A man wonders if his girlfriend’s newfound interest in vibrators is a reflection upon his ability to please her.
Originally appeared at She Said He Said.
Dear Sexes: My girlfriend has recently said she wanted to try a vibrator. It’s making me very insecure, as it feels like maybe I’m not doing everything for her that she wants. A few things have crossed my mind, but the main concern I’ve had is whether I’m “big” enough for her or not. I’ve never measured myself for an actual size, and she tells me I’m big, but I just don’t know. She certainly has pleasure with me, but I can’t keep from asking, is she thinking of replacing me?
She Said: So you’re out to dinner, you’ve had an amazing meal, maybe some incredible wine, you’re feeling great and so is your girl. Along comes the waiter with the dessert menu, asking, “Would you like some amazing whatever-you-love-cake-and-home-made-something-else-you-love-most-on-the-side?”
And you reply, “You know what? I’ve had enough good. No more good for me. I’m all set on good. More good might mean that the first good thing I ate just wasn’t good enough.”
No! You eat the frickin’ dessert! Because it’s delicious!
Give your girl the dessert, my friend. Feed it to her, bite by bite (if she wants) and watch her love every second of it and think to yourself, I was a part of all this goodness.
Just so you know, you’re not alone in feeling funny about the vibrator. Read here about another guy who felt the same as you, and the fun advice we gave him on how to get over it.
He Said: Hang on. I need a minute to collect myself. I’m still trying to get over the idea that you’ve never measured yourself… Okay, I’m ready to proceed. If I had a dollar for every “my girlfriend just got a vibrator” question, I’d be a rich man! Well, maybe not rich, but I’d definitely have at least thirty-six bucks or so.
I feel like we need to start a partner’s vibrator outreach group, so everyone in this predicament can talk to others in the same situation. Now, let’s get down to business. Just so we’re clear, the word “predicament” was said completely in jest. Your situation is not uncommon, and it’s nothing to freak out about. Regardless, I’m glad you asked.
This is more about communication than vibrators (or size). Your girlfriend could be newly interested in vibrators for numerous reasons, but no machine is gonna replace you, as long as you and your girlfriend are going strong. If your girlfriend “certainly has pleasure” with you, keep doing what you’re already doing. If you’re worried she’s not having enough pleasure, try some new moves, or start a conversation to see if there’s areas you can improve upon. When in doubt, talk it out. There’s no need to buy a penis pump (yet).
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God men are such whiny bitches about their sexual insecurities.
Grow some sack and face it like a man. Get that vibe down there WITH YOUR TONGUE and really blow her mind. Give her her first DP.
Like seriously. Aren’t you guys at least watching porn for some ideas? Reading all the smut site about how to blow her mind?
Seriously!!!!
Don’t men like power tools and get a sense of accomplishment from using them well?
It’s so sad… I fear manhood is doomed if this is what lurks below the surface.
Pathetic.
Wow. Comment of the year.
Absolutely. I don’t go around saying this on the internet, but A) I had to look up “DP”, and B) this commenter has got me turned on. I think I’m going to go have sex with my husband, now. She Said, He Said has just officially improved my marriage.
Yea, why whine when you can belittle?
I’m giving very specific props to this:
“Get that vibe down there WITH YOUR TONGUE and really blow her mind.”
I even just tweeted that @SheSaidHeSaid1
“God men are such whiny bitches about their sexual insecurities.”
=.=
“It’s so sad… I fear manhood is doomed if this is what lurks below the surface.”
Manhood is doomed if being honest about your vulnerabilities ‘lurks below the surface’?
wet, from your posts you seem to be entering a dark-thoughts cycle. are you ok?
i just realised i shouldnt have said anything. wet, if you need to vent, it is better that you keep on venting here. dont bottle it up
Hey Jameseq!
Thanks for noticing. Yeah, I was entering into such a cycle earlier this week seemingly, but I’m on it. Saw Dr. Feelgood about it already.
Thanks for caring!
What would the reaction have been if the comment was: “God women are such whiny bitches about their sexual insecurities?”
I totally agree. I sorta got hung up on that one line and then everything went blurry
EricM
That usually is the tone women get when they complain about mens behavior…
That is certainly not true as the generalization about all men in general, as it was written and as you suggest.
One thing is clear, if a man were to make that statement about women in general, first of all, he and it would be considered hateful and misogynistic and therefore not get past the moderators.
But, even if it did make it through, he and his views would be body-slammed and run out of town as a women hater. But, since it was said about all men in general not women, no objection whatsoever.
That is very telling.
The difference is women admit their faults and men do not, because egos restrict us from seeing things as they really are. Is this against the gender rules for men to say this?
Which is why lesbian relationships never suffer from pig-headed stubbornness…oh wait. lol.
Men and women both let their egos get in the way, and they can both be completely unwilling to admit they are wrong.
That is a big untruth. Women do not let their egos get in the way in relationships. We know that women are not euipped in the same thinking line as men when it comes to me, me, me. But women learn early that men are not open, forthcoming, and may not be faithtful with them. Women are on guard because we know men say they like variety and desire almost every other female that looks good. Women (generally speaking), when they are in a relationship, will have eyes only for that one man. We have been warned about men’s itchiness, and are always wondering when he’ll get tired of us. Women are always asking the man to talk and work on things. Men don’t ask the woman to talk relationship and turn their eyes away from other women and let down pride to make a relationship work. Why don’t we all just admit that men don’t put all into one woman.
“Women do not let their egos get in the way in relationships.”
Try having a relationship with one, lol. Sorry but that just made me chuckle. Women most certainly let their egos get in the way in a relationship…just like men do…just like people do. Egos are difficult things to overcome.
Anyway, as to the rest of your comment, it sounds like you’ve had some bad experiences with men in relationships. You can’t make generalizations, particularly such negative ones, based on personal experiences.
“Men don’t ask the woman to talk relationship and turn their eyes away from other women and let down pride to make a relationship work. Why don’t we all just admit that men don’t put all into one woman.”
UGH. Either you’re living in a dreamland or you are totally lost in the reality of the world, why don’t we all just admit that women don’t put all into one man? How does that sound? Do you honestly believe your misandrist dribble?
Do you think women do not cheat on their men, checkout other men, shame them, have ego problems? Ego problem, women competing with other women on beauty levels when the man is saying enough is enough, you’re beautiful, I love you, yet she doesn’t hear it and still wants to be better better better. Only a fool would think women would never let ego come in the way of their relationships (some women that is, not all).
I can tell you for a fact many men I know are on guard with women, have been used and cheated on before, have trouble trusting women and their intentions. They’ve been warned about “women’s” emotional manipulation, clingyness and controlling behaviour, their physical abuse that society doesn’t even acknowledge much and when it does it’s expected, it’s fine, cuz he deserved it. They’re warned about how they need to earn X amount of money to be a man, they can’t ever earn less than she does, they can never work less than she does, nor show anywhere near as much emotion, they have to be brave and sacrifice themselves to protect her.
These are the messages some of our men are hearing in regards to women and it’s leaving them quite nervous, I know because I am one of the men that has heard it plenty. I do my best to ignore it however, I am hoping that I will find a partner that loves me for me and allows me to be myself without archaic ideals of what a real man is meant to be.
“Women (generally speaking), when they are in a relationship, will have eyes only for that one man.”
AFAIK women cheat as much as men do, and in my own experiences I’ve heard of cheating on both sides of the gender wall plenty. Women (generally speaking), when they are in a relationship, will sometimes have eyes for one man/woman, sometimes have eyes for no man/woman, and sometimes have eyes for a few/a lot of men and women.
“God men are such whiny bitches about their sexual insecurities.”
Now that is the biggest load of projection I’ve seen in years.
Why dont you tell us how you really feel? lol
I see where you are coming from,it seems like so many men can dish it but they can’t take it. There are men who will leave a living breathing woman in bed so he can go the the computer and masturbate. They’ll cut down time with kids so they can spend more time at the computer. Then they’ll have to put themselves on viagra so they can have sex with the wife/gf because they can’t get it up for her anymore (this is happening to young men,too). Browsing online porn is a part time job for some men. Then they will talk about how much they need variety and cant be expected to be satisfied with woman. But yet men will get upset over some plastic…I’m quite baffled.
Because you can’t compare some men with other men. Men that look at porn for a part time job might totally love women using vibrators. Remember that people are individuals and it will become less baffling. If it was a guy who looked at porn a lot and then said his fears of his partner using a vibrator, then it’d be baffling.
Personally I’d like a woman to use on as extra fun in the bedroom, I’d use it on her, I’d even look for toys for me.
