Photo: NASA/Bill Ingalls
In the gender discussion (okay, “war” in you must) of 2012 I have not always been perceived to be a friend to the feminists. I know, I know. Feminist is a big tent and it wasn’t ALL of them that I alienated with my discussion of why being a dude is okay. But even as a not-always-friend-of-some-feminist this story has really got my blood boiling.
You see I went on a college tour with my daughter last spring. It was a great bonding experience. We hit a dozen schools. While I loved being with her, all the colleges began to look alike. She even came up with a secret way to evaluate the quality of a school’s school spirit (“Look at the bathroom in the student center, Dad. Is it clean? Is it nice? Is there vulgar graffiti?”).
But one school stood out from the rest, at least in my mind.
“Why wouldn’t you want to send your daughter to an institution whose sole purpose is to insure the success of women?” the tour guide asked, looking my way. “Three percent of women graduating from high school go to women’s colleges, and yet 30 percent of congresswomen went to women’s colleges and 20 percent of the female CEOs. There’s a reason that is the case and that’s why we are still here.”
Don’t like ads? Become a supporter and enjoy The Good Men Project ad freeThe pretty, confident, and articulate young woman had smacked me directly between the eyes of my teenage ignorance. Perhaps women’s colleges don’t exist solely for the benefit of their male guests, I thought for the first time.
The information session started like all the others: a room full of nervous parents and bored-looking kids, all trying to hide their abject fear. A woman with wet hair and an iced coffee sat down at the front of the room. She explained that she had been up all night with her 17-month-old baby and might be a bit off her game.
For the next hour I sat transfixed. These sessions are generally so repetitive that I close my eyes to try to use the time productively by meditating. Except at Barnard. What I heard was an hour-long explanation and first-person demonstration of what the tour guide had said in a couple of sentences: Why Barnard had the resources of an Ivy League school but the feeling of a small liberal arts college; how there are plenty of men to interact with in sports or social clubs, but that the school had remained all women on purpose; how for the right young woman Barnard would provide a unique education and inspiration that a coed facility could not.
–from “Are Women’s Colleges Outdated”
In the end my daughter chose a different college but my view of women’s colleges, and Barnard in particular, had been forever changed. The piece I wrote about the school got some attention so quite a few Barnard alums contacted me. One even let me know on Saturday how proud she was that the President would be speaking at their commencement right after it was announced.
Then tonight I got an SOS email from my niece, a junior at Columbia who is studying in Italy this semester. “Love my school but this is out of hand…”
An all-out brawl has broken out between Columbia, where the President went to school, and Barnard in which Columbia students, mostly men from what I can tell, have called into question Barnard’s academic standards, the status of all-women’s colleges, and the President’s symbolic choice to speak to a female student body rather than his own.
Today there was a piece in the New York Times, a nasty reprisal on Jezebel and a heartfelt plea by a Barnard senior for sanity who wrote:
I hope the discourse in this country—and on my own campus—soon transcends the name-calling, woman-bashing, slut-shaming, and gender-stereotyping that has devolved our collective sense of compassion and justice. I hope that no institution is ever defaced as a product of subconscious misogyny. And I hope that as a society we’re able to allow our President to stand behind women.
This isn’t a tough call. Really, guys? Really?
I’m all for standing up for men’s rights, for making sure that in the name of feminism we don’t walk all over the guys in this country. I am even willing to talk about how being a dude is under-appreciated (and sacrificing my body on that one given the bullet holes I took for you bastards). But saying that somehow the President speaking at Barnard is wrong, or unfair, or somehow reflects negatively on the women’s education or the institutions academic standards?
That’s just crap. As a good man to a good man, I gotta say if we are ever going to get anywhere we have to stop this nonsense.
To the men (and women, since I am quite sure there some dirty hands amongst the females throwing spears across Broadway) of Columbia I say: ceasefire! Lay down your weapons!
Celebrate the majesty of a great and unique institution of higher learning which is part of the greater Columbia University. Don’t prove that Ivy League men are the worst species of mouth breathers ever to walk the earth. For god sakes man, these are the women that you would most like to date (from what little I know of the social scene on campus). Respect and love will follow.
Kidding aside, this is wrong and needs to stop.
And Barack…I wasn’t with you on doubling down in Afghanistan. But on this one you showed me some real sack my friend. Way to go.
It would be good PR for Obama to speak at an all woman’s school. I see this as a political distraction pure and simple. Much like the ‘beer summit’ a couple years ago, the media will eat it up and the liberal law student will hit the re election circuit. The Republicans would play it the same way too if it were a special interest on their side.
