A startling confession from his wife while out with friends angered Doug Zeigler enough to explore the stereotype of men who are divorced and have kids.
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After a few cocktails, a friend of my wife’s who had begun dating again after divorce made what she thought was a fairly innocuous comment: “I think there are a lot more nice women then there are nice men in the dating pool.” During the evening, she had been talking about the men she had met and how she saw them as far as any long-term relationship was concerned. She has children, so naturally, that is a large part of her assessment of the dating pool. One man she really liked was not someone she thought would be a great influence on her kids. Not that he would be a negative one, but not overwhelmingly positive. That is what spurred her comment.
After stifling an eye roll, I said that I thought that “nice” was subjective because what one woman might think is a nice gesture or approach, another woman may find offensive. Same with men. When my wife and her friend started talking about finding someone who is a good fit for your kids, I heard this from the woman I married: “There’s a difference between a single father and a divorced dad.”
I’m not ashamed to admit this dumbfounded me. “What’s the difference?” I asked.
Her answer startled me and even angered me a bit. Not at her exactly, but at the stereotype she shared that her friend completely understood without an explanation.
According to this mindset, men who do not have their children full time are not single fathers. They are considered divorced dads. Single fathers are those that care for their children full time and “understand” what a single mother contends with on the day-to-day as a result. Divorced dads are men who have their children every other weekend and have all kinds of freedom in between, and as such do not act like fathers during that time. They don’t always consider the time they have outside having their children at all intersecting with the time they spend with their kids, which makes them seem irresponsible.
That was my summation of what she said, understand. Her explanation was more eloquent, but no less astounding. And denigrating in my opinion, considering I only get my sons every weekend as per my custody agreement.
I waited until we were on our way home so I could calm down a bit, but I had to ask. I had to know. “Did you see me as a divorced dad, not a single father when we started dating?”
Realizing that I may have been offended by that, she sheepishly replied, “Yes … and you overcame that.”
Let me just say that I never considered myself less than a single father when I was single. I found her notion that men who don’t have their kids full time are somehow less of a father than ones that do to be abhorrent. The question is: why is THAT the stereotype?
I asked a swath of friends what their opinion was and it was largely in line with what my wife and her friend thought. I could see that this was a not just a case of me being overly sensitive to the plight of divorced dads with kids, but rather a perception that was widely held. I turned to that savior of information, the internet. According to census.gov, in 2011, 18.3% of fathers had primary physical custody, up from 6.1% in 1993.That is a massive jump in numbers, to be certain, yet the stereotype that men who do not have their children all the time are not equal to the men who do persists.
A salient view of this issue could be found in an article on attorneys.com, which asks the question: “Why Do Women Win Custody?” Their sobering answer:
There are many reasons why women win custody in the overwhelming number of cases. Chief among them: Because that’s the way it’s always been. Traditionally, men worked and women stayed home to raise children. Although that is less frequently the case these days, there is still a bias toward women in child custody cases. From a biological perspective, we are more inclined to think of the mother-child relationship than the father-child relationship. Many people make the automatic assumption that women are more nurturing as parents than men.
In a world where women comprise 47% of the total labor force in the US (as per the US Department of Labor), it seems pretty safe to assume that men and women work roughly the same amount of jobs. Add to it the growing number of stay-at-home fathers and it’s pretty clear: men and women can both be caring and nurturing parents.
So how can we get past this bias? I fear it’s not that simple. This is part of our culture. Just take a look at all the nostalgia for “the good old days,” comprised of the idea of a nuclear family, complete with the Ward Cleaver-esque father heading off to work while June stays home to care for the house and the kids. However, our culture has shifted and changed, and that highly specialized view of the ideal family just doesn’t suit anymore.
Then, there is this idea that women are better nurturers than men, ergo, better parents. I can recall hearing my attorney say this to me when I filed for divorce: “Well, in this county, you’re not going to get custody. It just doesn’t happen unless the woman is a drug addict, a danger to your kids, or a mental patient. You’ll be in the minority if you get more than every other weekend with your sons. My advice would be to do all you can to keep her happy so that she’ll be easier to deal with when it comes to custody.” This was the man I was paying to help me, and his sage advice was catering to the whims of the woman I was divorcing.