“Why dont you tell us how you really feel? lol”
Given your tone why would any man want to? You’d give nothing but ridicule and shaming in response.
There is a reason why men tend to not be very forthcoming about personal and emotional matters. Thankyou for the demonstration.
Gwallan:
That line was actually a response to wet suit one, and it was meant in a joking manner
I guess in this kind of discussion that can easily happen.
Alice that is the truth!!!
Face it pal, she wants MORE! Why else would she suddenly want to bring vibrators into bed? They’ll always tell you that you ‘Rock their world’ and that your’Big enough’. It might not be true, but they’ll always tell you that! Hey, at least she wants to keep you involved. The guy Josie refers to , his women went solo with a giant dildo! Yep, didn’t even invite him to the party!
“The guy Josie refers to , his women went solo with a giant dildo! Yep, didn’t even invite him to the party!”
Alright just to poke at it – do you always have your girlfriend/boyfriend/whatever with you when you masturbate? Didn’t think so.
Heather,if I’m home WITH my wife (like this poor sap was) , There’s no need to “Spank it” by myself!
Heather, as a matter of fact, if we’re both home,there’s no need to “spank it” alone, she’s more than up to taking care of me(and I her).
It’s great you two are so sexually compatible.
I’ll echo what Nick said. Not every couple has such synchronized libidos.
Yeah, over 36 years and still going strong. You see, she was the first woman I ever brought to orgasm, and I was the first man she did the same. We both get as big a thrill bringing each other off as our own ‘Happy Ending’. I actually asked her recently if she wanted a ‘Toy’ in the bedroom( at this age I think we’ve both maybe ‘Lost a little off our fastball’) She said “absolutly not”. She said all she needs are my “Fingers, tounge, and ‘mister happy’ to make her satisfied”. Of course, this made my chest swell with pride. I’ve always lusted after my wife, her body ‘turns me on’. I guess that sounds weird or lame or something, but it’s the truth!
It doesn’t sound lame; it sounds absolutely lovely. I just think it’s important to remember that just because two people love each other and find happiness with each other doesn’t mean that their libidos will sync up. It’s no one’s fault, and it’s not because anyone is failing at the relationship…it’s just that the two people have different sex drives. It happens. Plus, sometimes it’s really just about wanting a bit of variety. Some people prefer more variety in bed…again not because their partner isn’t satisfying them, but just because that’s what they prefer. And again, often when people masturbate it’s not a replacement for sex, but an activity that satisfies different needs than sex does.
That sounds really sweet
@bobbt
You know the best thing about being a grown up? You can buy whatever toys you want.
http://xkcd.com/150/
It is time to find a new girl friend.
Why do you say that?
Automation makes man power redundant.
He can’t vibrate and doesn’t have 16 settings, and is only so big. She evidently wants more than he has, or she wouldn’t have asked. She’s convinced that there is something better than just him alone out there that she’s missing; so, there is no way for him to win this one. He will need to let her have her toys.
If he’s not into porn, he can take this opportunity to start watching it. They both get some variety that way.
“She evidently wants more than he has, or she wouldn’t have asked. She’s convinced that there is something better than just him alone out there that she’s missing.”
No, Eric, not really. The key thing to remember is that a vibrator isn’t necessarily better or something more than having vanilla sex. It is just different to having vaginal intercourse. But then, a blowjob is also different to vaginal intercourse; and missionary position is different to doggy style; and a bit of kink and negotiated power play is different to ‘vanilla’ sex.
So which is better….missionary or doggy? A blowjob or vaginal? A vibrator or vanilla vaginal intercourse? Obviously the answer is that neither of the options in those pairs is inherently ‘better.’ By framing the question like that it creates a false dichotomy…as if wanting one means that you somehow want the other other less. This isn’t the case; sex doesn’t necessarily work like that. Adding variety to your sex life doesn’t mean you are no longer satisfied with what you had been doing in the past; it just means you’re also interested in doing other sexual activities.
It’s a bit like…some people love one kind of dessert, and so they’ll always have that dessert…say chocolate cake. And they’re happy with that, and that’s totally cool. But they just can’t understand why their friend is always getting different desserts…one day it’s vanilla pudding, but another day it’s tiramisu, and then another day it’s mint ice cream…and sometimes it’s also chocolate cake. It’s not that s/he doesn’t like chocolate cake; it’s just that s/he also likes a bunch of other desserts too.
I’m not saying that she’s wrong to want whatever she wants, just that she clearly wants more than he alone can provide. Every other sexual activity or variey you listed, wihtout a single exception, can be done with JUST their two bodies – no one else or machines necessary. Men don’t vibrate at all, let alone in 16 different patterns.
She is wants is a sexual experience that his body is not capable of delivering. Kind of like him saying that he wants a sexual experience involving breasts or a vagina that look or operate in a way that she can’t possibly deliver.
Eric, I don’t think you get it: It’s Not About Him.
It might seem like it’s about him, particularly if you start with the idea that by default he should be the exclusive provider of her sexual satisfaction.
Going with Heather’s dessert analogy…
The market up the street from me has a number of ice cream flavors I love. When I want Moose Tracks or Mint Oreo I buy it at my corner market. But sometimes I’m in the mood for Three Geeks and a Red Head which my corner market doesn’t carry, so I go to my local coöp which does.
My wanting Three Geeks and a Redhead says nothing about how I value:
Moose Tracks
Mint Oreo
The Corner Market
The Coöp
What it does say is that occasionally I like Three Geeks and a Red Head.
Now if I had the view that my corner market should be my exclusive ice cream provider then I might be disappointed with them that they can’t fulfill this need of mine. And I might grow frustrated when they say they can’t provide Three Geeks and a Redhead because their distributor doesn’t carry it. My corner store might feel like our agreement was violated if I decide to go to the coöp for my Three Geeks and a Redhead needs.
I think the model of sexual relationships that says all of your sexual energy should be focussed exclusively on your partner is an unrealistic ideal. It’s one that works when you’re sexually compatible, when your libidos are closely aligned and your sexual temperaments match. But most relationships aren’t like that, and in our exaltation of romantic love we’ve been conditioned to see sexual dissatisfaction as something less than a deal breaker. We’ve also come to view sexual compatibility as a function of frequency, where we measure the ratio between their desires and define a cutoff point.
- He wants it every day, she three times a week = .4285 compatibility factor
- He wants it once every other month, she wants it twice a day = .0167 compatibility
- He wants it three times a week, she wants it twice a week = .6667 compatibility factor
Then we try to figure out what a good cutoff point is and add in some confounding variables. Maybe if they add oral sex on one of the days she’s not interested we can boost the .4285 to .5714 instead, and we decide that an absolute cutoff before your sexual compatibility is somewhere around .2500 or so.
Of course we don’t explicitly think in terms of ratios like this, but the exercise is more or less what we go through in thinking about sexual compatibility. Other considerations, such as the use of toys or pornography, are generally pushed aside and though of in more absolute terms: acceptable or deal breaker. Indeed, it is unfortunately all too common that people view these other sexual behaviors as a form of “cheating,” as if they were another partner. And ultimately I think it’s this view of sexuality that even gives rise to questions like these.
Am I Good Enough is a question rooted firmly in insecurity and ego. The answer is and always should be No. The question is the wrong one to be asking. We should instead ask, “can I be sexually fulfilled with this person? Can they be sexually fulfilled with me?” There needn’t be an assumption that your partner’s body should be the exclusive provider of sexual fulfillment. If I am sexually satisfied by my partner, I’m going to want to help her be sexually satisfied as well. If what she wants is a battery operated toy, what’s the big deal if your needs are being satisfied?
You and I have very similar world views, because I completely agree with this. It’s Not About Him. People have sexual identities outside their primary relationship(s). I am satisfied with my partner, we are very sexually compatible. But I am also my own person, and as an individual I would like to try a new experience. That’s it. I’m not replacing him. I don’t suddenly hate all the things that I love about him or the way he makes me feel in the bedroom and out. All that he is is not suddenly moot now that I have a toy.
“Eric, I don’t think you get it: It’s Not About Him.”
True. She wants something he doesn’t have. Not criticizing that; simply stating a fact.
“It might seem like it’s about him, particularly if you start with the idea that by default he should be the exclusive provider of her sexual satisfaction.”
That’s up to the two of them. If they decide that other sexual outlets (e.g., toys, porn, other people) are OK, that’s their choice.
The dessert analogy applies if she’s blond and with a teenage boyish figure and she approves of him sexually preferring (at times) and regularly watching stacked, buxom women sexually.