As a guy who attended a school that was @ 50/50 male female but was surrounded by women’s colleges I can tell you that the guys weren’t the ones with the problems with the “road school” girls. I heard some incredibly crude characterizations of the women’s colleges in question from my female peers. Usually they centered around “mrs degrees,” round heels, sluts (gasp)… etc… Kind of like what you’re seeing on the Columbia page and attributing to men.
I certainly didn’t mind the presence of more women.
Some misogynists are women, very true. That doesn’t make misogyny okay though. Tom acknowledges this in his article: “To the men (and women, since I am quite sure there some dirty hands amongst the females throwing spears across Broadway) of Columbia I say: ceasefire! Lay down your weapons!”
1) I don’t mind single-gender education. It would be very interesting to see the reaction if an Ivy League school spun off a men-only university and gifted it a portion of their endowment. 2) The 7 comments Jezebel chose to highlight were super mean. And while only one commenter specifically identified herself as a woman, I would not be surprised if others were penned by ladies. Barnard is (was) easier to get into than Columbia yet has most of the perks of the Ivy school. A few women who chose to and were able to attend Columbia feel this cheapens… Read more »
I’m not really sure of the background to this so I’m going to tread lightly. I’m guessing the president decided to speak there because he wanted to draw attention to women’s issues (or more cynically, wanted the feminist vote).
I’m fine with this, women’s issues are important and deserve to be aired.
This said, the gender gap in third level education is the shame of most first world countries and he should absolutely draw attention to that too. I’d be a little bothered if he didn’t at least mention it while touring a female only campus.
Georgetown Law / Fluke / Rush Limbaugh / election year.
Those are the reasons.
Is it evil of me, as an NYU alum, that I’m glad Columbia is getting bad press? 😀
Cynthia Nixon graduated from Barnard and she was so fine in “Wit” tonight on Broadway….if we keep producing inspiring women like her, then I am all for it!
I love the fact that all of my comments go into auto-moderation, despite the fact that I write for the site and neither use foul language nor participate in ad hominem attacks.
Im not seeing any in mod. Email me if you have questions @ [email protected]
Several were in spam. Don’t know why but were reinstated. We don’t ban hammer people or put them in permanent mod without talking with them. Always feel free to contact and ask us.
Let’s be honest for a minute. Do you think the president would EVER be able to speak at a men’s college? (Do those even exist?) The simple answer is, no, he would not. And why not? After all, isn’t it men who need the encouragement. We are a shrinking percentage of those earning college degrees, an even more quickly shrinking percentage of those earning advanced degrees, and women are now earning more than men in most metropolitan areas. The answer is because every feminist group would be picketing the White House. NOW would be out there storming the Capitol and… Read more »
Men still outearn women with similar levels of education. The average white man with a bachelor’s degree earns approximately the same as a white woman with an advanced degree. Men represent the majority of CEOs and Congresspeople.
Maybe women are going to college more because it’s the only way they can earn the same as men.
With the wage gap and lack of representation of women in power, I would say they still need a little encouragement.
The students at Barnard College aren’t even close to the demographic in most need of encouragement (nor Columbia, for that matter).
I would be happy to cite federal government reported data showing the comparatively sorry state of boys and young men vs. girls and young women in key areas, especially minority males.
“The students at Barnard College aren’t even close to the demographic in most need of encouragement (nor Columbia, for that matter).”
True, I do agree with that sentiment. I think it is more of a symbol, however, that the president is interested in encouraging women to pursue higher education and career goals. We don’t really have many women to look up to, career-wise, so it’s nice to have some encouragement. I am admittedly biased, as a woman in this society, but sometimes it does feel like women are ignored. That is my own experience, I cannot speak for any others.
Why do we need to encourage women and only women to pursue higher education? They are getting more degrees than men! If anything, we need to encourage men exclusively to pursue higher education.
How are women ignored? Women get special treatment EVERYWHERE. Try starting a business as a poor, white male. Now try doing it as any type of woman.
” I am admittedly biased, as a woman in this society, but sometimes it does feel like women are ignored.” Women and girls are definitely not being ignored. If you do a search on charities for women vs. men, you will find it’s about 500 to 1, including educational charities – an area where girls are graduating at a 20% higher rate than boys. So, the ones who need the help the most are being totally ignored. Literally. If you do a search for named, funded government agencies for women vs. men, you will find it’s about 250 to 1.… Read more »
I was saying I felt ignored, as a woman. There aren’t many role models for women in business or science or really academia. It is slowly changing, but the vast majority of people in power are currently men. So I was saying it’s nice to have the president to encourage women to continue in careers and academia, as women don’t have many role models to follow. Men have many role models in those fields to emulate and encourage them. I wasn’t talking about charities, though. I just meant in careers, it can be difficult as a woman. I don’t know… Read more »
All feelings are valid, and you’re quite correct, the current tide of female academia hasn’t washed to the top of the beach yet.
