Scott Behson doesn’t see the advancement of women as the degradation of men, and he thinks framing it that way is dangerous.
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In many ways 2013 was a banner year for valuing fatherhood and raising awareness of fathers’ work-family issues. But as the year ended, we had to endure one last bit of denigration.
On December 30th, 2013, Hanna Rosin wrote an appalling column on Time.com entitled “Men Are Obsolete” (this was a companion piece to Camille Paglia’s recent Time magazine essay defending men from claims of obsolescence). Why not? After all, stirring the pot as a gender-issues troll has been great business for her- her similarly appalling book “The End of Men” was a runaway bestseller.
And if you want controversy, Rosin certainly can deliver. She begins by stating that men are obsolete because men feel “entitled to power, destined for leadership, arrogant, confused by anything that isn’t them”, using crackhead Toronto mayor John Ford as the exemplar of men worldwide.
She then hedges that men aren’t fully obsolete because “we haven’t figured out a way to harvest sperm without them being, you know, alive”. Ok so we have that whole propagation of the species thing going for us, but besides that, we’re inferior and unnecessary. Also, she says men should take heart that, “Obsolete does not mean worthless. It means outmoded. The twin combustion engine made the bicycle obsolete but that doesn’t mean we hate the bicycle.”
Rosin then clicks off the reasons men are obsolete:
1. Women are doing better at school and advancing at the workplace
Funny, I see this as a triumph of equal opportunity and don’t have to frame one gender’s accomplishments as a failure by the other.
2. The traditional household with a male breadwinner is vanishing
IMO, the more progress women make in the workplace, the better, as this can open up opportunity for fathers to become more involved at home- something to which most dads aspire. I see this as win-win. Rosin, typically, sees everything as win-lose (it helps her sell books).
Rosin cites the 2013 Pew Study’s 40% female breadwinner number in making her argument. However, as I explained here, this statistic is extremely misleading (30 seconds looking at the Pew Study would clear up all confusion, but what “journalist” or “editor” has time for that?). One can only get to 40% by cobbling together the 11% never-married single mother households, the 14% single-mother-divorced households and the 15% of dual-parent households with female breadwinners. These are kinda three separate groups, no?
In short, only 15% of two-parent families and 22.5% of dual-income families have the wife as the primary earner. Men obsolete? Hardly. And even if men were no longer the primary wage earners, why would we be any less worthy of dignity?
3. Because working-class men were hit particularly hard by the Great Recession
Again, Rosin implies men are only worthy of respect if they earn money, but then celebrates that women are displacing men as wage-earners. But who cares when one can poke fun at men who lost their manufacturing and construction jobs? Nothing goes with structural long-term unemployment like a dollop of condescension. I bet Rosin’s taxi-driver father thinks this is hilarious.
4. Men have lost their monopoly on aggression and violence
I don’t know where to begin on this doozy. Would Rosin celebrate more aggression and violence on the part of men? Using the insane women on Real Housewives of New Jersey as a positive example of assertiveness? Really?
The fact that women are more assertive and can now serve in combat roles does nothing to diminish men. Let’s just move along.
5. Men now shave body hair
Yep. This is the level of discourse.
Rosin concludes by talking about her son (poor guy, I can imagine the conversations at home “Good night, you obsolete member of the lesser gender. I love you”). She states she hopes he lives in a world in which he can succeed in a variety of roles, including doing things she considers un-masculine- so that “if he chooses to take his kids to a playground at 3 in the afternoon on a Tuesday, no one will look at him funny, no one will wonder if he’s out of work, no one will think, ‘What a loser’.”
So, I guess Rosin and I agree that being an involved dad and thinking flexibly about careers are things to which men should aspire, and things that society needs to embrace. We’ll get to this place much sooner if women and men see this as something we need to work together on instead of tearing each other down.
After all, to make progress in almost any societal challenge, including work-family balance, the advancement of the full range of both men’s and women’s opportunities at work and at home is required. I am amazed that someone as obviously smart at Hanna Rosin doesn’t see that her writing is actually getting in the way of this progress.
What do you think about “The End of Men”? Let’s discuss in the comments section.
Lead photo: Flickr/garryknight
How about this to be different ,take that B.S. Book of hers and everyone put them in pile burn them! For Gods sake the woman sounds like Hitler! Please stop giving her press and let her go away! We as men are not obsolete and never will be! Men (especially manly) will always be! These feminists can get over it!
