Josh Bowman says, “Get it, girl!”
NOTE: this article is my response to Mark Radcliffe’s piece, In Praise of Small-Breasted Women. It’s all love, Mark, but I have to big up my big‐breasted girls out there.
This goes out to those beautiful big girls. The curvaceous sensations. Those girls at the end of the alphabet…my double H’s and quadruple Z’s. My T’s and A’s. The ladies with some junk in their trunks and an attic upstairs.
You know me. I’m the one staring at you, past all those rail‐thin model types. You are beautiful, you are intelligent, and you know how to work it. What, a sense of humour too? Stop it.
Mo’Nique, you know exactly what I’m talking about. I can’t just walk past a newsstand carrying King Magazine. I have to stop. Open it up. Read some articles. Look at some butts. And put it back quickly because I’ve suddenly become self‐conscious about being a white Jewish guy reading King Magazine.
Where was I? Oh, right…butts and boobs! Yes girl. I want that body supersized. I’m borrowing my dad’s car and driving to Costco. Do you understand what I’m saying? Do you have some waist? Can you wind in a dancehall and jam in a soca fete? Of course you can.
I want to be able to bury my face in there and never come up for air. You should come equipped with scuba gear, because I want to go swimming with your two beautiful sweater manatees. I’ll bring my waterproof camera and leave my wallet in the hotel room. But hidden under some pants, because I don’t totally trust the staff there.
Guys like me, we aren’t sexually attracted to angles…we like curves! When I get in my (dad’s) car, I’m not trying to drive in a triangle.
Me? I’m looking for a strong woman with a big presence and a huge personality.
If the guy you’re with thinks you need to lose weight, then DTMF. He doesn’t appreciate you.
Photo courtesy of tachyondecay
About Josh Bowman
In the interest of fairness, I’ve a question. Is the tone of this article meant to serve as a direct response to the tone of the previous article? If so, then it’s all good and I totally get what you’re doing and appreciate it.
If not…well then you’re sorta falling into a similar trap of thinking that big women as a group are more likely to have certain personality traits by virtue of being big. Also, by saying – I’m not attracted to what ‘average’ guys are attracted to – you’ve recreated the stereotype of what ‘most’ men are supposedly attracted to. By setting yourself outside the perceived norm, you’ve still failed to step beyond or challenge that norm.
Just can’t please some people.
Clearly!!
Not trying to do anything but (gently) joke with Mark and try to bring some levity to the discussion.
That being said, got to give it up for the big women out there!!
Ah okay then. Carry on, sir.
Nah Heather this is where you blow the lid off and submit a post on what type of women you’re looking at….
LOL. He’s got you there Heather.
Actually, I was considering doing that…but really we’ve already got three. Plus, how the heck does a post by a lesbian commenting on the type of body she prefers have anything to do with being a good man? Ya know? And an article titled, “In Praise of Christina Hendricks’ Body” might be taking it a step too far. Even if I used Marylin Monroe instead, might be a bit much. Maybe “An Ode to the Beauties of the 50s,” could work.
Plus, as Josh responded that his tone was meant as satire about Mark’s piece, well that cleared up the issue. Having a type isn’t problematic…obviously I’ve got a type and I know women who think that somehow by praising the hourglass figure I’m objectifying women, etc. I’m not, obviously…I’m just appreciating their beauty. And that aspect of Mark and Josh’s piece is totally awesome.
Plus, how the heck does a post by a lesbian commenting on the type of body she prefers have anything to do with being a good man? Ya know?
Because it would speak to an attempt to building this place up to be, even if the main focus is men, an inclusive space. Sure it’s nice to talk about how men are looking at women but I think there might be some room for an over “how do you look at women?” conversation that’ might be worth having.
And of course you can never have too many at a satire party.
Agreed! Write it, Heather!!
I’ve nearly decided to write a piece called, “In praise of my body, fool!” Just cause it would be past the point of ridiculousness at this point.
Confessions of a Long Natural Brunette Chaser
by Leinado Soreil
I don’t know about you but I could come up with these titles all day long, not to mention the actually posts to go with them.