I’m sure it does sometimes suck to be a woman in your country, but how do you know that your bad experiences exist because you’re a woman, rather than just being regular bad experiences, if you don’t consider the experiences of men?
Personally I try not to put too much weight on the shared experience of masculinity and femininity. Everyone has it different and the only experience you really have is of being you.
You are truly seeing the glass half full. If you’re a young white woman, especially, your opportunities are unlimited if you learn to think positively and see the opporutnities rather than the obstacles. It’s all a matter of having a positive perspective and seeing the opportunities rather than the obstacles. I don’t know where you live but in the United States, the data shows that the majority of managers in business in 2012 are women. Approximately 90% of HR managers are women, which means that there can’t be conscious discrimination against wome in hiring and compensation unless most of it… Read more »
By the way, only about 1% of my business unit are black men, and none in leadership, only white wome and a couple white men. So I have zero role models. Will that hold me back? Only if I let it, and I choose not to.
“The lowest demographic in this country is young black men.”
The group that earns the least in similar jobs with equal education are black women.
I don’t know if you are denying that there is a wage gap between genders and races, but studies consistently report that it exists.
And wow, I’m so sorry if I’m a pessimist, but up above I noted how some Columbia students think it’s okay to refer to women as cumdumpsters, so I feel pretty shitty about being a woman in this country today.
“Some” women think all men should be killed or be kept in concentration camps, so I feel pretty shitty about being a man in this country.
Really. Really. Citation needed, dude. Each comment here makes me lose more respect in men. Is it really so hard to admit that some aspects of life really suck for women in this country? I will concede some aspects suck for men, why can’t you agree that life is shitty for women sometimes. And you know what, that’s great that some women think that, according to you. Please tell me how that affects your life. Because the gender wage gap affects all women. The lack of respect for women affects all women. You know what happens to those misogynists I… Read more »
2 out of Columbia’s 28,000 enrollment made such a statement. Thats too many but its not rational to characterize the entire University’s population of 28,000 as saying that when it was no more than 2.
The gender studies women at Barnard have been no doubt trashing all men as rapists, etc. for many years but of course that’s okay.
I agree that this type of behavior is wrong but I’m not sure if I’m buying the idea that this jumped off because of misogyny. Hatred of women may have been the weapon of choice (one of many weapons that need to be done away with to be sure) but was it the cause? Or was this the case of knucklehead college students wanting to get their hate on and reached for the nearest weapon to attack them with?
Columbia and Barnard are old rivals, this is definitely true. So I would say some of this stems from rivalry. However, I am sure some of these students already held some misogynistic view about Barnard as Barnard is frequently considered the women’s secret entrance into Columbia. Plus, all-women’s colleges don’t get a lot of respect from their co-ed neighbors. I had a friend from Wellesley who said they got crap from MIT students for being “boy-starved.” I do think that there is some resentment towards all-women’s school for getting perceived “preferential” treatment because they are women. I can’t speak entirely,… Read more »
This is a REALLY interesting distinction, Danny.
Hatred is the weapon, but is it the source?
For some people hatred of women may might be the source but for a lot of them I think the source was a hatred of feeling skipped over for their rival and they just wanted something mean to say. Sure you can say something about how hatred of women was the convenient weapon but let’s not confuse someone using hatred of women for a cheap attack with the idea that hatred of women is why they wanted to attack in the first place. I’ll say this. If this had been some commentary against men I bet money that some of… Read more »
If Barnard was a men’s college or a co-ed college, would the students at Columbia have been pleased that the POTUS, a Columbia alumnus, selected the school across the street? I don’t think so.
I don’t see this as a gender issue at all.
Eric go read the comments on the Columbia news sites. It is specifically aimed at Barnard as a women’s college.