And boy, did I ever take that advice to heart. I was scared to death I would only be allowed to see my sons 4 days a month. I bent over backward and gave up many things naively because I feared the worst. In the end, I was lucky I was able to have my sons every weekend and have dinner with them during the week. My agreement is seen as a victory even by my attorney’s standards. I’m certainly thankful I get that much time because it could have easily been worse as I have seen other fathers end up.
That is what is frustrating for me. I am viewing this as a man who has sacrificed to maintain a connection to his children. I realize there is a whole other side of this argument, from a female perspective. My wife voiced how it wasn’t her intent to judge single fathers. Or to be overly critical. Instead, she viewed it as a cautious measure when considering who she, as a single mother, chose to date. She admitted she felt tremendous gravity in her serious dating relationships to weigh what “kind” of father those men would be around her children. Some were classified as “divorced dads” and did not make the cut to even be around her daughters.
I can empathize with her explanation because I was very choosy about who my kids would meet too. The difference is that I didn’t assume the worst. That doesn’t make her protective stance with her daughters wrong, just a different approach. I guess I just find it sad that societally we do assume the worst when it comes to men and fatherhood, especially in the cases of custody. I do believe that over time proving that we can be and ARE great parents in our own right we can eradicate the stereotype. The onus is on us, men. We need to own our fatherhood and show how marvelous we all are at being “just” a dad, and that makes us great fathers, too.
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This post is republished on Medium.
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Photo credit: iStock
Pretty disgusting. I am a soon to be divorced father… divorce process has been going on for almost 2 years (with kids). Had the full works, guardian ad litems, counselors, attorneys and multiple judges involved. Long story short, I have a 50/50 split with the wife. I did not want to take the kids from their mother and did not try and fight it. I have every other week, not weekends. It’s fun to see all the websites automatically assume that a father just gets every other weekend. So, ask your wife, what does is a father who has allowed… Read more »
This article angers me you want to be known as a dad who does his part. If that’s the case and you feel you should be high five for your involvement in their life every other weekend and a dinner once a week well then hi5 yourself because that is sad. If you wanted more custody he would have gone back and forth from Moore but you didn’t you enjoyed your freedom because you knew your children will being taken care of by their mother. I am so over men and women who agreed to this custody and then feel… Read more »
Did you read the article Emily?
It was about the stereotype that men who don’t have their kids full time are somehow less of a father than ones that do.
We are a group of dads fighting for dads to have the same equality as the mother
Liked your Blog, very informative. I’m 52 single dad, my son is 15. We live in Canada, my situation is somewhat different than the norm in a divorce. I have custody of Jakob and receive nearly 800.00 child support from the ex-wife. She dated a man that was abusive and RCMP was involved in her new dating life. Jakob wanted nothing to do with his mom and she was also emotionally abusive to him. After the courts and review of the child(court ordered). And getting my son and support payments from here was done quickly. I’m the only man that… Read more »
Totally get this, my sons lived with me Saturday to Tuesday every week. Being a father was the greatest joy I have ever experienced, unfortunately most of the women I dated were not understanding of the time I wanted and needed to spend with my boys so I have been mostly single since my divorce 8 years ago.
“There are many reasons why women win custody in the overwhelming number of cases. Chief among them: Because that’s the way it’s always been.”
That’s not actually true. I’d suggest looking up the “tender years doctrine”. Tradition WAS paternal custody until a century ago.
I can only relate my own observations from first-hand knowledge of how the legal system works. The Tender Years Doctrine — the legal premise that children are best served with their mothers — has been written out of every state statute. This language has been replaced with a list judges consider when deciding custody. Men don’t get 50/50 time simply because they haven’t spend 50 percent of the time doing the grunt work: taking the kids to school, picking them up, taking time off from work when their child/children are ill, driving them to doctor’s appointments, making school lunches/dinners, etc.… Read more »
Funny, my ex wife was what you just described, a pay check. I was a stay at home dad. I did everything when it came to taking care of our son. I had to fight tooth and nail just to get 50% custody. What you just said is complete bullshit. In the eyes of the court I was a dead beat dad because I didn’t have a job. She’s a doctor making over $250k a year. Didn’t matter. The courts favor women plain and simple.
Agree. This is why mothers are awarded primary care in the greater portion, not some ludicrous notion that the present day family court discriminates in these matters solely based on gender.