“Shine: Tales of a Bald Fetishist”
“Bounce: One Woman’s Tale of Her Love of Beer Bellies”
“Firey Passions of a Red Head Enthusiast”
“Size Does Matter: Why I Will Never Date a Man That is Shorter Than I Am”
“Tangled: Bushy Beards and Mighty Mustaches”
“Why Yes, I Actually Am Undressing You With My Eyes (and Both Brains)”
“Viking Roleplay: How I Came To Love Getting Sacked in the Bedroom”
Seriously its like someone should make an open thread where we can come up with titles like this.
Seems like. I’m looking into it! Will you post these there if it goes up?
Yes I will post these and come up with more if I can.
You know I kinda feel bad a little bit. This was a conversation about a serious subjet (and I even put up a post about it myself) but its kinda turned into a joke fest.
“Gillian Anderson, I’d like to X her Files…”
“Fun With Jayne and Jane, A Firefly Fanfic”
Love those
Plus, as touched on in the other article, knowing how women into other women view those other women helps us learn more about how we, as people view each other. You mentioning that you must consciously resist not stairing at breasts when you talk to women honestly surprised me, but it also somehow reassured me. Perhaps because I know now that an attraction to and the struggle not to focus on (during conversation) a woman’s breasts isn’t a male thing, but an attraction thing… or something like that.
One of the most interesting articles that shape my view of social construct vs genetic behaviour is an article by a transgender male on this site, talking about a number of experiences encountered since his change. Some are how others view him or treat him, but some are about changes to his own thoughts, emotions, communication, and physic. I think such an article would be relevant, because it shares a common interest with men, IE the interest in women.
That said, this is only a half hearted comment, I don’t really think you need to do such an article, I just wanted to explain how it could be relevant. plus, as Danny says, can never have too many at a satire party.
PS, you can also show us men how to objectify women all proper like, given the comments here clearly don’t like satire any more than clumsy admiration.
“Given the comments here clearly don’t like satire any more than clumsy admiration.”
I think a lot of people just didn’t realize it was satire. I didn’t at first either, which is why I had to ask.
“You can also show us men how to objectify women all proper like.”
The key is to not objectify a woman…and then the other problem is that there are women out there who like to jump on the ‘you’re objectifying me’ train too quickly. For a very well thought out and not-too-serious article about objectifying women from a lesbian’s perspective, I suggest this article here:
http://www.afterellen.com/movies/how-much-female-objectification-is-too-much-female-objectification-transformers-dark-side-of-the-moon
Such a shame, I was hoping to have a little good humour rather than our usual debate. Oh well, opportunities lost.
“The key is to not objectify a woman”
Can you explain the contradiction involved in saying we should not objectify women, while then pointing to an article that begins by acknowledging we all (all being those in the discussion with that particular preference) objectify women to some degree, it’s just when it’s taken to far, when it “crosses the line” that it is unacceptable and problematic? I suppose it can be attributed to the viewpoint of two completely different Heather’s who happen to like women and sci-fi/fanfair type media, but that does seem enough of an explanation, given you pointed to it as an explanation on objectification that more closely match’s my “how to objectify all proper like”, than your “we’re not to objectify at all”.
Both Mark and Josh have revealed their preference for women; neither of them need a woman’s permission for their preferences. Whether other men share their views or not is irrelevant.
Maybe I’m just odd, but I don’t have a “type.” I find many different women beautiful. From skinny and petite to tall and curvy, blonde to brunette, straight to curly. Glasses, or no glasses. Asian, white, latino, black, multi-racial, whatever. It is that je ne sais quoi. I can find women who are polar opposites in appearance, and I will find them both incredibly attractive. I walk around the city, and I see beautiful women everywhere! I’m not a boob man, or an ass man, or a leg man. In a way, I have trouble comprehending that some men are into one particular thing.
That’s not to say I find every woman beautiful, but I probably find more women beautiful than most because I don’t have a “type.” I can’t actually answer what my ideal type is, because I simply don’t have one. Perhaps I’ll write a response to this and the other one!
You should write a response! I agree….all women are beautiful! Woot woot!!
“Types” are such a weird thing! I have a type, so much so that it’s almost laughable. I can’t help it!
