In film and television, manhood often means making moves without asking questions.
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Call it being assertive and confident or simply being smooth with the ladies. But don’t leave out the real descriptor: silence. Intimacy and sex in film and television are nearly always at the expense of words. The crucial first-time move – the lean-in for the first kiss, say, is usually done by the man and is usually done in complete silence. That’s what makes it masculine and cool. He’s super aware and “feeling the moment,” but what impact does this have on the way young boys and men handle themselves with women? Might this influence those many young men who get their cues for how to be around women from what they see on TV?
Out of curiosity I spent time on YouTube looking up famous “kissing” scenes from the manly men of our time – James Bond, Clint Eastwood, etc. The one consistency is that they straight up went for it. The “coolness” came from their boldness, their innate and inhuman ability to read the moment, their inner confidence that the woman couldn’t possibly not want them. So they made a move with staggering certainty. No questions asked. Usually the woman went with it, totally swept up in undeniable masculinity, except in this case when she sorta kinda calls him out:
Does this “no questions asked” mentality carry over into other aspects of relationships? Especially when a great article can gain plenty of reads because it offers the alternative – asking questions – as its chief advice:
There is a “simple trick” to women but it isn’t something that tabloids and gossip channels would have you believe. The trick lies in doing one thing over and over. Ask questions. There simply isn’t some way that you can learn to figure her out without ever talking to her.
Brothers, it’s okay and even great to feel and move with the energy of the moment. But if you’re ever uncertain (and even if you’re not) there’s nothing wrong and a whole lot great with simply looking her in the eyes and asking: Can I kiss you?
See Also:
The 7 A’s of Hooking Up. Notice the key word?
NB Rape is when you forcibly use another’s body sexually. It’s not subject to ex post facto definition. It’s not something that someone decides happened with one’s friends the next day. Much of this is, to me, the bureaucratization of sex. Foucault? Weber? Entzauberung.
PS: I’d never ask a woman if she “swallows” or not. I generally let a woman initiate anything like that. I think part of real non-rape sex is he does a thing, she does a thing. But too much talk.
People want to talk about verbal consent as if it is a panacea, the answer to all our concerns. Living in a big city, I remember a time when thugs used to use this tactic to “justify” (legally) their shakedown of people. Four or five guys would walk up to someone and “ask” them for money. Some people feeling intimidated handed over money. I don’t think they really consented. I’ve also seen movies where the villain implies threat to either the woman or her child to get her to “voluntarily” agree to sex. That is cast as something more villainous… Read more »
Here is a question. Why is consent for grown ups only? Would you use the same standard when it applies to a baby? Mothers always ask your babies for permission before kissing them. Does someone lose their right to consent because they’re too young to give it? Is a child property so that a parent can violate the child’s consent? Do we prevent children from forming bonds with their parents because non-verbal ques are the only things they can give? Do we say children’s consent doesn’t matter because it’s more important to build a bond between a child and parent… Read more »
Remember guys, don’t forget your notepad when dating! It’s important that you assume so little agency of her that you do not neglect to ask every possible consent-related question. She is not empowered, and will not tell you what’s important to her, or quickly speak up if you miss a question. It’s not a girls place to speak her mind unless spoken to. The simple act of going on a date implies that either part may make advances. Is it really necessary at that point to ask for kissing? Both men and women have heads capable of turning, last I… Read more »
Examples of sexy consent are SO rare, so few and far behind, the mind boggles to come up with examples.
There is a film called “Save the Date” that I wrote about last year that shows a conversation before a kiss, about said kiss, and it’s HOT and rare and it worked really well.
We need like 10,000 more examples like this!
But ignoring cultural convention/expectations has a price……it’s kind of wrong to saddle guys with yet another burden in the shifting cultural sands of dating. If She is giving him a clear physical go ahead signal, currently asking verbally is not unlikely to negatively affect the encounter. Rapt attention, mirrored movement, moistening of the lips, her closing of the physical distance, the tilting of the head…….there is a clear difference between kissing then and a “stolen kiss”.