I think this is a knee-jerk response to the article; she uses provokative language but actually what she’s acknowledging is that men have lost their position of privilege. She’s actually announcing the gender war is over; she’s making a good case against misandryist feminism, not an argument in favour of it. Furthermore you bring up the bicycle analogy but you miss the quote that follows it: “We can keep whatever we like about manhood but adjust the parts of the definition that are keeping men back.” – well isn’t that exactly what we’ve been reading articles about on these very… Read more »
Hi Joseph- This was a very considered article that I wrote after a full week of contemplation on Rosin’s original piece.
As with Alistair, I will agree with you that what Rosin may be trying to articulate is the demise of unearned male privilege (which is an important point and one I’d love to see her articulate plainly). However, this is NOT what she actually writes, and it is not the reader’s job to look between and beyond a writer’s words to find and defend unstated presumed meaning.
As a newcomer to this site and a female feminist, I must say I am enjoying it immensely. A big thanks to the authors and many who comment so eloquently and thoughtfully.
Hi Martha- Welcome to GMP!!!
Sometimes Hanna Rosin is right, but for reasons that she does not see. Take for instance the crisis in higher education. Rosin only examines the discrepancy between men and women. Andrew Smiler pointed out in another article that the rate of men attending college hasn’t decreased. The rate of women attending college has increased to the point that it’s much greater than men. This was supposed to mean that there is no problem. I disagree. That presupposes that condition though favorable to men as it relates to women were also ideal for men and the men couldn’t or shouldn’t reach… Read more »
I think there are a lot of feminists who subscribe to this type of negative doctrine. I believe feminism is a necessary and positive movement in our social evolution. But like all movements of social justice, it has been subject to expropriation by weak and selfish human psychology. In its best sense, feminism demands equality of opportunity so that women may be allowed to reach their full potential alongside men for their own well-being. In its worst sense, though, feminism has been used as a justification for resentment and bitterness, and as an excuse for personal failures and shortcomings. And,… Read more »
Your last paragraph is perfect.
“We haven’t figured out a way to harvest sperm without them being, you know, alive.” We HAVE to do the gender flip test here. Switch the goose and the gander and hear what that sounds like. Imagine (just IMAGINE!) if a well-known male author made a similar statement about women and their wombs. “If only women didn’t need to be alive for us to have children.” That sounds totally reprehensible to me, not funny in the slightest. Would women really laugh that off the way that men are expected to laugh off Rosin’s comment? This sounds to me like one… Read more »
The piece originates from an opening statement in a formal debate in defence of the proposition “Resolved: Men Are Obsolete” (look at the comment at the bottom of the article), a proposition that Rosin probably didn’t choose herself but was assigned to argue. The statement that she makes about men and sperm would have been delivered as a humorous or tongue in cheek remark within the playful agonism of the debate context. There is no reason to believe that Rosin takes that view seriously. Those who think that she does probably need to attend a few more formal debates. The… Read more »
She then hedges that men aren’t fully obsolete because “we haven’t figured out a way to harvest sperm without them being, you know, alive”.
That little glitch can quite effectively be dealt with by freeing yourself from the mindset that you need to procreate…
Hah!!!!
But then human civilization ends in 70 or so years!
You say that like it’s a bad thing….
yes….
Well done, Scott! It reminds me of Freire’s assertion that the oppressed, once liberated, will become the oppressor. Rosin exemplifies this by essentially acting like the female equivalent of Don Draper with arguments held together by the thinnest plausible threads.
The logical fallacies in Rosin’s thinking are indeed huge. Thanks for reading and your comment Josh!
As a woman, mother, and psychologist (who happens to work primarily with adult males at this point), I applaud your response. I have long been disgusted by those who view men as inferior, less than, less intelligent, less important etc than women. Other articles and blogs have noted the way in which men are portrayed in current sitcoms and commercials (honestly, often as stupid bumbling idiots who need their wives to fix things for them), and working in academia for at least part of my career, I can say that the number of women who act, think, and talk as… Read more »
Hi Karen- Thank you for reading and your thoughtful response.
The natural consequence of women’s advancement in areas they were previously held back from should be:
a) celebration
b) a recognition that this means men are now freed to succeed in areas from which they were previously held back
I’s amazing to me how many smart people don’t get this.
Well the point is, if men are obsolete….then so are women. *smile*
Exactly! We’re in this thing together.
To be honest, I doesn’t always feel like we are “in this thing together”.
Call me a downer, but the reality is that no particular person is indispensible. No person is actually necessary. Our “needs” for each other are frequently overstated. Whatever value we place on ourselves has to be something more than “being useful” or “not being obsolete.”
I hear what you are saying. And certainly half the populations can’t be obsolete!
Credit where credit is due, Rosin’s piece is a successful attempt at trolling (and I have a lot more respect than most for ideological trolls who recognize and push cultural buttons, even when their claims are ridiculous, as in this case). I think that those who respond too sensitively to such a piece miss its element of playfulness and the fact that the meaning of the term ‘men’ is heavily stipulated at the outset.