I don’t assign personality or non-physical attributes to this type, and I would make an exception, but I can’t help but be attracted to dark haired, darker-skinned guys. Especially those with light eyes. I don’t try to do it, it just happens.
I think there are associations to these “types” we’re not really aware of. And I know not everyone does have a type, but I don’t think it’s as malicious as it’s being made out to be…
And yeah, Josh is making a funny.
And double yeah, Collin get your computer open and write a response piece!
I don’t see how “types” can be malicious. It’s really no different than having a certain “taste” in food or music. Saying I’m drawn to strawberry ice cream over chocolate doesn’t say anything bad about chocolate, just that when given the choice, I’ll go for the the strawberry because it tastes SOOOO GOOOD.
Interestingly, I do have a few anti-types. One is super-muscular men. Total turnoff for me. The other is redheaded men. There are plenty of handsome redheads (ahem, Prince Harry) but I think I would struggle to date one (even Harry) because it would remind me too much of my brother. We were really really close as kids and pretty much any time I see a redheaded man I think of Jon, so Poof, there goes the physical attraction…
I can relate, I don’t really have a type either. I’ve dated big guys, small guys, overweight guys, skinny guys, blond guys with blue eyes, dark guys with brown eyes. I dated an Asian guy for over a year who had less body hair than me, then immediately I started dating a Middle Eastern guy whose back looked like a rug. They were all attractive to me in their own way!
I’m loving these celebrations of beauty in different sizes. It’s great that Mark and Josh, and you, Collin, know what you like and can talk about it in a way that doesn’t disparage the women who don’t fit that type.
Nothing wrong with having a type. Nothing wrong with not having a type, either. I’m drawn most to men of the Apolo Ohno type – dark hair, facial hair, great smile, notable physique (he’s kind of an extreme example on that point – I really just like a guy with defined arms & shoulders). With women, I have two types, and they couldn’t be more opposite – I’m drawn to both the rail-thin androgens like Annie Lennox and the soft curves and body shape of someone like Adele. Even though these characteristics catch my eye, I’m certainly attracted to all sorts of people outside my types. My husband looks nothing like Apolo Ohno and I’m just fine with that.
In fact, I’d say it’s pretty rare for anyone to be strictly confined to one type and never venture outside of that.
As Joanna Said, “types” are funny. I know I have a type, I find the petite frame desirable, but that does not mean I don’t find others desirable too, it’s just that, if I see two women side by side, and one is petite, the other curvy, I’ll likely spend more thoughts/effort getting to know the petite girl first, barring circumstances. Some people have hard and fast rules (my sister insists no hairy chests, EVER), others are just best of the best (I like breasts, the best of the breast though, are the smaller ones… but ultimately, I’m actually a leg man, a woman in a skirt or dress (of any length) will always catch my attention).
I know, Collin, I’m the same way. It’s not wrong or weird to have a type, and many people do…I just don’t. Really and honestly, I don’t. For some reason, people find that hard to believe. I guess if I do have a type…it’s for someone who doesn’t have types. I see it like this. If you’re with someone who’s super into your type, you end up feeling like a walking type–and interchangeable with anyone else of that type. I actually had a girlfriend who wouldn’t date guys who made it clear they had a preference for Asian women (she’s Chinese). She felt that they not only fetishized her, but placed characteristics onto her specifically due to her ethnicity, which had nothing to do with what she was or wasn’t. And if you’re with someone who doesn’t usually like your type, but likes you anyways, the drawbacks of that are obvious, and will probably lead to a lot of heart break and jealousy. This sounds a little weird, but I like a guy who watches a variety of porn, insteading of focusing on something very specific. Once again, I guess that’s a type all in itself.
