Eli and Josie offer advice to a guy concerned about his naturalist girlfriend’s body hair.
A note from Eli and Josie: This post is in response to Dear Prudence, an advice column at Slate.com. We were deeply bothered the advice offered by Emily Yoffe (Prudence) to the man asking a very sensitive, vulnerable question about his girlfriend, who prefers to keep her body hair natural. We feel the advice of, “I’ve got one word for your girlfriend: electrolysis” completely fails to address the issue, and worse, disrespects his girlfriend’s identity as a naturalist, and his respect for that identity.
Below, we offer our own response to the following question from Slate.com:
[Dear Sexes:]”I love my girlfriend very much and at the age of 27 feel like I’m finally with somebody who I could spend my life with. I have been supportive of her naturalist attitude regarding hair removal and even find her hairy pits, legs, and other parts sexy. The trouble is that she also has scattered hairs growing across her chest and about a dozen long ones around each nipple.
How can I explain to her that although I support her natural ways and was well aware of her preference going into things, that a little bit of [removal] would go a long way? It’s the nipple hair that really throws me. When I’ve brought it up she’s acted offended and explained to me that it’s natural for women to get hair all over. She says she could pluck them but they will just grow back. I’m really falling for this girl but am fearful that as we age it’s going to become more and more of a turn off until our sex life is dead.”
She Said: Here’s the truth, flat-out: Your girlfriend’s body hair is important to her. By not removing it, she’s saying, “I accept myself fully, exactly as I am” and nothing and no one is going to change that about her.
You’re clearly an open-minded, good-hearted and loving guy and you deserve a lot of credit for going against the tide on this one. There are almost no mainstream examples of women in our society who choose to accept their body hair, and as a woman who spent many years embracing mine, I can tell you that there is a lot of pushback against those of us who resist the deeply-engrained tradition of shaving, waxing, plucking and whatever else.
If you’re turned off by the chest hairs, you’ll have to be honest with her, as it sounds like you have been. But this hair is a part of who she is. And I assume It’s a part of what you love about her—-her fierce independence and commitment to what she believes is right. But if it’s a deal-breaker for you, it’s best to be completely honest about it.
If you’ve done the work to try to get past it (and it sounds like you have) and are still coming up against the same issue, you have to be true to yourself about what turns you on. You deserve a life full of desire, and she deserves a relationship with someone who is desirous of her exactly how she is.
That doesn’t mean you’re creating a false ultimatum of “tweeze your nips or I’m out”, it just means that you’re accepting your own turn-ons and turn-offs just as she accepts her body hair. Discuss the issue with love, lots of love, and perhaps you’ll reach a middle ground together. If not, you’re still a good man if you move on.
He Said: You and your girlfriend are only going to get hairier and weirder looking as you age, so if you’re freaking out about this whole body hair thing now, I’m not sure what the future will look like. Well that’s not completely true. As I look into my crystal ball, I can see a few things. In 20 years, you’ll need your girlfriend’s chest and nipple hair to cover your then balding head. So… you might want to make sure your girlfriend saves all the body hair she has at present. You’ll thank me one day.
Seriously though, even if your girlfriend is a naturalist, that doesn’t mean she’s without insecurity, regarding her own body hair. Maybe she does the natural look, because she’s just trying to accept who she is. That doesn’t mean she’s completely and totally accepted it already. Telling her to shave her hairs (or get rid of them), could really make her feel like crap.
If you must persist, you could coyly try a “let’s shave each other” night. Take a sensual, romantic approach in your quest. Think candles, soothing music, and essential oils (or body lotions). And come prepared with a sharp blade. Also, if you feel you must ask her to shave/wax/etc… some of her hair, then you should step up to the plate and offer to shave/manicure something of yours, just the way she likes.
If that doesn’t work, you could plan a spa day together. Then you’re both being pampered and manicured. Beyond that, you could reassure your girlfriend that you love her for who she is. If you can’t do that sincerely, and still find a way to be turned on (by this woman you love), maybe you should just go find yourself a smoother lady.
Originally appeared at She Said He Said
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Photo courtesy of Flickr/suzettesuzette
About She Said He Said
“If not, you’re still a good man if you move on.”
Yes. Too many advice givers would never be willing to say this, but it’s true. He doesn’t “have a problem” just because he has a preference.
Split the difference, maybe? Pluck one of the nipples and leave the other natural? Solomonic, really.