“Now if I had the view that my corner market should be my exclusive ice cream provider then I might be disappointed with them that they can’t fulfill this need of mine.”
I get your point. They both should be able to experience the sexual variety – aside from the other if that’s what they want.
“I think the model of sexual relationships that says all of your sexual energy should be focussed exclusively on your partner is an unrealistic ideal. It’s one that works when you’re sexually compatible, when your libidos are closely aligned and your sexual temperaments match.”
If they agree, so be it. It’s up to them.
“If I am sexually satisfied by my partner, I’m going to want to help her be sexually satisfied as well. If what she wants is a battery operated toy, what’s the big deal if your needs are being satisfied?”
Women are far more likely to ojbect to their men seeking, as you say, “sexual satisfaction” via viewing porn than men are to their women using toys. My point here, as I’ve made before, is that if she wants something other than him for sexual pleasure/satisfaction, there shouldn’t/can’t be any objection to him wanting something other than her.
I still not sure you get it. It’s not about him.
It’s not a question of him having it or not, because it has nothing to do with him. He is completely fungible and quite irrelevant to the question. It says nothing about him, and isn’t a comment on him. Except when it does.
When it is about him is when he is being displaced by the toy. Then they have a problem with their relationship.
I don’t know who is more likely to object to what, but my opinion is not gendered in any case. There are toys for boys, and women also like to watch porn. Two men, two women, two gender-queers, what have you, same principle applies.
“I still not sure you get it. It’s not about him.”
You’ve said that many times now. If that’s how you want to look at it. Still, she wants a sexual experience that he can’t provide. Again, I’m not judging, but the facts are the facts.
“It’s not a question of him having it or not”
Now that’s wrong. If he could vibrate in 16 different patterns, she wouldn’t be asking for something that does.
“because it has nothing to do with him.”
In your opinion. But, women often disagree with you.
She wants an experience he can’t give her. Should he feel insecure? No more than if she were to feel insecure if he could only get complete sexual fulfillment by watching porn movies of women who looked very different than her (e.g, much larger and/or perkier breasts, etc). As you have said many times now, it has nothing to do with (her), but women seldom see it that way.
I’m going to try to frame this just ever so slightly differently:
A penis is not a vibrator. You are correct. A penis cannot do what a vibrator can do. Nor can a vagina do what a fleshlight can do. Nor can fingers do what certain pinchy toys can do. Nor can limbs do what ropes can do.
I’m leaving porn out of this particular equation, but I’d say the same thing holds. Filming oneself is not as Olympic as watching adult films.
So a couple can either be all like, “Waaaaaah! My parts aren’t ENOUGH FOR YOU!!!!!” or a couple can be like, “HEY! This tools, toys and tech can make our sex life (alone or together) times 100!!!! AND I love your fingers, mouth, parts and body.
One can go negative and make it “all about them and their insecurities about failing” or one can see sex as an adventure that is fantastic with just the basics and also creative, fun and engaging with extras. “All about US!”
So it is about them in the best way, and it’s not about him in the worst way, and maybe if we could learn to enjoy sex for pleasure and creativity we’d have more fun. Instead of deciding that a toy was a deep symbol or metaphor for how much was missing from the relationship instead of a call to adventure…..well, I think we’d have better sex, better relationships and more awesomeness in general.
I’m not arguing for or against here. Just noting that humans don’t all see things the same way.
However you frame it, she desires a sexual experience that his body is unable to deliver, no matter what he does. Likewise, he might get sexual satisfaction watching in women with physical/sexual characteristics that she no longer has, or never had.
He could be happy that her toys are bringing her satisfaction that he can’t give her rather than feeling insecure, and she could be happy that he is getting sexual pleasure from the visuals that she can’t offer rather than feeling insecure. But, men and women don’t always see it that way.
I think the thing I’m reacting to is the (perceived? Implied?) negative POV about “he can’t provide” “unable to deliver” rather than “let’s add on” “let’s create new”
Same thing, really? Just how you frame it. I’m pretty positive about things and think collaboratively, so when I read your words, I usually reacted with…huh…negative. Doesn’t mean you personally feel that way, just my observation.
It’s not a matter of being positive or negative; it’s simply factual. It considers how people feel. No matter how positive one feels, it’s a fact that he can’t vibrate and his penis size is what it is. He CAN buy her a toy that is bigger than him and does vibrate and maybe give her an experience that he alone can’t provide.
She may no longer have the body of a 25 year old with a perfect body who but she can find some pictures or movies of such, and give him a visual experience that she alone can’t provide. That is factual and also positive.
But, it still may not make people feel good.
I guess so. It’s also a fact that the vibe or porn can’t hug, love, laugh, comfort, share cookies in bed, shower and scrub each other. All of which seem 1000 times more important than can this tech tool run on three settings for 10 minutes.
We have such shame and fear around sexuality is what I’m seeing.
I imagine a woman cooking dinner with a certain set of implements and ingredients. She gets a new tool or spice and her partner gets insecure. That would never happen. Well, actually, now that I think of it, that’s not entirely true. I’ve had heartland relatives get weird on each other when some “foreign” food was introduced.
Fear vs Adventure. I’ll take adventure (even if I’m scared at first).
Julie, there is an assumption at the heart of Eric’s framing that differs from that I believe we share: that where possible he should be the one fulfilling all of her sexual experiences. The way he frames is it such that the only reason she wants a vibrator is because his cock doesn’t vibrate; the only reason she wants melted wax dripped on her breasts is because his saliva isn’t hot enough; the only reason she wants a butt plug while he fucks her is because he doesn’t have two penises to do the job. Therefore because his body is unable to deliver the experience she desires, because he’s not some sort of sexual Inspector Gadget, she must resort to toys and other props.
Eric doesn’t see this as a negative, and I think a facial examination doesn’t show it to be. However experience has taught me that this assumption is more likely to lead to suffering. If you approach sex with the expectation that you are responsible for your partner’s sexual enjoyment, and your partner for yours, you’re going to be terribly disappointed with one of you doesn’t come through. And you’re more likely to view a sex toy as a potential competitor rather than an addition to your sexual relationship.
I’m being a bit polemical here, but I really do think this is at the heart of it. Eric sees it as “factual” without recognizing that even our facts have a frame. I don’t think his frame to be uncommon, but I do think it has considerable downsides. His view is one of sexual pleasure as being primarily relational; when with a partner you should turn first to them to fulfill your sexual needs. That doesn’t sound terrible, yet I come to it from the other direction. I think that when with a partner I should be offering, not expecting. The difference is nuanced but important. It places me in charge of my sexual fulfillment rather than my partner. My partner’s role—and I think Dan Savage sums it up best—is to be good, giving, and game.
None of which is to discount the importance of sexual compatibility. If I have no interest in toys, and my partner is interested in partnered toy use, then our desires are at odds. My argument for how to view the role of toys in a relationship doesn’t suppose that everyone should want to use toys, only that a partner’s interest in them shouldn’t be viewed as an assessment of their satisfaction with you.
Lovely. Well put.
I am not taking a for or against position; simply stating what is true.
“The way he frames is it such that the only reason she wants a vibrator is because his cock doesn’t vibrate;”
If it did vibrate in 16 different patterns and could do everything and anything a vibrator could do, would she want/need one? Only if she wanted to use it alone, which she very well/probably would.
She should swap partners with the couple from, “Why Do Married Men Watch Porn?” The advice she was given is similar: “it’s not about you.” They new couples would probably be more compatible, allowing each to do what they find fulfilling, at least in the area of sex.
So much assumption of fear and insecurities. Sex should be fun. Toys Movies books etc add to the fun. It’s creativity, sexual collaboration, exploration both personally and as a couple.
Wait a minute…sex is supposed to be fun? Crap, looks like I’ve been doing it wrong this whole time.
(kidding)
Oh for fuck’s sake. I’m so tired of this, the “she wants something he can’t provide”. Your job is not to “provide” in sex. You’re buying into the idea that you have to perform and that if she may be interested in something else then you’re “not up to standard”. As if you’re some outdated piece of machinery. YOU ARE SO MUCH MORE THAN THAT. Let the woman enjoy a vibrator. Learn to get over your insecurities.
Can I make this clear enough? Your woman is not dating or married to your penis (or your hands or your mouth). She’s dating YOU. A person. As a whole. By being threatened by a vibrator you’re objectifying yourself and diminishing yourself as a person and as a lover. Please stop! I keep reading comments about how “a vibrator makes manpower redundant” and stuff like that. I am going to say this once: Knock. It. Off. I am so tired of this argument. It just makes me think about how poorly you think of yourself.