But it’s even more weird when people try to say that their physical type is ‘the’ type to go for–in general, and that it means anything about your personality. That’s the tone I (and a lot of others) got from the ‘small breasts’ article. It was just awful. I even got a lot of that from the hairy chest article. She loves body hair. Woo, good for her. That doesn’t mean that there’s anything wrong with the opposite preference. And then there are women, like me, who find the whole spectrum sexy on the right person–from super hairy to trimmed to patchy to bald. You say you like a petite frame, Mark Neil. Just as long as don’t phrase it like that’s the ‘right’ preference or assume that everyone has your/a preference. This seems to be happening a lot on this site and in general. At one point, a guy on this forum said all men liked hips (I’m not sure if that meant big or small or whatever else). That’s his preference, and it’s super legit and great. It’s just weird to assume that every man or woman has that same preference. And when a preference for a certain type becomes too mainstream, there’s always a mindless backlash preference. Think about what people have said about having glasses. Girls with perfect eyesight have started wearing glasses to fit into stereotypes of girls with glasses. It’s fine if you’re role-playing and having some fun, but if you’re trying to make it a thing…really?
Also, for the record…I don’t attribute any personality types to body types. Honestly.
Let’s split the difference:
Asymmetry is where it’s at. Best of two worlds!
Oh, come now. you could have at least included a link to a Picaso or something, to go with the little sculpture Pictures both articles use.
Like this one:
http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2008/01/11/picasso-paintings_1333.jpg
What took you so long?
Haha….I just read your article today!!
And watch out Mark….I’m gaining on ya in the “Popular Today” feed.
Great job! Got a really good laugh at this one!
Thanks!
Thanks for reminding all the women out there that as far as you’re concerned, they’re just a certain type of pair of boobs with a few extra bits attached. Some of us were starting to think we were actually people!
Did any of us really expect anything more of teh good menz project, though?
I think highly of this website Raven. Of course, there are articles for me that crop up that ignite negative thoughts about the message it could be giving. But even those kind of articles present a platform for discussion. And it’s my understanding that has always been GMP’s goal. Not that it would always be happy, feel, good messages. Even for myself sometimes there are men that will say things here that just make no sense to me or make me fear certain idealogies men may hold about women. But this website provides an oppurtunity to talk about such things like no other popular male media website I’ve ever seen. I think the people that are here, whether they are bloggers, posters, or the people that run this site, all believe in one thing. Better communication between men and for men and thus for women too. So if you find something troubling about this topic, tell us why. Don’t just bash GMP. They don’t deserve it.
top post erin
Raven, why don’t you write for us? It’s a lot easier to throw some quick stones than it is to create real change. It’s the discussion that is important – -as equals, as people talking from a point of truth as they know it at that moment in time. If you feel strongly we are doing something wrong, then show us how you would do it right.
Agreed!
Did any of us really expect anything more of teh good menz project, though?
Well what are you expecting out of this place. You could snipe off one liners and then wait for some high fiving while you pat yourself on the back with the other hand.
Or you could your keyboard where your mouth is and speak up.
Objectification. Please look it up in the dictionary and then stop doing it, or at least don’t pretend you’re “god men” while doing it. Thanks but not thanks, we’ve already heard heard a thousand time this crap, and we don’t need one more man telling us his penis’ opinion on what out body should or should not be.
Satire.
Not to mention, by the actual dictionary definition, I don’t see any objectification. Sure, if you use the gender feminist definition, then you see it, but then again, anything that treats a woman as more than just a conciousness without physical form is objectification. Given how much effort most women put into their physical form, in order to be noticed, that isn’t a definition worth putting much stoke into.
Mostly I found it interesting that despite all the comments about this piece referring to bigger women, it doesn’t say anything about bigger women. It says big breasts and a round arse. It does end with a bit about don’t listen to guys who tell you to lose weight, but when we talk about curvy women, are we meaning, like, Christina Hendricks, who the media thinks is plus size and curvy, or the millions of women who actually *are* plus size and curvy? Are curvy women allowed to have big thighs and tummies as well, or just tits and arse?
I was trying to figure out what the definition of curvy as well. Is it just butt and boobs? Or the bits in between. I have big boobs and butt but I also have bits in between. But then again I would rather be objectified due to physical attributes versus the more normal (for me) objectification based on my bank account and have who I am and what I look like merely tolerated in some bid to gain access to money. Not that I’m rich but I’m sure men can empathize with that whole feeling (and not that I actually give out money in a quest for love).