Although the verdict is still out as to if i’m happy I waited until my 40’s to have children, I know that i’m happy I refrained from having them with my first wife. They would have been one more thing to fight over during the divorce. The termination of my first marriage was rather easy, as I was able to walk away from everything and start over from scratch instead of leading the “battle royale”. I know if we would have had children though, that I wold have fought tooth and nail for them. Great article, as always, my friend.
It’s not even about “won’t/can’t take care if their kids”, but every man I know who has their children half the time, dies so because their ex demands them the other half. When you come right down to it, the woman have their kids only half the time as well, and that makes them no less deserving of the same prejudice they are perpetrating againt others, according to their own values (not mine). Shame on your wife and her friend. Personaly, I want to be there 100% of the time for my own kids, but so does my ex, and… Read more »
Thank you for the article. I do feel that I am judged by the my custody relationship. The worse judge is myself. I wanted 50/50 but my ex did not. said it was not what the kids wanted. Personally I believe it was so she could get more money. I was the one who drove my kids places. I see my two older kids a little, mainly my now 18 year old son, my 15 year old daughter I rarely see. They do not come over for my every other weekend as it was not convenient to them. I tried… Read more »
Doug,
My ex-wife killed herself last year and I am now a stay at home father of a traumatised 10yo boy, while my current wife works (she makes more money than I could).
Its really hard, I’m going crazy and depressed staying at home and dealing with his behaviours, while we both work through the grief, it even for a time threatened my current relationship. Mostly I hate feeling useless and valueless, not being able to bring home money for the family and be independent.
Thanks for the article, its good to hear that my problems are not original.
Doug,
I’d be curious to know if this article resulted in any growth in emotional intelligence of either your wife or her friend.
Was there ever any understanding on their part that both their comments and belief systems could be highly offensive? Was there any growth or acknowledgment on their part that their perceptions were off base or were their reactions to this article & the comments to it more defensive in nature?
Thank you.
You’re on shaky ground any time you ask a marginalized group to take responsibility for eradicating its own stereotypes. That goes double when you take a sympathetic position towards a group or individual who defends and perpetuates the false notion. Victim-blaming is satisfying and popular, but never solves anything. Perhaps if fathers took such opportunities to advocate for their rights, women may be inclined to reconsider their prejudices. Equality is equality, right? It’s good to understand where some of these unfortunate assumptions originate; however, it’s simply not rational to assume that a man might be poorer stepfather simply because a… Read more »
I’m have my son 100% of the time, no paternal involvement by his choice. I am therefore a sole parent. I think that divorced/separated parents who both see the kids, regardless of the % split, are co-parents.
I would heartily agree. My hat is off to you true single parents; I can’t imagine doing it alone.
I know a single father. He has custody of his children and under their parenting agreement their mom is supposed to have them 1 week night a week, every other weekend, 2 weeks in the summer, and every other holiday. She chooses to see them one night a week and to take them on photo ops during her holiday time with them. That is she takes them to family parties to pretend that she’s a good mother and then drops them back off with their dad though they’re supposed to spend the entire day with her. If I were to… Read more »
I don’t get offended by much, but this double-standard/mindset makes me sad, upset, and angry. I was raised by my dad who divorced my mom, and if anyone said he was less of a father while we were away with her, then I’d be majorly offended.
i wonder if the reverse is also true, are those women who share custody with their ex partners, considered less of a parent than those who have full custody?
Oh, probably not. One thing this has codified in my mind is that my wife is NOT a single parent. Neither am I, as we both have as much support as the other parent is willing/able to give.
IMO “single parent” should be reserved for a parent of either gender raising the children all on their own – both in terms of time AND money.
When my second wife and I were ending our marriage, it finally came time to discuss our son’s living arrangements, I suggested he might live with me (based on our situation) and she freaked out. We had been agreeable and trying to work together, with great results up to this point. Apparently, she had never entertained the thought that our son might live with me.She wanted him to live with her and I explained that I felt the same way. She said they were not the same, and no matter how I explained it, she never understood that her desire… Read more »
Like most things – stereotypes or generalizations/assumptions serve no one well. I know many incredible fathers who stay connected with their kids and put the children’s needs first in lots of ways! They can have full time or part time custody. Some should have more and can’t get it because of a system that assumes moms are better, or an ex wife that won’t allow it, or other reasons. There are ALSO many mothers who fight tooth and nail to protect their children from mentally, emotionally and/or physically abusive fathers, against a legal/court system that minimizes the “emotional” woman too… Read more »
Statistics show that many fathers with custody are actually abusive men who use their children as weapons against the mother. I speak from experience. I had to spend thousands and thousands of dollars to have a GAL lecture my ex about not speaking poorly about me to our child and yet the crap continues. Just last week my ex told our child to tell me to leave a school event when there was no withstanding reason other than his hope for control and abuse. Anyone who says the court system is biased against men should hear my case. I’m all… Read more »
That’s odd Fedup because my GAL had the court take away custody and any visitation from my ex-wife because of mental abuse on our child. She constantly trashed me to our son. I don’t think every woman does that. Only bad ones. Statistics also show that woman file more fraudulent abuse claims against their spouse to get better positioning for custody.
