Men being humiliated and arrested for taking up too much room on the subway is a strange form of patriarchal privilege.
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This week “manspreading” surfaced once again from the depths of Tumblr to make one of its now regular appearances in the mainstream media, after two men in New York were arrested for taking up too much room on the subway, where this allegedly gendered behaviour has reportedly (and incredibly) been made an offence.
Anyone who has a passing familiarity with the pop-cultural discussion of gender that takes place on Twitter and in online organs such as Jezebel and The Huffington Post, will a) know what “manspreading” is supposed to represent and b) know exactly where they stand (or sit) on the issue.
For my part, it strikes me that if men can not only be publicly humiliated by women for the way they sit on public transport, but arrested for it as well, then it’s a very strange form of Patriarchal privilege indeed that they are apparently enjoying.
Almost without fail during the six months I made the commute, at least once during the two-way journey, I would see a man either offer to give up a seat he was sitting on for a perfectly able-bodied woman or allow a woman to sit down.
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But the dodgy ideological reasoning behind stigmatising men for the way they sit has been raked over plenty of times already. What I want to write about is the gulf between the alleged scourge of men sitting legs akimbo on the tube, and the behaviour of men that I actually witness on a daily basis while travelling on public transport in London.
I mainly take the bus at the moment, where for some reason “manspreading” is less forensically monitored by the Tumblerettes who post sneakily-taken phone images (creepy objectification anyone?) on their “Men Taking Up Too Much Space on the Train” blog. But during six months last year I commuted on the overground train that runs between east London and west London.
The train is packed at rush hour and you would routinely find yourself standing for the full 50-minute journey. Almost without fail during the six months I made the commute, at least once during the two-way journey I would see a man either offer to give up a seat he was sitting on for a perfectly able-bodied woman, or demure to allow a woman to sit down if there was some confusion as to who had got to the seat first.
Occasionally a woman would politely refuse, but in the majority of instances she would smile with gratitude and happily take the seat to avoid standing for the best part of an hour.
Benevolent sexism?
Now, you might argue this is a form of “benevolent sexism,” in which these men don’t think women are strong enough to stand on their own two feet. Granted, occasionally there would be something a bit patronising in the exchange, but far more often it appeared to me that the man offering his seat was doing so out of a sense of the etiquette that he knew was expected of him. More importantly though, in the instances when there was uncertainty as to who got to the seat first, there was the unspoken weight of shame he would be subjected to as a man for “stealing” a seat from a woman.
Whether you agree with this gendered role play or not, what it certainly doesn’t show is that these men hold an inherent sense of entitlement over public space.
Of course it’s not particularly surprising that we don’t hear about men’s daily small acts of random kindness – no news is good news, after all. But what is a problem, is if the constantly-repeated negative messages about men start to become ingrained in our preconceptions about them.
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But the point I really want to make here is that I’ve never seen so much as a tweet or a Facebook post to acknowledge this small, but en-mass, daily display of self-sacrifice by men. Spend a day travelling on the tube in London and I guarantee you’ll see a man give up his seat, you’ll probably also see a man help a woman carry her pram up an escalator, or help another with her luggage.
But if you were to take your assumptions about how men use public space solely from the virtual world of social media and online commentary, you’d be forgiven for assuming that all men do is lounge and leer their way through the subways and streets of London and New York.
Of course it’s not particularly surprising that we don’t hear about men’s daily small acts of random kindness—no news is good news, after all. But what is a problem is if the constantly-repeated negative messages about men start to become ingrained in our preconceptions about them, too. After all, that is precisely what tends to happen when we’re constantly fed negative messages about a particular group of people.
So I’ve decided there’s only one thing for it. I’m going to start a Tumblr. It’s going to feature selectively-taken phone clips that set out to prove a one-sided worldview and it’s going to be called: “Men Giving Up Too Much Space on the Tube.”
Originally published at InsideMan.
