This is a comment by Lara Sobel on the post “Is Holding Hands a Gateway Sexual Activity?“
“The more taboo something is, the more attractive it is to a young person when they are trying to separate from their parents and develop their own personalities.
“Besides the obvious problems of not having sex-ed in schools, I think separating girls from boys in sex ed does a disservice to everybody. Sex is a human issue. The best place we can start bringing the sexes together discussing sexual issues is in schools. If we model to emerging adults that discussion of sex is only safe between ‘same’ sexes, then we are immediately teaching a division of communication between the sexes. Having them all together eliminates the problems of exclusion of teens who are not sure or still evolving with their gender or sexual orientation identities. Besides the basic logistics of sex, no one is teaching young people how to talk to each other about it. Who is teaching them how to ask permission to touch, how to respond, how to say what you like, how to clearly communicate your boundaries, how to listen?
“If we can’t even talk about the basics of how to put a condom on, how are we going to teach, or provide a safe environment for young people to learn about themselves and practice the communication skills to say things like, ‘I like you. It’s okay to kiss me with your tongue, touch my breasts & nipples, you may touch my vulva and clitoris with your hands only, but I’m not ready for any part of you to go inside me …’ and have their partner listen? There are adults who can’t even do this because they are weighted down with so much guilt and shame, and the totally unrealistic fantasy that pleasure just happens naturally.
“Another thing missing from sex ed is education frank and honest education about masturbation. If I had a young boy, I’d be giving him handfuls of condoms & lubricant to start practicing masturbation with a condom on, so when the time finally comes for him to have intercourse, he and his nervous system are ready for a pleasurable experience. If a boy is masturbating all the time without a condom, when the time comes to finally have sex with a condom, it is awkward and may not feel as good. He will be less motivated to use a condom during actual intercourse. If I had a girl, I’d be encouraging her to fully explore and learn about her body & how to pleasure herself as well. Knowing how to pleasure yourself first, and how to communicate what feels good with non-intercourse types of sexual activity to your partner is so important. You can become very intimate and have wonderful sexual pleasure as a young person using just your hands on each other genitals. I know women who have been faking orgasm during vaginal sex with their partners and husbands their entire lives because they were not encouraged to find their own pleasure, & even feel shameful about trying to pleasure themselves. If you can’t even pleasure yourself without guilt or shame, how are you going to tell someone else what you need, what feels good, even when you’re finally in a ‘healthy,’ ‘sanctioned’ or socially approved relationship?”
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Photo credit: Flickr / Will Hale
I just thought I’d drop in a shout-out to a sex-ed curriculum that seems to satisfy what you wish was more prevalent in sex ed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Whole_Lives
I had the privilege of going through its predecessor (About Your Sexuality), which I found far more helpful than the sex ed that I encountered in a liberal public school in New England.
Lara, I agree and applaud at everything you said…
save for the condom thing.
It sounds like conditioning your (hypothetic) son, for the sake of the future.
Rather, let him having the fun and exploration he needs, the (natural) way he wants. AND, explain him that he might need to use condoms in the future.
You don’t make a kid wear scuba gear while he’s just splashing in water, because one day he might want to go scuba diving. 😉
For the rest… yeah, good sex-ed rocks, ignorance and prudery suck. Period.
But you do have people practice with scuba gear so that they don’t freak the hell out and drown when they are ready to scuba. There are many things to do, try and practice. Besides the natural fun solo splashing, why not have all kids practice using condoms/dams/female condoms etc so that they don’t balk/freakout/fail at it when they get to the ocean?
I suppose then that girls should be taught to always use a condom with penetrative sex toys also? It would be safer, as improperly cleaned vibs and dildos can and do cause bacterial infections in girls/women that use them. A fresh condom every time would also allow her to be used to feel and become experienced in applying condoms.
Yes! Anyone using a sex toy that may be shared should always use a condom, fyi. Always play safe. And yes, anyone masturbating with a sex toy would do well to use a condom for the practice.
Yes I agree with that.