Nice article that hits on something that is a conundrum for many men. Here is a small scene from the movie “The Tourist” that is a perfect illustration of what you are saying with regards to the lessons that are gleaned from media. http://youtu.be/RMZVYkRkwmo
Confidence can be a powerful thing for both men and women. But when in doubt you have to not be afraid to talk it out.
Hi Steve You are right about timing and kissing after five years. But let’s move from kissing to having sex. Even I long term relationship , that last for years I appreciate to be asked if I want intercourse or not. I prefer to be asked if I swallow or want him to come (cum) inside me (vagina not mouth). I want to be asked if I want to make love. It can be done in a romantic way,a seductive way, with humor .. It is not a turn off. Some men are sad because they live in sex less… Read more »
Hi Steve You are right about timing and kissing after five years. But let’s move from kissing to having sex. Even I long term relationship , that last for years I appreciate to be asked if I want intercourse or not. I prefer to be asked if I swallow or want him to come (cum) inside me (vagina not mouth). I want to be asked if I want to make love. It can be done in a romantic way,a seductive way, with humor or gravely. It is not a turn off. Some men are sad because they live in sex… Read more »
This is more about men attempting to meet women’s expectations for their media programed expectations of “ROMANCE” than anything else. For most non-player types it can be nerve-racking to anticipate that moment, The tension can take away a heck of a lot of a guys pleasure. Most people yearn for acceptance in an intimate relationship, This manufactured need for the perfect romantic gesture screws that up. Clear and open signals be they verbal or nonverbal are called for.
The options are these:
Ask for consent. Risk being told no.
Don’t ask for consent, risk rape or sexual assault.
Don’t even try to kiss or have sex with anyone, ever.
I can’t see how the first seems unappealing in context of the alternatives.
Stealing a kiss is rather different from telegraphing that you’re going to try…..that includes a time window to decline it. How about women as a group asking 1/2 the time? “Ask for consent. Risk being told no.” Or risk pissing her off by screwing up the moment ……. not talking about a grope/assault/sex…….just the opening of a romantic moment. Sex and/or anything more needs words. As a naive young-teen I tried the ask before each movement bit……It Pissed the girls off, big-time. Start a movement that gets women to state openly and clearly what they want at the start of… Read more »
If a woman is pissed that you asked to kiss her, she’s an asshole.
Why would you want to be with a woman that doesn’t respect asking for consent? If she is pissed over that, and won’t kiss you, then you learned a lesson about that woman.
No, seriously. Explain that to me.
Maybe ’cause it was the 70’s/80’s era, maybe it was the media programed romantic expectations that it violated, maybe it displayed a lack of manliness or romantic ambition in their teen eyes…….. but as a teen it screwed up my romantic ambitions…….and as I was one of 10 kids in a blended family that had 8 teens under a roof at the same time……I got to hear why/how I failed in a at times brutal sisterly postmortem ……with great odds they’d spoken to girl. Late teenage years I dated no-one from my local area to avoid that particular hell…… Things… Read more »
In my discussions about all this with my teen daughters, I’ve explained/talked about the need for them to be clear in their intentions towards boys, the young one is a couple of years away from it, the older one is there now. Funny how last spring she talked about a similar issue between 2 friends that were dating…..both girls……being coy rather than clear had one “cutting” and the other angry. So the expectation that being coy is good/effective/romantic is still out there even here in NYC. Was glad to hear in her mixed HS group the the Gay/straight/Bi thing is… Read more »
It’s great that you have an active role in your daughters’ lives and that you know what’s going on with them. I hope you told your daughter to be in a place where she can support her friend who is engaging in self-harm and that you can be a resource if there’s a chance to help there. I think you’re right that we’re still in a transition period culturally, but I think your examples are extreme. It’s not the 1980s anymore. “Consent” is a well understood subject, the sides of the discussion are popularly known, even if via “first sign… Read more »
We DEFINITELY have a long way to go with teaching young people consent, but the progress is being made.