Interesting topic, one that invokes feelings all across the spectrum. I’d like to think I’m a Divorced Dad. I have joint custody of my daughter with my ex and I have my daughter every weekend. We were actually separated prior to the birth of my daughter and she’s now 14 so its been 14 years of having my little one every weekend. Its virtually impossible to date in this situation, not only from a lack of time perspective but from all of the financial issues as described by Markus above. The sacrifices of a personal life are ones I’d make… Read more »
The Single Parent/Divorced Parent goes both ways.
I’m on the other side of the equation. I have full custody because she can’t get her act together and be a parent. She’s supposed to pay child support, but can’t even be bothered to get a job.
Our kids might get a phone call from her couple times a month. When she sees them she expects they will treat her like she’s the world’s best mother.
Like many stereotypes, that females make better parents isn’t at all true.
Agreed Paul. I just last week found out that I will be getting sole custody of my son, In many cases the judge just gives the custody to the mother because shes the mother. Which happened in my case. My ex immediately started alienating my son from me. Thank God I requested a Guardian ad Litem (lawyer for my son) to our case. She gave my ex and me things to do to help my son. My ex did nothing. I got sole custody.
Thanks for a great article Doug. Really hits home. I got divorced from my first wife in 2005. The preceding year and a half was the hardest time in my life. She disconnected. I discovered an affair, fell into a horrible depression that I needed meds for, was getting precious little help from anyone and spent pretty much the entirety of that time in marriage counseling with my, then wife, begging her not to leave the marriage. When I finally decided that it was time to call it quits I was wholly unprepared for what I was going to deal… Read more »
I actually have always thought of the term “single mother” as referring most accurately to a woman who has 100% parenting time or close to it, and as that slowly becomes more common for men, I think that “single father” should refer to them to. A “divorced mom or dad” is someone who shares parenting time to a large degree. I am currently one year into the divorce process, and it has not changed my opinion about it. A parent (either gender) who is responsible for their children most or all of the time faces substantially greater challenges socially, economically,… Read more »
The questions I continue to ask is; Who makes the judgement of which parent gets primary? I think the courts should award 50/50 custody in every case until a parent is either 1. proven unfit or 2. a parent voluntarily gives up their time.
As someone who grew up with a single mother – meaning that my father was not in the picture at all – it has always been very peculiar and non-sensical to me when I hear divorced people (of either gender) call themselves a single parent. Regardless of the marital status and custody arrangement, if there are two parents involved in your kids lives, you are not a single parent. You are a single person, a divorced person, and a parent – but you are not parenting alone. There’s someone else to share those responsibilities with in one way or another.
No way in H#LL! I see this scenario too often, where men are told to lay down and acquiesce to their ex so that they won’t get slaughtered by sexist and antiquated custody laws against men. If I were married, my ex and I would work something out on the books for our mutual satisfaction, or something will be arranged off the books… This is why I fear coupling up in this current state–it’s too much of an unfair battle.
I will say this, Alex….I do not regret my first marriage BECAUSE I have two marvelous sons as a result. Is the amount of time I get with them ideal? No. But I’m glad I took the chance on that marriage and do not regret getting out of that marriage. It certainly made me grow as a person. What is life if you don’t take a chance on it?
Doug,
This is great stuff. I too left a lot of options on the table due to advice of counsel that said I would lose if I went to court. I’m happy with the arrangement, but I wanted more time with my kids. I do appreciate my time off, and I appreciate the struggle she has with wrestling both kids to school on more mornings. But I pay for that privilege. And the privilege of not seeing my kids as much as I would like.
Thanks for sharing, John. Trust me, I understand that “payment” of not seeing your kids as much as you would like as the result of advice from counsel.