And if you’re really worried about “providing” her pleasure (instead of say, engaging in mutual pleasure), then please take comfort that YOU give her things that a vibrator can’t – your warmth, your closeness, all the sexy noises you make. The way you kiss her neck and whisper in her ear about how sexy you think she is.
A vibrator is a different experience, yes. Why is this so threatening? You might be interested in different experiences too – some of you like to cite evolutionary biology to justify why you might want to have sex with another woman, instead of just saying you’d like a new experience. Women have these urges too you know. We aren’t “built to be monogamous” and she is going to want new things too. She’s not straying from you, she’s trying to enjoy some solo time. Wouldn’t you want a woman off YOUR back when you want solo time?
I’m just so sick and tired of this. Please, get over this.
On the one hand I get what your’e saying…on the other hand the lack of empathy in your comment is a bit off putting. I mean yeah, a lot of the problematic ways we discuss sex in our culture is in judging whether it’s successful or not if you can give your partner pleasure. I’d say this is probably particularly true when it comes to straight guys (or lesbian women) giving pleasure to the woman they’re having sex with. For a whole bunch of reasons, our culture views female pleasure in bed to be pretty rare and a pretty big accomplishment, and so we end up placing value on the sexual partners of women based on whether they can give that woman pleasure.
So while I agree that viewing the use of a vibrator as a threat is incorrect, I also acknowledge that it isn’t something that’s out of the blue. Just saying – get over it – doesn’t really address all the cultural dynamics that have created this idea that one partner is supposed to provide all the sexual pleasure for another partner.
“Let the woman enjoy a vibrator. Learn to get over your insecurities.”
Perhaps you didn’t read my comment. I said, “I’m NOT SAYING saying that she’s wrong to want whatever she wants, just that she clearly wants more than he alone can provide.”
No suggestion of being threatened. Get it? Probably not but it’s clear.
If she wants/gets to experience something/one other than him, then he should be able to experience variety he may wish as well. That’s reasonable.
Eric is more correct here. Logically, she wouldn’t need a vibrator if she could have that experience with him. He cannot provide that experience for her. Yet, she wants it. Therefore, he is not enough to fulfill all her desires. That answers the question but doesn’t tie any judgments to it.
Steph seems quick to make it into something about insecurities. Steph recognizes that the women are seeking a different sort of experience than their partner can supply, but then makes it seem like by acknowledging that the man is not enough for her, it somehow is a sign of insecurity or some negative judgment about the woman. It would be much more useful to be open and honest and acknowledge that not all men are sexual Swiss Army knives that can adapt to provide any experience any particular partner desires. Yes, it means he is “not enough for her” but there’s nothing wrong with that.
That should read “a sign of insecurity in the man” in the second paragraph.
My point is that it’s about as relevant as me saying I wouldn’t need dessert if the pizza I was having for dinner were also sweet and made of frozen cream. I’m not judging pizza, it just can’t provide that malted chocolate experience I desire.
Perhaps you missed reading this in the original question: “It’s making me very insecure, as it feels like maybe I’m not doing everything for her that she wants.”
The Letter writer is operating from an either/but model. The pro sex toy people are operation from a both/and model. As in “yes I love what you do to/with me AND I enjoy adding things to OUR pleasure.”
I am “pro-sex toy.” Recognizing that the man (or woman) in a partnership cannot do everything the woman (or man) wants all the time does not attach any judgments. If the other partner wants to use a sex toy, I feel that’s fine. As I said, not everyone has the same level of experience, talent, or physical gifts to be able to satisfy every potential partner. Even if a person has amazing sexual compatibility with one partner, it may not be there with another.
I think the people who are pushing the angle that he is the end-all-be-all are trying to unnaturally and unnecessarily bifurcate a person’s sexuality. On one side are the desires that their partner can’t meet by himself or herself and on the other are the ones their partner can meet by himself or herself. That is silly. Those are ALL a person’s desires and equally valid and it is great that sex toys exist for the potential to have them ALL met.
I regret that the author is stressed that his partner has desires that he cannot meet by himself. It is unrealistic to expect he would be, like I said, a sexual Swiss Army knife. Once we take that pressure off (no pun intended), it might help his insecurities.
Here is my brief analysis of the original poster’s problem:
He says:
“My girlfriend has recently said she wanted to try a vibrator. It’s making me very insecure, as it feels like maybe I’m not doing everything for her that she wants.”
The girlfriend wants to try a vibrator. The purpose of using the vibrator is to stimulate the clitoris to produce orgasm, which is not being achieved by sexual intercourse. Therefore, it is very clear that this gentleman’s performance does not meet the required standard of his girlfriend. It is making him
insecure which is quite natural as a man has to watch over his territory. It is neither his nor her fault, but just a matter of sexual incompatibility.
He says:
“A few things have crossed my mind, but the main concern I’ve had is whether I’m “big” enough for her or not.”
Being big or small, in sexual matters, is really subjective. Big or small, he cannot do much about it except worrying.
He says:
She certainly has pleasure with me, but I can’t keep from asking, is she thinking of replacing me?
He thinks that she has pleasure with him, but that cannot be taken at its face value. I hope he knows that women can fake orgasm. As for replacing him with vibrator, at least, it is not going to happen anytime soon because I hope that he is good at doing other non sexual things for her, so she would probably not completely replace him and have some fun with him for pity sake.
All in all, it is a red flag. If he wants to be treated like pizza, wine or dessert, it is his choice, but if he wants to be treated like a man he make is stand clear to her.
I’m with you up to here.
Whoops, you lost me. No where does he say she doesn’t have orgasms during intercourse. No where does he say she’s communicated in some way that his performance doesn’t meet her standards. He doesn’t say that she’s fucking him less, or that she’s commented on his size being inadequate, or that she turns to the toy to finish herself off after he’s done. All we know is that he said “she wanted to try a vibrator.”
Heck, I want to try the LELO Tor II (not enough to drop $120 on it, mind you). My curiosity and interest says absolutely zero about how I feel about my partner and our sexual relationship. Even if I wanted to try it with her, that doesn’t mean I’m dissatisfied with her or want to replace her. I could be married to Sasha Grey and I’m still going to be interested in trying it out. Some people simply like new experiences, and don’t exclude the use of props in their exploration.
Yeah, no. Her vagina is not his territory.
Only to the extent that you define her wanting a toy and his insecurity about that toy as “sexual incompatibility.”
That’s a bunch of immature nonsense. It’s not a red flag, and our tortured analogies have nothing to do with how he’s being treated. It seems you buy into this idea that her sexual interests are somehow a commentary on his performance. They’re not. And if they are, it can go two ways. Hell, she may finally feel secure enough with him that she feels comfortable revealing this interest, but his insecurity has made him too myopic to see it.
Let’s flip the tables. What if he were into pegging, then what? Is that a reflection on her clitoris not being long enough to penetrate him? Should she be insecure that her genitals don’t compare to the strap-on he wants her to buy?
This
Just to stir things up, what if the guy said he wanted to bring in a third person, a professional female. It’s not that he’s not being fullfilled mind you, it’s just that he wants to experience new things, you know, more vareity. Would his woman be insecure if she were against it? After all, this other person isn’t replaceing her.(by hiring a professional, there’s no enotional attachment) She’s just allowing the 2 of them new experiences.
I’m actually glad you went there, because I think it helps test the consistency of an idea and determine what limits might exist. I’m reminded of Dan Savage who, when describing his idea of GGG, talks about a “kink too far” and gives an example of scat play.
A vibrator represents an imagined threat to the relationship. While it’s within the realm of possibility, it’s very unlikely she’s going to leave her boyfriend for her new silicone friend. Likewise, pornography isn’t a relationship: it doesn’t make you coffee in the morning, it doesn’t appreciate a beautiful sunset with you, and it doesn’t comfort you when you’re sick. However another person can do all of those things.
I think the default expectation for relationships is one of sexual monogamy (although there seems to be some disagreement here). Unless agreed to otherwise, couples expect that exclusivity comes with sexual fidelity. As a result, your example of including another person in the relationship – even if in a strictly transactional nature – is objectionable because it violates that agreement. We don’t typically make such agreements about our fantasy lives, which is why toys and porn aren’t relevant here.
But I think your question gets more at why the monogamous agreement exists in the first place, and whether insecurity might be at the heart of it. One reason we enter into “committed” relationships is to remove the uncertainty around our partner’s intentions. Once a commitment is extracted, we rely on the further promise of sexual monogamy so as to reduce the temptation and likelihood that our partner will renege. There are many reasons why people might prefer monogamy, and while important I don’t believe insecurity is the only one.