Photo—davitydave/Flickr
I can see a case against wide-legged sitting if the bus or subway car is crowded. If your posture spreads you onto the seat next to you and that prevents someone else from taking that seat, then that’s discourteous. Then the polite thing would be to bring your legs together a little more to make room. I could understand some policies to discourage ALL people of ALL genders who take up more than one seat if they don’t have to. But, if the bus isn’t crowded and there’s space enough for everyone to have a seat, then there’s no problem.… Read more »
The fact is that our society is filled with selfish entitled people. Crowded public places like public transit will bring you into contact with a lot of them. “Man-spreading” is a term used to blame and shame men for public rudeness. Yes, there are men who sit and take up tons of room, who expect others to sit uncomfortably so they can be comfortable. But this has nothing to do with their Y chromosome, they’re just jerks who happen to be men. I’ve come across far more women than men behaving in an entitled manner in my many years using… Read more »
A man sits quietly with his knees slightly wider than his hips, and THAT is the major problem in mass transit? Count yourself lucky, sister, that manspreading is the main inconvenience you face on the bus. Talk about a sense of entitlement. Talk about a privileged position. Talk about a First World Problem. I’ve seen women on buses change diapers, clip their toenails, and floss their teeth. I’ve seen people of all genders babble loudly and incoherently at high volume to no one in particular. I’ll take a slightly too relaxed man minding his own business any day of the… Read more »
“If a man stands on the subway, does he have to keep his legs closed and stand at attention now?”
I always stand in the aisle in horse stance when I ride the bus. Builds the quads. I get strange looks, but no one ever stands near me. I wonder if my humming is what bothers people…. : – )
This is why I think anyone who thinks “manspreading” is a serious problem has some deep-seated issue with men, somewhere. Deep down, possibly. If a guy – even inadvertantly – spreads (god forbid he may just have done it unconsciously, or maybe hey, his balls hurt, it’s not like we have two pressure sensitives objects dangling around between two joints that regularly close), then apparently according to the brave new world of gender equality, it’s perfectly ok to: – creepshoot him – upload the pics to the internet – invite public mockery – claim he’s engaging in gendered territorial entitlement*… Read more »
I was thinking something similar.
Maybe some of these shamers have OCD tendencies – all legs in a subway must be parallel to each other and perpendicular to the seat back, or else the world will end. Just like they need all their pencils to be lined up on their desks.
I blame the show Downton Abbey for all this neo-Victorian crap.
So, now you can get a ticket for “taking up too much space” on the bus or subway. This is not just a declaration of war against some men, but large people in general. I don’t spread my legs wide when I sit, but my hips and back don’t allow for me to cross my legs for very long without real discomfort. (It’s not about the testicles in my case.) I’m a large man who takes up a lot of room, even though I try to take up as little space as I can. It’s just a matter of time… Read more »
So, NYC would ticket Rosie the Riveter for sitting incorrectly?
http://www.wikiart.org/en/norman-rockwell/rosie-the-riveter-1943
[The rivet gun might be inconvenient on a subway.]
Spread ’em if you got ’em! YOUR body, YOUR choice!
Women: Men do this bad thing a lot and it causes problems for us.
This article: BUT SOME MEN ARE NICE WHY AREN’T YOU TALKING ABOUT HOW NICE WE ARE
More like:
Women: There are people who take up too much space on mass transit but we’re only going to focus on the men that do it and give a free pass to everyone else. In fact let’s make it illegal for men and only men to do it. Let’s make it okay to shame men and only men that do it.
Hell, this “issue” sounds a lot like white people who know full well black people aren’t the ones that commit crimes but still go on about how black people are ruining America with their criminal behaviors.
Sitting While Male?
Has anyone ever wondered if this was a social experiement taken to the extreme. Think about it. Some folks sit around and say something like this. “I wonder, how far could we get a city to enact a law or policy if we pretend to be a whole bunch of people and send emails to city officials”. I have done this once in my life though on a smaller scale. Way back when the Ontario (Canada) lottery corporation used to have themed lottery tickets. Every couple of months I would send them a letter on ‘fancy’ letterhead complaining that my… Read more »
I’m with Andrew on this one.
Men giving up space to women aside. Whenever I’m on public transport, I see way, way more women (both in percenage and in absolute numbers) using up extra seats with bags etc, or just sitting across a pair of seats, than I see men “spreading”.
Well time to add, “I can take up multiple spaces on the mass transit and not be harassed, humiliated, have my picture put on social media, or arrested.” to the female privilege checklist.
Danny it is called shebagging 🙂
Right??
Men sit with their legs more than half an inch apart (and you’ll notice roughly 90% of the examples of this are on mostly empty buses and trains) and therefore are deserving of having their faces (and crotches, let us not forget) strewn about the internet for public ridicule.