Chris – I was wondering the same thing myself. Is this about big women? Or women with big breasts and butts only? Dare Josh even touch that question?
Are men attracted to all body types? Or just thin women with varying sizes breasts and butts?
All body types!
We’re all different. It takes all kinds.
For example, I was/am attracted to Mrs. Eric M.’s hourglass figure. Even after a couple babies, she still got it!
Eric…I don’t agree with the vast majority of your posts, but you sound like a great husband. Your wife is very lucky to be so appreciated.
Nothing wrong with expressing appreciation for female beauty in its various shapes and sizes. Sorry if we can’t help but love women physically and otherwise.
It’s unfortunate that Women’s Studies / feminism so often indoctrinates its adherents into having disdain for males.
Also, dial 1-800-MIXALOT and kick them nasty thoughts.
I cannot lie.
Mind you there are times when I’m done to get the friction on times when my anaconda don’t want none should I still call this number?
@Josh
I think you needed a SATIRE button on the top, or something.
Right?? I should put something at the bottom of my humour posts that says “jokes only in the comment section please! Jokes only!!”
Written satire can be so difficult to read correctly.
Though a healthy dose of contempt for men doesn’t help what can be read come through as the satire it clearly is. Especially when looking for an excuse to attack a space you dislike on principal. Not saying that’s happening here, just an observation in general
Although, there’ve been plenty of articles written about how difficult it is to determine when someone is serious or not online. The problem is that when written, satire is virtually indistinguishable from the outlandish position it is commenting on. Heck, even when spoken it can be difficult for some people…there are people out there who think that Stephen Colbert actually believes all the things he says on his show.
So while I agree that sometimes misinterpreting satire for a serious opinion can come down to the reader’s own bias…sometimes it’s just because determining the meaning behind written words can be difficult.
“Not saying that’s happening here, just an observation in general.”
It’s pretty clear that’s what’s happened here. The contempt for all things male becomes plainlyvevident whenever you hear the seriously snarky? “what about the menz?”
HeatherN: I disagree that “written satire can be so hard to read correctly.” Instead, I’d say that poorly written satire can be so hard to read.
I feel like Josh is scared of the criticism he was receiving and then claimed that this was a satirical piece. What exactly were you satirizing, Josh? You admit that you prefer “curves” (meaning big tits and ass, again until a commentator called you on it). According to your now qualified position, your piece is intermittently true statements and “satire.” I’m disappointed in both you and Mark and your editors for posting these pieces online.
I’m sensitive body type qualifications because my best friend has struggled for years to accept the way that she looks, at times venting her frustration in tragically self-destructive ways. It’s heartbreaking to love someone when she doesn’t love herself. I don’t think that pieces like this are helpful.
I’ve known guys that were seriously dead-set on their types (yes, it was the legendary “yellow fever”). It seemed to verge on the pathetic in high school, but with age and maturity I’ve known at least a few that have settled down with an individual that fits their type and they seem happy. Follow your bliss and all that.
Satire or not, body size in this country has become a political issues with many facets, not the least of which is the perception that fat people have a moral failing. A snap judgment about an obese person (lazy, lower class, poorly educated victimized by America’s food industry) is validated with solemn nods and words of affirmation, while a skinny person is probably an athlete with laudable self-control – the ideal of liberal white educated America. It’s no accident that the modern business executive always has some athletic schtick as part of his/her persona in the corporate beauty contest.
I could go on and on – full disclosure – my wife has always been blessed in the size and callipygian splendor of her butt, and her bra sizes have progressed through the alphabet over the years. And she’s tall. A veritable Juno. I didn’t really know until I met her how much I loved and enjoyed a larger woman. I could, in an alternate universe, be happy with a petite gal, sure. But she’s my sweetie, and I’ve caught at least one clueless bastard denigrating her for her size. It’s kind of sad how many men won’t allow themselves to be seen with a bigger gal with whom they might be happy for fear of what other guys with say.
My wife was a large Double H when pregnant. I couldn’t imagine them before but I saw them grow. They luckily didn’t deflate much when she stopped breast feeding. She is still pretty large but not the double H. Big Breasted Women rock! but so do small breasted women.
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