In theory, my partner having sex with someone else represents a threat to the commitment we have together should her passions lead her to break our contract. Still I’m not interested in vetoing my partner’s relationships. What is important to me is the commitment we’ve made to each other and the life together we’ve created. Even though she’s made one, I don’t need a monogamous commitment from her. If she’s going to leave with a new lover, I assume she’s going to do it whether we’re monogamous or not, and I trust her to tell me her intentions rather than hide them and cheat on the side. I have no interest in pretending I can control her behavior; I can only ask for honesty and respect and give it back to her in return.
You make a valid argument so let me phrase this another way. Our young man has several thousand dollars just lying around the house (remember, this is all hypotheticial) and decides to purchase a custom built ‘Love Doll’(I know, but I saw a TV show on these and I didn’t know whether to bust out laughing or be grossed out). And let’s say that when it comes time to ‘get off’, he prefers the ‘VIbrating orifices’ of the love doll to his woman. Now, should she feel that she’s being replaced, or shoud she just accept that he’s improving there sex life by introducing new experiences?
I know you posted this to Nick, Mostly but my take on it is this: if anything (porn, toys, scrabble, World of Warcraft, long distance running, a hand) is becoming a substitute (read-never having sex or intimacy) for the actual living partner then the situation needs to be addressed. If the toy, tech, tool, etc is an addition to their sex life and brings folks happiness, there may be no problem at all.
If a person is truly being replaced by anything that’s a problem. The key word would be replaced. Bringing a toy into the bedroom for both to use, does not necessarily indicate “replace.”
I must inquire about the sexuality of scrabble and world of warcraft, clearly I must be missing out! Is there a new 25person raid/orgy?:P:P I wonder what heroic mode is like :O
Hee!
Naw it was only sexual back in vanilla…40-man orgy!
If a toy is bringing her a thrill but not him,then how is not replaceing him? How can it be “Good for them” if she’s the only one enjoying it? Is ‘Their’ enjoyment predicated on ‘Her’ fullfillment? Alot of people (even some with Phd’s in this kind of stuff) Believe this from what I read. They feel that the man should ‘Bring it’ to the woman. Just the thrill of being there is supposed to be enough for us. Actually, if you felt this way, it’s easy to understand how a toy could make you feel inadequite. After all, your ‘A’ game isn’t enough and she needs mechanical help.
Who says he’s not giving her a thrill? We are assuming that because she is being adventurous it’s a commentary on him. He himself admits she receives pleasure from him. How do we know the vibe won’t give him a thrill too? Have you ever experienced a vibe? Or a vibrating sleeve? I hear from expert sources, it feels amazing. How wonderful would it be to have your partner want to give you that pleasure!
Maybe he will get a thrill in using it on/with her. Maybe she will get a thrill using a toy on/with him or knowing he watches something that gears him up for sex with her. You make it sound like his use of the toy on her clit is sheer drudgery. Look at Race’s post below.
Many vibes are quite small and could be used while he’s penetrating her so that both are getting pleasure at the same time. There is imagination to be used here.
Let’s say she has a very very hard time coming. No matter what. No matter with who. No matter the “game.” And she needs direct intense stimulation to come. Should she never come ever so that he feels his A game is enough? What partner wouldn’t want their lover to experience huge pleasure?? I know there are things my partner has wanted that had exceptionally little to do with me per se, but if I could help provide it, his sheer pleasure yes, was wonderful to watch. And mine, his.
This fear of being replaced is so deep. Their enjoyment is predicated on both of them wanting each other to feel pleasure. It’s astonishing to me that the reaction to the idea of toys is “replacement.” The toy can’t talk or love or laugh with her/him. The toy is a fucking TOY. The actual people are for each other in the ways that work best for them. Some people? Never use toys. Some people do. It’s truly not a replacement for a loving human being, it’s a TOY. To play with. Sleeves, ropes, vibes, wax, feathers, lotions, videos, photos, foods, oils, etc and more they are for mutual (and yes sometimes solo) pleasure. Toys. For each. For both.
I really feel as if we are each speaking a completely different language and I can’t help thinking that there is so much fear in place out there.
There is SO MUCH one can do in bed. So many things to bring TO bed with. No one has to use anything. People should communicate and find this stuff out before a serious commitment is in place and all kinds of drama breaks out about the use of a damn porn film or vibrator.
I see this is a result of sex ed in this country that says, DON”T DO IT UNTIL YOU ARE MARRIED. Then do it! And by damn don’t complain if you don’t know how to do it well. It’s like trying to get someone to paint a symphony when you’ve never explained the color wheel, or how a paintbrush works. We grow up thinking we should be experts at sex, and it should be us and only us, and if, god forbid, one member of the duo get brave enough to say…hey I need/want this thing…this would help me feel better, would help me give you more pleasure…hey let’s learn how to… that the other partner then freaks out on them and acts like it’s some grave commentary on their entire relationship when they may not have had the tools to talk about it to begin with!!!!
People ARE insecure about it, I get it. So what can we do to help people feel more secure in their erotic literacy? In their adventuring together? In knowing it’s about mutual compatibility?
What Julie said.
I first learned about the Real Doll™ while watching HBO’s Real Sex one night in my hotel room while ironing my shirt for the next day’s presentation. The way they presented it in the show was as a toy to be shared by both partners and then stuffed in the closet (although I must confess I had distinct “uncanny valley” feelings about it.)
The next time the Real Doll™ crossed my radar was in the movie Lars and the Real Girl where the title character, played by Ryan Gosling, is a socially awkward and somewhat delusional guy who enters a relationship with a doll he purchases over the Internet. He introduces the doll to friends and family and insists they treat “her” as a real person.
Those two vignettes I think illustrate exactly how we should think about these things. If you are using the toy as an enhancement to your relationship, as in the HBO episode, then there is no reason your partner should feel threatened. If, as in your example and in the movie, you are using the toy as a substitute or replacement for your relationship then you have a problem.
As Julie said, the substitute need not be sexual. Anytime you are replacing time spent with your partner with something else it’s going to cause problems in the relationship. Should we feel better that our spouse chooses to watch Mad Men (compared to using a vibrator) over having sex with us? After all, both choices lead to us feeling sexually unfulfilled.
Actually, there are certain times during various weeknights that I realize aren’t the best of times to bother the wife because of what’s on the tube. I accept it , but to tell you the truth, sometimes it does bother me some (coming in second place is no fun) Honestly, if I really persued it, she would relent. But that would be kind of selfish of me.
So….may I ask a few questions here? You mean that there are a few times during the week, when she is getting pleasure out of watching a show she likes. And you would like to make love. So you don’t ask during the show but it makes you feel like coming in second? Does she know you want to make love during that moment? Or are you assuming it would bother her. The use of relent is a strange choice to me. She might happily turn off the tv, or she might say, let’s snuggle up and kiss during commercials and get ourselves worked up…..
Is it a competition to be first all the time? I guess i don’t see things quite like that, more like juggling-life has a lot of balls in the air and sometimes you focus one one more than the other, but it doesn’t mean any of them are less important.
But maybe I’m misinterpreting?
There are lot many things that have been left unsaid in the situation described by the letter writer. Lets see it all over again. The girlfriend wants to try a vibrator. Now what does vibrator do?? It stimulates clitoris to produce orgasm. Under normal circumstances, she would achieve orgasm by having sexual intercourse with letter writer. Why fix it if it ain’t broken??? Why would she want to use vibrator if she is getting orgasm without it. There is lot to be read between the lines. If she is not complaining that does not mean everything is okay. Now by introducing vibrator into the relationship dynamics, she would be creating a competition between the guy and vibrator. Either him or vibrator can be the leader in this competition. If he leads, she would drop it and if he is not as good as the vibrator, he would be slowly cut out. Of course, that would not be too direct or impolite as the girlfriend might have other reasons to keep the guy around. So it is better to take a clear stand now, move out or shut up.
I read the end of this piece and I had an image of the tiny vibrator at the front door of the house, triumphantly shaking a fist, while the woman (devoid of any choice or agency sits at the vibe’s feet, er, base) laughing at the man and saying, “Hahahaha! I win! I will take your woman and we will live in a beach house in Jamaica and drink rum and vibrate late into each evening while you are left here, alone, to ponder your fate.” Which seems impossible considering the vibrator doesn’t have a mouth with which to speak or a fist to shake.