So why doesn’t things like this come up ? There is a inherent bias that boys should be told/demanded to Do X, yet that girls are sensitive so i should only be gently suggested that girls do Y.
Right, basically no sex ed classes (at least in the U.S.) talk about using sex toys, full stop…and most of them don’t talk about masturbation at all either. They most assuredly don’t go into specifics about masturbation, unless you go to a purposefully sex-positive type of sex ed class, which usually you don’t have access to until university.
So I disagree there’s a gender bias here…just that rarely does anyone like to talk about masturbation and using sex toys.
The discussed terms “It seems odd that you would encourage a girl to fully explore and learn about her body and how to pleasure herself, but you would teach a boy that he is only allowed to masturbate with a condom on so that he can get used to a desensitized sexual experience” There is a bias, Boys are told/ordered/shamed, and girls are suggested. It’s interesting as the sexes being reversed in the go get’em boy and the always say no young lady tradional sexual behavior pattern that many complain about. Why can’t the sexual education of both genders be… Read more »
Yeah because women are never told/ordered/shamed into anything with regards to sex…oh wait a second…
Even if we’re just talking about male condoms, there’s a big push to emphasize that women should take responsibility for that too and carry condoms in their purses. So no, there is no bias.
HUH? There is a bias in how sex ed is approached when related to boys….just the same as the traditional sexual behavior training bias is reversed……and even that’s not good for most boys. Boys sexuality growing up is not nearly handled with as much sensitivity as it is for girls….and that cultural behavior is a bias. Saying that there are biases against girls in different areas does not lessen the truth of this. Or as Boys have to deal with cultural biases does that mean all those that effect girls should be ignored? I’m saying we need to treat boys… Read more »
I’m a firm believer that both boys and girls need to be treated with sensitivity and respect about sex ed. Their bodies belong to them, we don’t know who may have been abused and so that needs to be accounted for and consent issues discussed (everyone has the right to say no etc), and both genders need to know that they need to learn ethics, sexual health, basic responsbilities to each other (boundaries, honesty etc). There are biases all over the place on a number of subjects. Sexual health and pleasure needs to be revamped entirely…
It seems odd that you would encourage a girl to fully explore and learn about her body and how to pleasure herself, but you would teach a boy that he is only allowed to masturbate with a condom on so that he can get used to a desensitized sexual experience. I think one of the things we need to stop doing is expecting boys and men to learn to cope with a less satisfying sexual experience for women’s sake. Why do we not teach girls how to use a female condom so that they have the responsibility of preventing the… Read more »
I’ve got little issue with this. Female condoms need to be made more effective and and offered with the ubiquity and low cost (or free) as male ones. Both types of condoms should continue to be manufactured with sensitivity in mind. Perhaps partners could take turns and also do various other sexual acts to maximize pleasure for both. And of course boundaries should be heard for men and well as women.
I’d also say, better for both men and women to practice with dual types of condoms because one never knows in a casual sex situation who will have what. I see nothing wrong with asking boys or girls to practice, glove or no glove feeling. Dental dams don’t feel good either and should be used, condoms of any sort can cause irritation to the woman (and also don’t feel the same), spermacides can cause irritation to either partner. Pills are awesome to a certain extent but not everyone can take them. There isn’t really a perfect barrier free way to… Read more »
Also….what would it feel like to penetrate a female condom? Wouldn’t it still feel like a glove?
Your penis would glide over the female condom and would activate the touch sensors differently. Male condoms cling to the penis and remain stationary, so it would be a different experience. I could suggest put a glove on and rub your finger on something, vs rub your bare finger on a glove, that’d be the kind of tactile difference. Not sure if they make ribbed female condoms but a ribbed or textured version would maybe give additional pleasure to the male, but a male ribbed condom doesn’t move so the ribs don’t really do much for him.