Haha. A+.
I swear in the last couple weeks this exact same question appeared in the Dear Prudence area of Slate and she suggested electrolysis.
I am not a body hair person on myself. If it’s there I want it gone. Once in a while I’ll get a wild chest hair that I don’t notice until it’s become well noticeable and I will notice eventually. Thusly out they come but they will always grow back. It would absolutely mortify me if my partner brought it up as a problem because it already mortifies me to find them. And then I would probably feed like crap. And probably then get a little sensitive about being naked in front of my partner especially spontaneously without doing a thorough check for any/all errant body hairs.
If however my partner phrased a it a little better and in a context that didn’t involve it being disgusting (like a joke) I probably would get the little guys before he even noticed them but I wouldn’t be excessively worried if he saw them. Honestly with body hair talks it’s all about the approaches.
Yeah, if you read the top of the post, you’ll see that we actually were so disturbed by Dear Prudence’s answer that we answered it ourselves!
Well, what does the guy look like? Is he a hairball? Or is that okay? Does he look like Gilles Marini or William Levy? Or does he look like Bigfoot?
Why are we only talking about her hair issues?
Say “Goodbye!”
I think we’re talking about Her hair because He asked a question about Her hair.
I don’t think this was intended as an in-depth exploration of body-hair issues in hetero relationships.
It’s difficult to balance the compromise when a seemingly little thing like some stray hairs could get in with way and mess up all of the appreciation for her naturalistic preference he’s grown to have. In every magazine column I’ve read about the subject, women are always instructed to remove body hair which really pisses me off, as a genetic hair gene and PCOS side effect which makes me 3 times more hairy than the average woman. Personally I defuzz specific hair on my body and leave other bits alone and it’s not easy for a woman to find a guy who will accept her natural body hair. She won’t let up on her preference so either he accepts it (even though I do personally prefer to pluck chest hair) or he moves on
I prefer the look and feel of a hairy woman.
For what it’s worth, my wife nursed our two babies. The friction of nursing seems to have permanently cleared up the handful of hairs that graced each nipple area. (I don’t endorse having babies in the letter writer’s case, however. Not until the other issues are resolved.)
Do this girl a favor and find a vacuous, self-absorbed, shallow dingbat and date her instead. She’ll spend every spare moment obsessing over her appearance and you can sleep at night knowing that she’s waxing every inch of her body in supplication to Maxim magazine.
@Tyler
people like you are the reason men can’t even proclaim their attraction to certain woman without being criticized from all ends.
Because standards are something that only women are allowed to have.
I barely shave and wouldn’t date a woman who didn’t shave regularly.
Sucks for you, then.
Very smooth answers yet again from Eli and Josi. I think its important to remember that being natural is a freedom we all should have. No one should feel obligated to do more maintenance than they personally want. It displays strong character to resist that expectation of hair removal, nice
Really? This is what we’re talking about? She gets offended and he’s too chicken to tell her how he really feels. Personally, I don’t like hair on me or a guy, but if the hair belongs to Russell Crowe, or Gerard Butler, I’m willing to compromise or overlook it. Thank God, my husband is not super hairy, nor smelly or with bad breath, those would have all been deal breakers right from the get go, so if he likes her hairy armpits, he needs to swallow the hairy nipples too. And seriously, she should take a good look and realize that you don’t need to look like a gorilla to be a naturalist, independent, against the current kind of gal. Who gives so much weight to hair anyway, these people have way too much time on their hands…which they could put to good use and shave each other with.
You seem to give a lot of weight to hair, otherwise why would you so harshly criticize a girl for looking how she wants to look?
I love Josie’s response. It is informed and respectful. Eli, however, seems to have completely missed the point. Taking her to a spa or offering to wax something of his own shows no regard or understanding for the woman’s hair as part of her identity. ‘Honey, I want you to change cause you’re not good enough as you are,’ doesn’t sound any better with champagne and candles.
I have always had a few stray nipple hairs which I have plucked. In college, they bithered me so much that I paid for several sessions of electrolysis which was tough on a student’s income. The electrolysis was totally ineffective – the hairs kept growing back. I have plucked them regularly for the last 25 years. Some of them went away after 10-15 years of plucking and others got finer and less noticeable. My biggest issue with plucking is the frequency of infected ingrown hairs it causes, which I have to pick at to get the hair out. This is also a constant problem with waxing my bikini area and it’s why I have refused to give into the social fad to go totally bare down there. When I’ve tried, I just have constant problems with ingrown hairs and painful infections. I guess I just have really thick hairs. Permanent hair removal is expensive, requires multiple treatments over months or years to be effective long term.