Any “competition” is now between the man and the woman (who is introducing a non living tool of pleasure that the man feels insecure about).
Your response is puzzling to me. I don’t know your sexual history, but you write as if you know very little about the female sexual response and how it works.
This google link will take you to many articles which indicate that approximately 30-35 percent of women orgasm through intercourse alone. Which of course means 70-75 % need some level of clitoral stimulation in order to achieve orgasm. Some women need pronounced stimulation for a lengthy period of time (20 minutes or more), some do not and in fact become completely oversensitive very quickly.
This gorgeous image (which looks a little bit like a Star Trek Enemy Vessel) is a 3D rendering of the internal clitoris (the yellow sections) and shows that it is not just the little nub in front, but extends down the labia and around the vagina. Some women who orgasm through intercourse may receive the right stimulation from that action (and their parts respond more to that action). Some women need the focus on the external shaft.
Here are more links should you wish to look over them.
The woman in question may be a woman who needs pronounced, direct, continuous stimulation of her clitoris. She may not, for whatever reason, orgasm during intercourse, ever. She may wish to have a vibe placed at her clit during intercourse so she can orgasm with her partner during intercourse.
Or, it’s also possible she’s just simply the kind of person who is playful and curious and adventurous about pleasure with her partner and he’s reacting with outdated and antiquated attitudes and beliefs about sex, how it reflects on his prowess.
I hope he can open up a little bit to the world of playfulness and joy there is out there to be had.
And if I were told by a lover that he was in a competition with a vibrator to be the clear leader of the relationship, I’d stifle a laugh, mean as it sounds. Then I’d apologize for the snark, talk to him and find out what was going on. If he told me he was taking a clear stand, moving out or shutting up about me wanting our sex life to be even more delightful? Sad, as I might be, I’d have to accept him moving out to find someone who was more his match. I’d grieve but then look for a partner who shared more of my beliefs about pleasure, sexuality, connection and communication. I’d still wish him well, but I’d also wish he’d catch a clue about things.
What we need is a condom that vibrates, ultra tiny vibrating mechanisms in the condom itself. Now that’d be an interesting sex toy! Get to it scientists!
I read a review of the LELO Tor II that suggested vibrations of adequate strength to accomplish what I think is your goal.
For me it would depend on the individual’s history. If the woman concerned was in the habit of berating men about objectifying women I would call her a hypocrite and walk away immediately for the dildo/vibrator/other phallic device is the ultimate in objectification.
Here’s a question to ask yourself, if your woman wants to try a vibrator:
Do you like to make her cum? Do you love giving her orgasms? Do you love to see that helpless realization of approaching, unstoppable ecstacy on her sweet face?
If you answer yes, go with her to get a vibrator, and learn what feels good to her, and what doesn’t. Stop thinking about the size of your cock, because it isn’t about that, it’s about intimacy and pleasure and delight and ecstacy and orgams and…
you get the picture, I think.
You’d think, right?
For every man who is uncomfortable with his partner wanting to use a vibrator there are 10 women who are uncomfortable with their man watching porn.
Nobody wants to invalidate a woman’s insecurities when she “forbids” her partner to watch porn because she can’t “measure up” to those women depicted. So why do it to a man who is insecure over his partner wanting to use a vibrator?
For the record, I love having “our little friend” available to speed up foreplay or make sex more interesting. Some people have less sexual freedom and are more inhibited. With them, their confidence is more fragile and can easily be rocked when a partner suggests something or uses something that makes them uncomfortable. Be it porn, a vibrator, or even lube. Would you vilify a woman for being insecure if her partner suggests using lube? What if she felt like her body was not sufficient to make sex good? Just like a man with a more fragile sexual confidence might be bothered by a vibrator because it is essentially a phallus, it is a bigger, powerful sexual phallus that represents more pleasure providing prowess than he can offer. Is it terrible for him to feel threatened?
“Nobody wants to invalidate a woman’s insecurities when she “forbids” her partner to watch porn because she can’t “measure up” to those women depicted. So why do it to a man who is insecure over his partner wanting to use a vibrator?”
Well first, no one here is trying to invalidate those insecurities…or rather…we’re sympathetic to those insecurities. We’re just saying that if someone is feeling insecure about their partner opening up their sex lives, it’s not because of something inherently wrong with the vibrator/porn/etc. We’re sort of saying that the way to get over that insecurity is to remember that it’s not about whether your adequate enough for your partner…it’s not about you at all…I’ll point to what Nick’s been saying here.
But secondly, we’re also all in agreement that the same thing applies to porn. It applies to all aspects of sex. I’m sympathetic to someone who feels insecure because their partner wants to use toys/porn/kink/etc, but I also think it’s important for that person to realize where those insecurities come from and to remember that their partner’s use of toys/porn/etc isn’t to do with them. As Nick pointed out, part of the problem is the way we frame relationships – as if one partner is responsible for the sexual pleasure of another partner.
..”if someone is feeling insecure about their partner opening up their sex lives, it’s not because of something inherently wrong with the vibrator/porn/etc ”
I agree entirely. I point to some of the earlier comments from ladies above who consider male sexual insecurity “bitchy” or “whiny”. As to specifically invalidate that feeling. I drew the comparison that many women are insecure about a partner’s use of porn. It is equally wrong to invalidate a woman’s insecurity in the same way. I share your viewpoint that what is more important is getting over those insecurities when they surface, if possible. But that I feel men are expected to be comfortable with all manner of sexual exploration and when they are honest about being intimidated by something sexual their partner wants to try, it is more likely his “manhood” or masculinitiy will be questioned. A woman who expresses discomfort with her male partner’s sexual fetishes is not chastised similarly as a man.
“But that I feel men are expected to be comfortable with all manner of sexual exploration and when they are honest about being intimidated by something sexual their partner wants to try, it is more likely his “manhood” or masculinitiy will be questioned. A woman who expresses discomfort with her male partner’s sexual fetishes is not chastised similarly as a man.”
Personally I think this sort of speaks to the need for a male sexual revolution…or maybe expansion of the queer sexual revolution…or something. I think if men are feeling more pressure to be comfortable with their girlfriends/wives/etc experimenting, it’s probably in part because women are allowed more experimentation than men. And again, if women aren’t chastised as much for being uncomfortable with their male partner’s sexual tastes, it’s partially due to the fact that our society tells us that men have a single sexual taste – penis stimulation + high libido…and any deviation from that is considered weird. So when a woman says – I’m threatened by this non-normative sexual behavior – society says that it’s normal for her to be threatened by it. And when a woman says – I’m threatened by the high libido of my male partner – society says that is also normal, because everyone knows men would prefer to sleep around.
And, I’d like to point out that some of the comments that were calling male sexual insecurity “whiny” were responded to with derision. I think we gotta start from a place of empathy and sympathy and go from there.
A male sexual revolution, what an idea! I can only imagine how that would look.
It’s a good thing to have some insecurity about sex because it is the time where human beings are at their most vulnerable, emotionally and physically. So it’s healthy for that exposure to be met with some degree ot trepidation. And education aside, I believe that our society needs to empower people to have open communication about sex with their partners. That is the best way to overcome the fear, the insecurity and trepidation to work with your lover towards maximizing the sexual experience overall. Do not stifle your desires or seek to tamper the flames of that which stokes your passion for the other.
“I believe that our society needs to empower people to have open communication about sex with their partners.”
Yeah…exactly so. Really when I say a male sexual revolution, I suppose I’m just talking about this right here…and it really applies to everyone. I just think that when we discuss men and sex in the mainstream we often ignore anything beyond discussing whether something is ‘masculine’ or not.
There are women out there who DO feel inadequate if they don’t produce enough lubrication. They internalize sex as a “win” or “lose” scenario.
I’m very very very aware that most of these insecurities and resistance to toys or porn or lube has to do with the absolute lack of a) sex education and good sex ed (how does the body work, what do the parts actually do, the internal clitoris, the prostate, lubrication and etc) and then b) erotic literacy (how to take basic recipes and make masterpieces out of them) all while understanding our mixed US message of sex as a dichotomy of smut/sanctimony hedonism/denial don’t do it/do it all the time, it’s dirty/only do it with one you love causes a huge amount of cognitive dissonance, internalized shame and fear, and an ongoing sense of inadequacy.
So what do we do about it?
(Also, when it comes to porn there is a huge amount of insecurities on the part of partners, yes there is. It’s a multi layered reaction though, and not always just “she’s prettier.” There’s a great deal to do with (well for me at least) how is this porn produced? Is it McNuggets (mass produced, industrialized consumptive model) or is it Locavore (slow food, happy and connected etc). But I’d not ban porn, any more than I’d ban chickens. I just don’t understand how knowing how McNuggets are made, how people eat them.