Meanwhile, women need an extra seat for their purses and that’s called “putting up a protection against patriarchial encroachment” or somesuch nonsense.
As a woman, I have to say that I agree with your analysis, Dan. I do regularly come across Social media posts/comments describing men in an unflattering light. I wonder if that is restricted to the anglo – saxon world; I haven’t seen any “men bashing” on French social media. I live in Paris and “manspreading” is not something I see on a regular basis in the métro. When the problem arises I just tend to plop down on the seat next to the guy and sort of take my space with a ponted look. Generally he mumbles an excuse… Read more »
Miss Bougie
I am Scandinavian and manspreading is not a problem in my city. Not at all.
It is not among the top five complaints people have about public transport,
So maybe,just maybe this is a cultural phenomena if more men in the US sit like that and take up two seats in stead of one on a crowded bus or train.
Glad the article seems to be on the right track to you Miss Bougie. Interesting to hear that there’s a different tone to the conversation about men on French social media — being a typically mono-lingual Brit, I can only speak to the things I read and see in the UK and the US. I didn’t include this anecdote in the article, but on one occasion during the commute I refer to, I actually saw a young woman essentially get her male friend / boyfriend to threaten to beat up a (very unassuming) young man who sat down in a… Read more »
Dan, I wonder if those commentators shaming men, are generally men or women? Women, I’m guessing, although I never paid attention to who the person commenting was. As for the anecdote you’re citing, that’s just appalling behaviour on the woman’s side. What sense of entitlement! Maybe this behaviour stems from the way girls are raised nowadays. In the line that everything is possible, motherhood, working life, self fulfilment, just going out there and obtaining everything life has to offer. Which, of course , it is. Maybe something got lost on the way; the transmission of values and respect of the… Read more »
This Young Turks segment is pretty good one the problems with these laws:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wvgcd5SBbZo
I remember when this became a story. I read a post on Jezebel talking about that tumblr page and the commenters were pulling it apart. Granted, the behavior can be annoying at the extreme edge of things, but a lot of the photos on the tumblr page were not bad at all. There was one in particular of a guy reading a book with huddled and leaning towards the edge of the seat to avoid touching the passenger next to him but he was still deemed to be taking up too much space. I don’t know what he could have… Read more »
There were pics of men on the train asleep…with no-one sitting around them. The guy probably spread inadvertantly.
Men: We Can Oppress You Even While We Are Alone. And Asleep
BE AFRAID
Strange that I should stumble on this article having spent my morning commute pondering this inequality. Why is OK for a women to lurch onto the bus (or whatever form of public transport is your choice) carrying enough stuff to sustain her for the remaining week. Why do they have a handbag (which just seems to be meant for carrying a just a purse) and also some kind of semi-disposable ” brand name” bag for all the stuff that they really need. Notice that this bag always has “Harrods” or “Guess” or some other designer name. These bags then seem… Read more »
https://www.google.no/search?q=photo+men+sitting&rlz=1CAHPZY_enNO604NO604&espv=2&biw=768&bih=364&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=PJl2VYXaMMacsAG2wYGQCg&ved=0CBwQsAQ&dpr=2
Yes Andrew we know most men have testicles.
But is it also possible that some men feel feminine if they do not sit with their legs spread ?
I do not see men in power sit like that on most photos….so maybe they do not have any balls at all??????
I do not see men in power sit like that on most photos….so maybe they do not have any balls at all?????? Well, if that’s true, that should defang the ridiculous notion by some that manspreading is some kind of dominance display. But no-one is saying having testicles means you need to spread all the time. But if it’s a hot day, it can sometimes be more comfortable for some. Or sometimes you’re walking, or you sit down and things get squeezed. It’s a bit like how sometimes you accidentally bite your own tongue or the inside of your mouth.… Read more »
OMG Won’t someone PLEASE think of the men?
OMG Won’t someone PLEASE STOP thinking about women?
OMG won’t someone PLEASE think of the college educated upperclass east-coast white women?!?!?
Are they the ones that use public transport every day?
I don’t think so 8balls.
Using the subway in NY? Pretty good chance actually. They’re definitely the ones taking creepshots on their iphones to post on the internet later, I’d be willing to bet money
The current solution is to always stand. That is until the sexism is found in that move.