing well in life. As far as we know human beings are the only creatures in the entire universe who experience romantic love. Romantic love is a gift to our transcendence from conscienceless animal to a enlightened, creative, conscious beings who not only live life but who can with hard work and… Read more »
Well, I’ll say this for the commentator. Historically he is correct. Marrying for love is a rather novel concept in the broad stroke of history. It wasn’t generally the norm and wasn’t the expectation it is today. Is it better or worse than it was before? I dunno. But it seems kinda ridiculour to me to end a perfectly good partnership merely because “I don’t love you anymore.” Are the dishes done? Kids cared for? House kept? Taxes paid? Sexual needs fulfilled? Life on a reasonably even keel? If yes, why get divorced? Because the grass is greener? Sounds kinda… Read more »
Married for a decade this July. Ironically, the thing my wife and agree on where relationships are concerned is that marriage SHOULD be easy. Not easy in the sense that there is no conflict and never any stress. But easy as it relates to looking forward to seeing your spouse every day; being glad to hear their voice on the phone; happy in the presence and type of partnership they offer your family. The difference between a healthy marriage and a damaged one (in my opinion) is: in a healthy marriage you hope to solve whatever conflict exists between you… Read more »
Married for 15 years, together for 25….I think marriage is whatever you make out of it…I’m not sure I would have put it exactly as Patrick did…but there is some truth to what he says about the struggles within a long marriage…My relationship has changed a lot from the time we started out as two wild grad students tangoing around each other and daring the other to come closer and become more enmeshed…. Now it’s more about getting our kid to his LEGO Robotics competitions and juggling our work schedules with family reunions and dinner parties with our friends…it’s also… Read more »
I would agree with him if he had written, “marriage will include some struggle” but that’s not what he wrote.
He’s not saying that relationships change, there will be good times, and bad times, and struggles that help us grow. He’s explicitly saying marriage should not be about romantic love.
marriage is not and should not be about romantic love at all, but struggle (emphasis added)
It’s a prescriptive statement and there’s nothing in it that I can agree with.
Are the editors trolling the GMP commentariat by highlighting this comment?
I mean, it’s quite obvious from his recent comments that “patrick” likes to present very absolutist ideas without so much as a hint of nuance. This comment is of the same vein – defining what marriage should be without any allowances for the variety of human experience.
If “patrick” wants his marriage to be all about struggle then that’s fine – struggle away. I just hope he doesn’t have any legislative authority to try to impose his retrograde views on others.
I dislike his stance. All good things take both work AND play. Play gets us through the rough times. Joy is important.
“Play gets us through the rough times. Joy is important.”
Julie, I really like how you said that.
I actually think it’s kind of interesting. I’ve heard the “Divorce is bad, you broke your commitment” and the “I was in an unhealthy place, and so have other people I’ve known, so divorce is necessary” kind of thing. But I don’t think I’ve heard the perspective that he thinks that in the grand scheme of things it’s an exercise of making you both into stronger, better people. It’s a more complex argument than just “kids these days are all getting divorced!” Now, do I agree with it? Not really. I realize the love for my husband that I have… Read more »