I don’t think you understand, even latex has some degree of friction which you can feel when gliding it over your penis (hence the fleshlight, etc), when it’s a latex male condom though it creates a barrier that doesn’t rub the same way and is probably less sensitive. It’s 2 different ways to feel latex, if I slide something over my penis with a condom on I don’t feel it as much, if I slide my bare penis over latex though I can feel it more. Probably only a guy will understand this fully. It has to do with touch… Read more »
It’s weird, but eh, that’s the body. Touch receptors can be ultrasensitive but with something directly on the skin it dampens them, probably also spreads the load out a bit more so it activates the receptors less. There’s also a difference in how “wet” it feels.
Missing my point. It ill email you sometime
I think your example of a glove worked pretty well, actually. There’s a difference between feeling your hand moving in a glove, and then trying to feel something outside while wearing the glove. I’m sure for some men, wearing a condom really sucks (and not in a positive, life-affirming way). But they are cheap (often free) and currently the most easily accessible and easily usable form of practising safe sex. Them’s the breaks. So until someone comes up with a better option, it’s good to have people practice with the barrier methods that are available now. I think a boy… Read more »
Heather, So boys and men should just deal with not enjoying sex because it is cheaper than having women pay a couple more dollars for female condom or some other protection designed for women? And for the record, everywhere that I know of that gives away male condoms also gives away female condoms. Anything over the skin will take away some sensation. Even thin condoms still take away a lot of sensation. But it is not a matter of coming up with a better option so much as it is not putting all the responsibility on men. There are options… Read more »
Right okay, I didn’t say the responsibility should be on men. Even if I had said that male condoms should be mostly used (which I didn’t), I still didn’t say that it’s the responsibility of the men to make sure they’re used. What I was saying was that until someone comes up with something better, a barrier has to be used to prevent STIs and to provide an extra source of protection against unwanted pregnancy. A barrier. I’m not saying it should be a male condom, or female condom, or diaphragm, or whatever…just a barrier. And any barrier is going… Read more »
I’ve got little issue with this. Female condoms need to be made more effective and and offered with the ubiquity and low cost (or free) as male ones. Female condoms are just as effective as male condoms, and while they may cost more, that is poor excuse for not using them, particularly when some places that give out free contraceptives give out female condoms. So, in my experience one or both partners may have a somewhat less than ideal PIV moment, though I’d hate to see the rest of sex (touch, kissing, looking at and being with each other) as… Read more »
“If you were making out with someone, which usually involves lots of kissing, I am pretty sure would enjoy it less if you had latex wrapped around your tongue.” I’ve two words for you: dental dam…though admittedly that’s for oral sex not making out. But the point still stands, which is that any barrier is going to take some getting used to. Mind, outside of lesbian-positive spaces I dare you to find a dental dam. It’s damn near impossible. Which again goes back to the ubiquity of male condoms. They’re everywhere. And here’s the problem with female condoms and using… Read more »
“So you’re saying “oh the woman should be responsible for brining her own barrier because condoms suck,” and I assume that’s in response to women saying “men should be responsible for bringing his own barrier because female barriers suck.” And I say this…how about everyone is flipping responsible by talking about it first and figuring out which system works best for the people involved at the time.” Yep. Currently there is no perfect birth control/std prevention method, so figure out the best ways possible for each partner (no matter the gender) to get the most possible pleasure and the least… Read more »
Heather, You said that because condoms are cheap and the most accessible and usable way to practice safe sex, “them’s the breaks”. That puts the responsibility on men, and it is unfair to expect men to lose sensation during sex because male condoms are cheap. If you wear gloves all the time, you might get used to lack of sense of touch, but you still do not have a sense of touch, so it is still a problem. At the end of the day, the argument is that only boys and men should deal with a less pleasurable sexual experience,… Read more »
What I don’t understand is that I’m actually in agreement here. There is no perfect BC/STD prevention currently. Each method has a tradeoff. Each partner may lose something in the process. All genders should learn how to use various methods and be at ease with their use. All partners should discuss a variety of methods to increase pleasure and decrease risk. I don’t see anything wrong with that. As for making out? If we were truly invested in disease prevention (and I’m mentioning this not because I think it sounds good but because it’s an extreme) we’d probably avoid kissing… Read more »
I think she meant to masturbate with the condom sometimes, not every single time.