Tom, I went to the Columbia Spectator site, read the article and quite a few of the comments and really don’t see an issue related to gender. Maybe some random comment I didn’t see was rude but these are the comments in the article I saw: ““I’m shocked and happy that Barnard will get to have Obama speak at their commencement,” Udell said. “I’m quite disappointed, of course, that President Obama spoke to our sister school, instead of his alma mater.” Donia Abdelaziz, CC ’12, said that women’s issues are as pertinent to Columbia students as they are to Barnard… Read more »
Other comments from Columbia students included the following: * “While you guys were perfecting your deepthroating techniques and experimenting with scissoring and anal play, we were learning Calculus (usually by sophomore year of high school).” * “Barnard is full of academically inferior students that are able to use OUR campus, take OUR classes, and are stereotypically easy to get in bed. We feel like we worked our asses off to get here, and it’s annoying as fuck that Barnard can get the milk for free, so to speak.” * “this is why we hate you cum dumpsters.” * “It’s feminazi’s… Read more »
There were 150 comments on the site I saw. Most were just frustrated that Obama didn’t come to Columbia. As for the 7 of 150 that you cite, here are my observations: The second comment had nothing to do with gender at all, just academics. The fourth comment, possibly the angriest, came from a female student. The fifth comment was a tirade about Barnard’s sexism. The sixth comment had nothing to do with gender. The seventh comment had nothing to do with gender. Mean, hateful comments are wrong but the vast, vast majority had nothing to do with gender. Anyone… Read more »
2) Really? They said the students were stereotypically easy to get into bed. The statement that they are academically inferior is not sexist either? Barnard has incredibly high standards for acceptance. 4) Because women can’t be misogynists either? I have heard some seriously misogynistic bs come from women. I don’t know how they rationalize that in their minds. 5) “Unlike Barnyard financial leeches, I have NO intention of pursuing an Mrs. Degree. I came here to make myself successful, not try to plead at the knees of a Columbia boy to marry her.” This is not sexist? It is implying… Read more »
We can debate these seven but the article was respectful including the quotes and there were over 150 comments total, this using this to represent is a misrepresentation and only serves to inflame. Also, it’s not as if there aren’t seven misandrists at Barnard, which has an active Gender Studies program. . .
The seven aren’t debatable Eric. They were gendered slurs focused on sexual activities, and stereotypes. If the reverse was happening and Barnard women were calling Columbia men “rapists and pedos, limpdicks” or whatever else horrid comments people could use, I feel certain that many people here would call that out as sexism and misandrist. And it would be sexist and misandrist for those comments to occur and wrong. Just as it is wrong, sexist and misogynistic for men to be calling women Jizzholes. It’s ok to actually change your mind Eric or to say…”wow, yeah those comments were sexist and… Read more »
“The seven aren’t debatable Eric. If the reverse was happening and Barnard women were calling Columbia men “rapists and pedos, limpdicks” or whatever else horrid comments people could use, I feel certain that many people here would call that out as sexism and misandrist.” I disagree but let’s set that aside. Barnard has an active gender studies program and there is no doubt that such things have been said in those classes, feminist groups, and hallways. Such things have been said here on a men’s site in many articles (thankfully that has dropped off) and thousands of comments. Even if… Read more »
Must be nice to be right and precise about everything all the time Eric. You should write a book! Sorry for the snark, I know it’s rude, but I get so amazing frustrated with trying to have any kind of dialogue or conversation with you only to seem like I’m playing tennis against a brick wall. We weren’t talking about the other 145, or at least I wasn’t. I was referencing ONLY the comments you said weren’t misogynistic. I’m sure there is misandry at Barnard. There’s probably misogyny at Barnard too! And if there are fraternities at Columbia it’s likely… Read more »
Must be nice to be right and precise about everything all the time Eric.” You’ve got the wrong person – that’s MRS. Eric M. !! haha. I’m kind of rude all the time and you are calm and controlled and stay positive, even when I’m being a PITA. I grant you that four or five of the seven were misogynistic, okay? And, I’m not ever down with that. I just hate seeing things one way so often. There is so much systemic and overt, government funded misandry in this country that never gets mentioned or addressed, but when 5 or… Read more »
Ok. We’re cool. What’s PITA? I have no idea? I know I mess up. I’m happy to admit to being wrong if it means I learn something I need to learn.
I’m not fond of mis-anythings personally, but I’m kind of figuring that’s a feature not a bug of the human species.
most of these comments are from women… why admonish guys when the women are spewing ridiculous vitriol?
I attended a coed school surrounded by women’s colleges. I have heard all this before- FROM WOMEN. The hetero guys tend to really like the situation. You should have heard the vitriol when my date (from a women’s college) had her picture taken met a very notable political figure at an event at my school… At the time I found it endlessly entertaining.
Did you even read any of my comment? I mentioned that there is likely misandry/ogyny at both schools. That wasn’t even the point of my argument.
I don’t think anyone is admonishing men, just misogynists who seem to have come out of the woodwork at Columbia. Not all misogynists are men.
Calling women “stupid jizzholes” has nothing to do with gender, Eric?
Congratulations on showing us all EXACTLY where YOU stand, and how you think of women.
So, one out of 28,000 students made that comment. It’s irrational to argue as if all 28,000 signed a petition saying it.
Surely it is a gender issue: He chose Barnard because it was a women’s college.