That’s me personally.)
Also, also, what HeatherN said.
I wasn’t suggesting that the woman in my example had difficulty producing lubrication. Assuming a normal woman with a healthy physical sexual response gets approached by her partner about trying lube, not because the sex is bad without it, but because it could be better. Just like the vibrator thing, the woman is not saying the sex is bad without it, but it could be better with it.
My point is that a normal, healthy woman might be feeling insecure about her body, about her sexual performance and that is perfectly fine. But men also feel that way. Consider this, the man proposes using lube, the woman becomes insecure about her vagina, nobody thinks that is wrong. A woman proposes using a vibrator, the man becomes insecure about his penis, everybody jumps on him for being silly. Just doesn’t add up to me.
I was agreeing with you.
I was also stating that if the man proposes lube, she may feel inadequate. Or if she can’t have multiple orgasms. Or if she can’t come from penetrative sex (watch the movie Orgasm Inc to see the lengths one woman would go to, even though she could have orgasms from manual stim…she felt completely abnormal to the point of surgery. She had NO idea that the majority of women don’t come from penetration).
The biggest issue here to me is that many many many people don’t have info, have a lot of internalized shame, fear, guilt, worry about if they are “good enough, big enough, wet enough” you name it, and it gets in the way of actual pleasure and connection.
No one should be jumping on anyone for the insecurity. We should be jumping on the reasons the insecurities have come to be.
It makes me feel very sad.
Agreed, here, Julie.
I know that, but perhaps got lost in your post a bit and meandered back to redefining my point. We are on the same page I believe.
Cool.
Sorry but for me in my experience when I reached for my first vibe it was because the sex was crap and I wanted to know what an orgasm felt like. I became addicted to it lol my ex at the time got jealous because I used to turn down sex with him then he would catch me DIYing.
Truth was he just wasn’t sexually for me. He was my first and worst lover.
My recent ex was the MAN, I never thought about using a vibrator with him, there was no need, he had everything on point.
The only time I’ll use a vibrator is when I’m single, I’m in a relationship and not getting enough sex or the sex is crap. My ex was very into toys also, he introduced me to DP using toys.
He was the best.
Shame I had to break up with him, the sex was so damn good,
So basically if I have to use a toy when I’m with you and its not being used together its because the sex is not hitting the mark or not enough. Simple as that.
If your on point you won’t see a toy in sight unless you want it there.
With regard to your first BF, if you are turning him down for sex and hitting the vibrator instead, you DID replace him. If he wasn’t compatible with you, you should have kicked him to the curb (gently). If you wanted to keep him, you shoud have communicated your needs and helped him help you, teaching him what worked for you and experimenting. You certainly dished out a cruel punishment on that man. What did he do to deserve it?
If I may share my experience…
First, while I don’t buy that a person is responsible for another person’s pleasure, I admit I am a victim of that socialization. I WANT to be the ultimate provider of my partner’s sexual satisfaction, if that is possible. I get off hearing the moans of pleasure I elicit from a woman, seeing that pleasure reflected in her eyes. It is my ambrosia, my aphrodediac. And I am not even normative (at least not according to Clarisse Thorne, who thinks male normative is a CIS straight male with a big dick). I may be CIS straight male, but I have a very median sized cock. In this climate, an easy source of anxiety and insecurity.
Of course, I know that my GF uses a vibrator when I’m not around. She has alwasy been open and frank about it. She uses the fucking Hitachi Wand. I say fucking Hitachi, and will continue to do so, as it is the Cadillac of vibrators.
No woman here has talked about the fucking Hitachi yet. From what I understand, NO MAN can match the fucking Hitachi. You can have an 18″ baseball bat dangling between your legs, and you won’t hear the guttural noises of raw pleasure that are involuntarily ripped from your girl’s throat when the fucking Hitachi goes down and licks her pussy. The fucking Hitachi is so powerful, it can give a woman a G-spot orgasm from OUTSIDE. My GF even had a triple using the fucking Hitachi, stimulating her pussy, not her ass – a feat we had attempted without toys, but failed. (Triple = clitoral, vaginal, and anal orgasms simultaneously). If anyone thinks that a vibrating schlong can be threatening or emasculating, wait until your girl discovers the fucking Hitachi.
In any event, my GF and I do not get to be together nearly as much as either one of us would like, due to life commitments. As a result, I simply have not yet had enough time to get my groove on. I know that I please her – very well in fact. She has great orgasms with me most of the time, toe curling, joint cracking orgasms, with exclamations bubbling from her lips without volition. I once gave her an orgasm using nothing but oral stimulation, a feat she previously thought impossile. But even so, for various other reasons I haven’t had the time with her yet to build enough successes to really be confident that I know my woman and how to please her, whenever I want, or whenever she wants, at the drop of a hat.
So her bold move to introduce the Hitachi to our fun last weekend was too soon. It was her idea, and I love her for the trust that she showed in believing I was ready to handle it. And I did handle it, for a bit. She showed me where to put it on her, and guided my hand till I was the only one holding it. I was permitted to be the architect of her ecstasy in that moment. But the noises she made – they were visceral and primal. More so than any I had caused her to make in all the time we were together. I wanted to be able to make her make those noises, with no toy or artificial aid. Me and my tongue and my hands and my cock. And I haven’t yet. Now I know that it is unlikely I ever will – the fucking Hitachi is, after all, the fucking Hitachi. It was really, really hard.
I made it through the event, though, and she was none the wiser – mostly because a large part of me was genuinely happy to see her pleasure. But the next evening the topic came up and I divulged my insecurity, my slight jealousy of the fucking Hitachi for being able to make her moan in ways I couldn’t make her moan. That was almost a relationship cracking revelation. She was floored. It never occured to her that I wasn’t strong enough to share that experience with her, that I was just like “other men” whose egos outweighed their trust in their partner’s love and fidelity. She was crushed that I could be jealous of a toy, and what that implied about how I felt about her and about myself. In short, she piled more shame onto me about being weak, over and above what I was already feeling. The balance of the weekend, a getaway vacation, went badly.
So, how does one get past this need to be the best and ultimate architect of their spouse’s sexual pleasure? As it has been pointed out, this is not only a biological imperative, but socialized into men as well. I can’t complain that she masturbates in secret or turns me down in favour of her toys – it ain’t so. Nonetheless, the fucking Hitachi has put me in my place – I am not the ultimate orgasm maker and it is unlikely that I ever will be. The question is, how do I divorce myself from the need to be that?
If I may share my experience…
First, while I don’t buy that a person is responsible for another person’s pleasure, I admit I am a victim of that socialization. I WANT to be the ultimate provider of my partner’s sexual satisfaction, if that is possible. I get off hearing the moans of pleasure I elicit from a woman, seeing that pleasure reflected in her eyes. It is my ambrosia, my aphrodediac. And I am as close to normative as one can get. (Though not according to Clarisse Thorne, who thinks male normative is a CIS straight male with a big dick. I may be CIS straight male, but I have a very median sized cock. In this climate, an easy source of anxiety and insecurity.)
Of course, I know that my GF uses a vibrator when I’m not around. She has alwasy been open and frank about it. She uses the f*cking Hitachi Wand. I say f*cking Hitachi, and will continue to do so, as it is the Cadillac of vibrators.
No woman here has talked about the f*cking Hitachi yet. From what I understand, NO MAN can match the f*cking Hitachi. You can have an 18″ baseball bat dangling between your legs, and you won’t hear the guttural noises of raw pleasure that are involuntarily ripped from your girl’s throat when the f*cking Hitachi goes down and licks her pussy. The f*cking Hitachi is so powerful, it can give a woman a G-spot orgasm from EXTERNAL stimulation of the clit and surrounding area. My GF even had a triple using the f*cking Hitachi, stimulating her pussy, not her ass – a feat we had attempted once without toys, but failed. (Triple = clitoral, vaginal, and anal orgasms simultaneously). If anyone thinks that a vibrating schlong can be threatening or emasculating, wait until your girl discovers the f*cking Hitachi.
In any event, my GF and I do not get to be together nearly as much as either one of us would like, due to life commitments. As a result, I simply have not yet had enough time to get my groove on. I know that I please her – very well in fact. She has great orgasms with me most of the time, toe curling, joint cracking orgasms, with exclamations bubbling from her lips without volition. I once gave her an orgasm using nothing but oral stimulation, a feat she previously thought impossile. But even so, for various other reasons I haven’t had the time with her yet to build enough successes to really be confident that I know my woman and how to please her, whenever I want, or whenever she wants, at the drop of a hat.