So I have a lot of sympathy for women who want to keep it natural even tho personally I dislike my body hair but can’t do much about it (I do shave my legs and underarms). I wish guys had more sympathy for how difficult this issue can be for some women. Guys often complain that women are too insecure and irrationally obsessed with beauty issues — well, here’s an example of where maybe men as well as women should be more tolerant of the limitations of the human body.
I’ve literally never met a grown woman over 25 who didn’t have some nipple hairs. Even my uber-blonde Danish friend has them – they’re just blonde. I’m sure some have more than others, but it’s not just you.
That’s what sucks about our society. There you were in college so worried about your nip hair, probably thinking you were one of the only girls in your dorm to have them, and in truth they all probably did. I remember so many moments with the girls I worked with in my early 20s talking about all the things I was ashamed of – stray nipple hairs, ass-crack hair, queafs (sorry), fear of actual farting during sex (a bunch actually had, one even pooped a little during orgasm)… Smelly vagina, stinky feet, toe hair, enjoying the smell of your own armpit, underpant smoogies. Sorry for the gross list, but we would talk about EVERYTHING! It was the most freeing thing in the world.
That’s why I like doing this blog. To be able to offer people that “I’m with you” commiseration is really awesome!
Then, meet Mrs. Eric M. She has none.
She shaves her legs, etc. for me and I shave my face for her.
Do you know, before i have a girlfriend, the idea of woman can be hairy is never crossed my mind. I always thought than woman are naturally hairless, like my mother ( who are asian and asian people are naturally hairless ). I never known some of them shaved their legs! Because when i see a woman, in picture, in magazine, in movies, they are always hairless. In magazine pretty and beautiful woman is woman who are slim, curvy, and have nice smooth hairless skin. And thats pretty much what is in young guys mind about what’s women are like.
Maybe media should show more hairy woman, because in media woman is always hairless . Always. But i doubt there are women who want to appear in magazine and movies with hairy legs and armpit.
I would cheerfully pose in all my naked glory for any magazine that wanted to do a nice featurette on good-looking fluffy young women. But good luck finding a magazine that would want to do it, or be willing to portray me as anything other than a shock-value freak show!
You’re right John; guys are taught from everything they see to expect a woman to be hairless. Because men expect it, women do it; and because women do it, men expect it.
To each their own. My personal choice is to be naturally fluffy rather than waste loads of time and energy on regularly removing hair and then dealing with all the ingrowns and infections. Also I like to be accepting of myself the way I am naturally because, for me, that helps me love myself better. Other women will feel differently and that’s fine.
It’s also fine that men will have preferences, as long as they communicate them respectfully. Deciding something is a dealbreaker does not a bad person make, no matter what that thing is. Being able to opt out of a relationship for any reason, or even no logical reason at all, is a pretty sacred social right.
I can’t help wondering where the hair issue fits in their larger relationship. My advice could depend on how this difference of viewpoint relates to the rest of their relationship. For example, if she has compromised on a lot of things and met him halfway on a lot of his requests, but won’t budge on this one, that’s one thing. If she refuses to compromise on anything whatsoever, and the hair issue is just one example, then that’s a very different thing.
Sometimes this kind of question is really a symptom of something much larger going on. He may just feel in general that he has done all the compromising and she has called all the shots. (I could just be totally projecting here.)
He would have to decide how big this issue is in the balance of things. It may be a “dealbreaker” all by itself, but it may be a lesser issue in light of other things that she does do for their relationship. I’d advise him to put it in as big a context as he can.
I suggest you seriously think about walking before getting deeper into this relationship. Why?
There is a reasonable balance between being true to yourself and not caring at all about what your SO thinks or how they feel. Long time happily married people know how to strike that balance.
By contrast, this young woman seems to be so determined to be true to herself that what you think is irrelevant. Think about that. She doesn’t really care how you feel. And, this is a relatively simple to solve issue.
That trait of not caring how you feel will only get stronger and more pronounced as you deal with more and more important issues, far more life impacting than hair. Take this hair issue as a harbinger of how she will deal with other important issues. From what he has writtend, she doesn’t care what he thinks or feels.