I disagree about respecting trolls, even highly successful ones. If Rosin does not *really* mean that *all* men are obsolete, etc., she should qualify her statements (of course, she just laughs all the way to the bank).
I also like to use the “reverse-gender-BS-language test” what if there were an equivalent piece with the genders reversed- a book deal? Time magazine?
She does qualify her statements: “Are men literally obsolete? Of course not, and if we had to prove that we could never win. For one thing, we haven’t figured out a way to harvest sperm without them being, you know, alive. But in order to win this debate we have to prove that men, quote unquote, as we’ve historically come to define them — entitled to power, destined for leadership, arrogant, confused by anything that isn’t them. As in: “I don’t understand. Is it a guy dressed up like a girl? Or a girl dressed up like a guy?” They… Read more »
Like your argument, most Rosin defenders say some variation of:
“Well she doesn’t literally mean ALL men, or THE END or OBSOLETE. Her meaning is more subtle”
To this, I say, she is a very talented professional writer, and the editor of Slate’s XX blog. She is more than capable of articulating her thoughts by herself. And she says men are obsolete, and are lesser. She’s very clear.
Sorry, Scott, you aren’t convincing me here. Rosin is participating in a debate and is defending a bold thesis, not necessarily one of her own choosing. By ‘debate’ I am not merely referring to the more general sense of the word, but to a formal debate. Take a look beneath the article: “Adapted from her opening statement at the Munk Debate, “Resolved: Men Are Obsolete,” held in Toronto.” In defending this thesis, which she probably didn’t choose herself, she begins by qualifying her terms heavily, as I quoted in my earlier comment. Repurposing this piece for a more general audience… Read more »
I really enjoy debate, much like the one we are having! I just don’t agree with you that it is the responsibility of the readers of Rosin’s piece to read between the lines for a more charitable reading. The writer’s job is to be precise. Also, I can’t imagine the Munk Debate- for which Rosin was handsomely paid and was conducted in front of a large paying audience- randomly assigned people positions as if this were the high school debate team. Rosin’s really smart and a grown woman who knew very well what she said, and was well in control… Read more »
She wouldn’t have been randomly assigned to a side, but she may not have chosen the precise proposition—’men are obsolete’—that she was being expected to defend (just as many authors don’t get to choose the titles of their books or articles, in which their claims are sensationalized by publishers).
I do find things like the “Men Are Obsolete” harmful but this is just a small fraction of feminists right and other feminists refute this stuff right? The best selling bit is just because its controversial right?
I hope and think you are correct. Ultimately, we’re all in this together, and I think most men and women understand this.
I think it helps to remember sometimes that “bestselling” doesn’t necessarily mean “dominant viewpoint.” Most people buy books before they read them, so whether or not they agree with a single word in the book after reading it, their purchase still bumps that title up the list. I made the same argument for 50 Shades of Grey. When that erupted, along came all these assertions that “Wow, this book sells really well, it must mean all women secretly desire BDSM-type activity in the bedroom.” Never mind the women who bought it (maybe out of curiosity, or for a book club,… Read more »
Her titles and headlines are very provocative- great for selling books/generating interest. I agree that people come for the hook, but they stay (or not) based on content.
However, rosin is an influential person, too, and such loose language diminishes her other work and the work of most who advocate for gender equality.
KKZ, that’s a great point between “bestselling” and “dominant viewpoint”. I know for myself that I bought 50 Shades of Grey and HATED it. And I know a few women who did the same.
Good article! One small mistake. Toronto’s mayor is Rob Ford, not John Ford.
eeep! I’ll try to get this corrected.
Great rebuttal! I share your sentiments to the letter. I am a part time freelance working dad with a very hard working full time employed wife. We have two beautiful daughters. I am so proud of my wife and I am also very proud of the life we lead. I do most of the cooking, picking up after the kids, vacuuming etc. I take our girls for long nature walks and talk to them about art. My wife appreciates the sensitivity that our children are learning from their father. I hope when they choose a life partner they will look… Read more »
Hi Duncan- Thank you for this awesome reply. It hurts all of us when people are forced into narrow classifications. I think most men (and women) have many different sides to them, and we’d be better off if society encouraged these many facets, instead of doing what Rosin does.
Great response, Scott. I suppose it was only a matter of time before the advancement of women in the workplace progressed to all out misandry – the female equivalent of misogyny. What’s so great about a woman that acts like a man? Whatever acting like a man is.
I wouldn’t go that far. I think Rosin is far more strident than most.