To some degree the bigger issue is de-programing that segment of the Female dating-age population, of the idea that if He’s the right guy he’ll know when it’s the right time without Clear physical or verbal cues. On the womens side of the equation that idea needs to to be publicly shown to be a ludicrous and childishly silly expectation.
It’s not just about the guys, to a large degree they are just attempting to match women’s expectations of them…….Publicly change those and guys will rather quickly turn about.
Depends how many women get pissed if you ask. Will the majority of women be ok with being asked to kiss? The woman I was with I asked every single step of the way and gave her the choices, “you can touch me there”, etc and it was ok. I wouldn’t think most women would dislike being asked?
“Ask for consent. Risk being told no. Don’t ask for consent, risk rape or sexual assault. Don’t even try to kiss or have sex with anyone, ever.” That’s funny because a lot of men seem to be picking option 3 these days. Ever searched MGTOW? Men know women value confidence, and value men who initiate. There are plenty of polls to prove it. Ask and get told “no” seems to be more the first option. Many women would find that action as unattractive, and may also find it demeaning. The reason you find so few examples may be that most… Read more »
I disagree about Option 3, although I certainly sometimes feel that way on days where I get up on the pessimistic side of the bed. I’m in my 30s, I date women, and I live in an urban center and I do a lot of online dating. I’d say that people in my dating sphere get it and that the women that I date appreciate being asked. But that’s not to say that it’s not still a dilemma to navigate the first kiss. For what it’s worth, I’ve had much better results (like nearing 100% success rate) from asking for… Read more »
” there’s nothing wrong and a whole lot great with simply looking her in the eyes and asking: Can I kiss you?” I think context is everything. Are we talking about liking each other for 5 hours, 5 days, or 5 years? What SHE wants will change depending on the answer. 5 hours: “Can I kiss you?” 5 days: “I’m going to kiss you now” 5 years: silence And those “rules” don’t apply all the time. If the 5 hour girl has leaned within 5 inches of your face and is smiling, kiss her…don’t ruin the moment with words. Sometimes… Read more »
> Mr. Wonderful is pursuing her and she keeps rejecting him. He is unfazed, unrattled, and respectful of her choice. That’s hot. If he gets to kiss her later, fine, If not, fine. So she said no, but she meant yes? And it is okay because “That’s hot?” This is what we mean by “mixed signals”. A man is supposed to remain unfazed and unrattled in the face of rejection? No, the right thing for the man to do is to move on. There are other women out there who actually know what they want, and some of them aren’t… Read more »
Men are supposed to make the first move, in everything. Your supposed to make the kiss happen after reading her nonverbal cues. The man makes the first move for dating, for sex and in time the man is supposed to propose marriage preferably in public and without knowing the answer before hand.
Why must men watch for something as sloppy and prone to misunderstanding like nonverbal cues?
Well for one its safer for the women.
I’d disagree with that statement. That is the classical way of thinking about what a man “must” do. There are tons of variables that go into that particular moment, when the butterflies fill your stomach and you are vulnerable to getting turned down. But! It IS possible to say those words, “Can I kiss you?” and still look like a badass. What’s wrong with playing it safe? There is beauty in being vulnerable and it can still be manly and almost romantic in a certain light.
Personally I find it incredible when the female makes the first move.
PS I firmly believe that women should ask for consent before making any moves as well.
Yes! When my boyfriend and I started dating, he said ‘can I kiss you?’ before our first kiss, and it was THE BEST. It didn’t come out of nowhere because we already knew there were feelings between us, but it was sooo much better than this random swoop in thing that seems to happen in movies. You just ask him if all the romance was ruined from asking! (and no, I don’t think he should have been the one to do the asking because he’s male. I might have done it first, only that wasn’t the way it happened to… Read more »