Or, grow an unkempt, scraggly beard. Never even trim it or comb it. When she complains about it, tell her that she’s not accepting you for who you are. .
Either than, or get out of this relationship as fast as you can!
It sounds like he knew going into the relationship that she prefers to be natural, and hairy. I agree they may not be compatible. But he shouldn’t be expecting her to change this core aspect of her lifestyle when he KNEW that’s her preferred lifestyle.
When I started dating my current boyfriend, he had a mustache I didn’t like. I thought it was unattractive for his face. However, he had a lot of pride in that mustache. He told me he’d decided to grow it a few years earlier while trying to create a new image for himself. He thought it helped him become more confident because it had taken a lot of daring for him to do (he is a shy person who doesnt like to call attention to himself). Who am I to tell him the mustache must go? I realized that he and the mustache were a package deal. Luckily (for me) he eventually decided ON HIS OWN that the mustache upkeep was too much trouble and shaved it off. But I never asked him to get rid of it.
now, with this couple, I think it is fine for the guy to tell his GF he doesn’t like the nipple hair. But if keeping all her hair is a central part of her identity, and she doesn’t want to change just to please a man, then he has to accept that or look elsewhere. Of course compromise is key in every relationship, but it sounds like this is a deep issue for her. For that matter, compromise works both ways, so she might legitimately ask why she has to compromise on this and not him. I think it is fair for her to say, “you knew this about me from the beginning, that this is who I am and I can’t compromise.”
I suspect he got I to the relationship because he thinks she’s really attractive and he thought he could work on the hairy part. Thinking your partner will change for you is always a bad mistake. As in the old story of the frog and the scorpion, people will always act according to their nature.
He IS compromising, far more than most men. He’s willing to accept hairy aripits, hairy legs, hairy everything else, but her hairy areolas are a turn off. If she doesn’t appreciate that he’s compromising for her, she’s unreasonable, and unrealistic in expecting tons of other guys to accept what he’s willing to put up with. if he walks away, which I recommend.
Wonder how she would feel if he stopped grooming himself in ways that she would find bothersome?
But, you are right on one point. He should have recognized that a person who refuses to make a concession to please her partner isn’t a good match for a long term relationship. He should have either not gotten into the relationship or walked a long time ago.
Her stance of not removing her body hair is completely reasonable. She probably doesn’t expect tons of guys to be attracted to her, and does not expect guys who are not attracted to her to date her. Neither one of them is to blame for being incompatible.
Also, he says he finds her other body hair sexy. So, not sure how accepting parts of her that he finds attractive is a “compromise.”
“Neither one of them is to blame for being incompatible.”
It’s not about the hair. It’s about the fact that she doesn’t see to care AT ALL about how he feels that makes them incompatible. What she wants and likes is all that matters in her world, if we are to believe what he says.
For instance, he’s willing to “compromise” on her having a hairy chest, but is turned off by her nipple hair. It turns him off. She doesn’t care.
He needs to get away from her as fast as his little legs can take him.
I started shaving in 6th grade, when the kids in gym class began to ridicule my hairy arms and legs. Although my hair is light blonde, it’s rather thick for a female. I began to be obsessive about it, spending hours in the bathroom every day making sure I had banished every single little hair that was not on the top of my head. A few years ago, I met my current boyfriend. Although we both grew up in the era of internet porn, he lived in an area with a very slow connection, and a house with one old and outdated computer. He spent his teenage years mostly getting off to the odd pilfered magazine, or scenes from movies. He said that in most of those, the women still had some body hair -thus he finds it more attractive. I mention this because I wonder if that has affected how men perceive female body hair. Anyway..
He actually deviates a bit from the average in that he is aroused by hairy legs and arms as well. I am still very diffident over the situation, so we’ve compromised – I use an epilator on the areas where the hair is darkest, and let the rest grow out on my calves and arms. He loves it, but he did mention one day that he finds nipple hair a little disturbing – so I continue to pluck there as well. He’s happy, I’m happy, and I no longer spend hours in the bathroom each morning. Now I have more time to enjoy life, and him! I think the real answer to this question is the first one. He said he already asked her about the nipple hair (although he didn’t mention how he brought it up) and she refused to compromise. It continues to bother him. I think this is symbolic of how their relationship may always function – without compromise.