So her bold move to introduce the f*cking Hitachi to our fun last weekend was too soon. It was her idea, and I love her for the trust that she showed in believing I was ready to handle it. And I did handle it, for a bit. She showed me where to put it on her, and guided my hand till I was the only one holding it. I was permitted to be the architect of her ecstasy in that moment. But the noises she made – they were visceral and primal. More so than any I had caused her to make in all the time we were together. I wanted to be able to make her make those noises, with no toy or artificial aid. Me and my tongue and my hands and my cock. And I haven’t yet. Now I know that it is unlikely I ever will – the f*cking Hitachi is, after all, the f*cking Hitachi. It was an enormously difficult thing to discover.
I made it through the event, though, and she was none the wiser – mostly because a large part of me was genuinely happy to see her pleasure. But the next evening the topic came up and I divulged my insecurity, my slight jealousy of the f*cking Hitachi for being able to make her moan in ways I couldn’t make her moan. That was almost a relationship cracking revelation. She was floored. It never occured to her that I wasn’t strong enough to share that experience with her, that I was just like “other men” whose egos outweighed their trust in their partner’s love and fidelity. She was crushed that I could be jealous of a toy, and what that implied about how I felt about her and about myself. In short, she piled more shame onto me about being weak, over and above what I was already feeling. The balance of the weekend, a getaway vacation, went badly.
So, how does one get past this need to be the best and ultimate architect of their spouse’s sexual pleasure? As it has been pointed out, this is not only a biological imperative to be the chest pounding alpha male with the best mating potential, but it is socialized into men as well. I can’t complain that she masturbates in secret or turns me down in favour of her toys – it ain’t so. Nonetheless, the f*cking Hitachi has put me in my place – I am not the ultimate orgasm maker and it is unlikely that I ever will be. The question is, how do I divorce myself from the need to be that?
“The question is, how do I divorce myself from the need to be that?”
Either divorce yourself of the notion, or find someone else. But, what you can do is be sure to take out the trash every single day and keep a good job. The Hitachi refuses to do those things.
She’s hopefully interested in you for more than just sex. It’s the same issue/argument some women have against porn viewing. Although, neither porn nor toys can replace a human, the other party may feel that replaced, or that they can’t compete.
Take out the trash? She doesn’t require the Hitachi to do that or to hold down a job, so why does it get to be the ultimate orgasmic tool? I want the job.
Your argument is ridiculous. I know she is interested in me for more than sex, and vice versa. The problem is sexual though. Those other things don’t matter in the least. When was the last time your wife dropped moaning to the floor, eyes rolled back into her head, ejaculate spraying the walls just because you fixed the leaky faucet in the kitchen. I cook the meal and take out the trash, she washes the dishes. She gives me mind-blowing orgasms without the use of a toy, I give her mind-blowing orgasms without the use of the toy. Is that so much to ask for?
Your post is worse than no post – it reinforces the issue, it doesn’t help solve it. How do I stop caring about being her most orgasmic tool without stopping caring about sexual fulfillment with this woman that I love to death and lust for madly?
Stop making it about you. What’s wrong with just being happy for her? What if the tables were turned? Men with toys and women with porn seem to always want everything to revolve totally around them rather than being happy (as you mentioned) that someone they care is having a great time. If the emotional part is good, and you can still have a good time together, be glad that she gets to take it to another level of enjoyment.
To the point, your reply seems to reduce to “You’re a man and men are not allowed to expect anyone to sympathize with their insecurities, let alone help you solve them. Suck it up, Princess!”
Eric, sorry about the spleen. Your point takes me right back where I started. I have no intention of going anywhere. I love this girl and I lust for her like no-one I have ever known. My problem is the one so many men have – the need to be the best lover she’s ever known, to please her better than anyone or anything can. Part socialization, part personal aphrodesiac.
But that doesn’t change thef fundamental question… HOW do I divorce myself from this need to be her most orgasmic tool? Or how can I determine/believe that in most contexts I AM her most orgasmic tool, just not all the time?
(BTW, porn to a man is not analagous to a vibrator to a woman, as many have posted. Many women enjoy porn to warm up too, but it doesn’t get them off, any more than porn gets most men off. Porn primes the urges, the man has to spank his monkey or do deep meditation to get off – the porn doesn’t usually do it alone. The only analogue to the Hitachi would be a toy for men that gave such pleasure that a woman COULD NOT DUPLICATE the sensations. I know of no such toy for men’s pleasure. Do you?)
ICMan, some things in life must simply be accepted. Unless and until you can train yourself to vibrate at that frequency and intensity, you simply won’t be able to compete on a purely physical level. However, what you aren’t appreciating is that in human relationships the purely physical is only part of the story. Human relationships are much richer overall and more fulfilling than anything a toy, picture, or video can ever accomplish. That is what people with major objections to porn and toys don’t quite grasp.
There is no such toy for men; if there were, they would be buying them by the millions. The true analogous situation is men’s use of porn. If you’ve read comments here, you have read that many women object to their husband’s viewing porn for the very same reasons you have trouble with her use of toys – THEY want to be the end-all, be-all for him, not having to compete with something that can’t truly compete with – or so they feel.
Bottom line, no machine, picture, or video can do what a human can. That’s what you need to remember.
I don’t know how you get beyond that need, since it’s all in your head. That’s not meant as a put down, rather that what you’re dealing with is an expectation of your own making.
You should remember that there are two components to sexual pleasure, the physical and the mental. Sure, the Hitachi works wonders for some people, but it can’t talk dirty to her, and it doesn’t respond to her excitement. There’s so many places you could go with it, if you’re able to reorient it in your mind from “competitor” to “prop.” Unleash your imagination and you might find that its addition takes your sexual enjoyment to the next level for the both of you.
Thank you, Nick. That is the direction I am trying to head with my heart and mind, and your words are encouraging.
Try watch porn whilst having sex with her, see if she can understand how artificial outside stimulation can make someone feel lesser. It’s not a perfect analogy but it’s one that can work. Porn is visual stimulus, hitachi is physical. Until we get awesome robotic oral, vaginal or anal style devices to play with that vibrate, are warm and wet then we probably won’t have anything close to what women can get.
The big problem is if she is turning you down in favour of the toys, that’s a problem women who disagree with their men’s porn usage have in common. You CAN and DO have the right to complain if she is going to the hitachi instead of you, you’re being rejected for outside stimulation and you have every right to be angry n hurt. You both need to communicate on this matter n discuss the pro’s n cons, why it bothers you, both need to find a common ground of understanding or that rift will get bigger n bigger. But if she wants to be selfish in the manner then I dunno what to say to you….
“I am not the ultimate orgasm maker and it is unlikely that I ever will be. The question is, how do I divorce myself from the need to be that?”
Penetration alone doesn’t always give women orgasms, and many don’t get any orgasms except from clitoral stimulation from what I hear. You don’t NEED to be the ultimate orgasm maker though, if men had the equivalent of a hitachi she probably wouldn’t be your ultimorgasmer. Does she still love you? Do you both still have good sex? Do you make her feel the feelings of love? Something no toy can replace? Ask her how she would feel if you had something which gave you better sex and you used it, would she be ok with you using a sex robot if they existed. Hell tell her that it feels like she is cheating with a toy because she’s neglecting you in favour of her own, selfish needs. Maybe try use the hitachi a bit during sex but not go overboard with it, not let it dominate the bedroom?
I’m a little confused, Archy. Your advice seems to advocate having empathy for one another – something I agree with – but also suggest adversarial tactics to get there. Shouldn’t we aspire to move away from tactics that make ourselves and our partners feel bad, towards those that encourage and promote understanding?
Some adversarial tactics are for understanding though. Eg to ask her how she’d feel if he looked at porn during sex with her, bringing outside stimulation into the bedroom if she cannot understand. It’s best to find positive ways to handle a situation but if that fails maybe the more negative ones could help if they open her eyes? Either way these are potential ideas, pick n choose which you want to try, I’m just sounding off a bunch of random ideas that may or may not work.
Sorry about the (mostly) double post. Apparently a post can appear and disappear from the thread during the moderator review period and when I could no longer see the post with the “being moderated” caveat, I mistakenly thought that it had not gotten past the moderator because I used the word “fucking” so many times. So I put up the second (slightly modified/updated) post in the interrim. Apologies for any confusion.