My Husband Live-Chats with Porn Girls

Watching porn is one thing. Live -chatting with sex workers is another.

Dear Sexes: My husband watches porn which is fine—that really doesn’t bother me—but what bothers me is when he live chats with them. I told him I consider that cheating in a way and it needs to stop if he wants to continue this marriage. And he always needs to look up naked actresses: he does it when I am right next to him but he thinks I don’t notice. Why, in your opinion, do you think he does that? Is it me?

She Said: Without knowing your husband, it’s hard to say why he’s doing this, but I feel pretty confident in saying that there’s nothing about you that causes him to do it.

First, there’s nothing inherently wrong with him looking at porn or even chatting with the live chat women. Always remember that they are hired and paid to be sex workers, they do not love him or care about him. They’re not your competition. They’re just performing a service.

That being said, your boundaries for what are acceptable to you in this monogamous relationship are extremely important. You do get to decide what you’re comfortable with, and he has an obligation to hear you and respect your boundaries.

In this case, figure out what you find acceptable and what you do not. Maybe looking at porn is fine for you, but live chats aren’t. Maybe you’d rather know that he’s looking at the naked actresses than have him keep those things a secret.

Whatever you decide, you have to be clear with him about how you feel when he live-chats, and clear about your boundaries. Find out from him what he truly believes he can honestly commit to, as far as his own boundaries and make sure you’re ready to be receptive to whatever truth he may share with you. If you’re going to freak out and call him names or threaten to leave him just to get him to say he’ll stop doing it, he’s not going to be able to trust you with the truth.

And you need the truth. So be the person he can tell the truth to, to the very best of your abilities. Once you know those truths, and his baseline level of commitment and boundaries, then take some time to decide if that’s the life you want to lead. It may very well be that once it’s all laid out there for you, the relationship will be worth him having chat sex with a sex worker. It could also be that you will never ever be happy in a relationship with someone who is doing that.

There are no judgments coming at you from us no matter what you decide. Relationships work in millions of different ways, at millions of different levels of sexual commitment—all the way from the couple who were both virgins when they met, to couples who are very happily polyamorous, and everywhere in between. There’s no shame in you being okay with him live-chatting. I would only be concerned if you said you were okay with it when you truly weren’t and either started lying about your comfort or putting him in a position where he feels he must hide it from you.

Your job now is to figure out what is going to be best for you. Then the two of you need to figure out how to best serve both your needs while respecting both of your boundaries. In this case, I strongly suggest seeking help from a therapist or couples counselor. A certified sex therapist would probably be even better.

If you can’t find a happy compromise, then you leave. Your happiness and sense of well-being is crucial here. Don’t push them aside because you’re telling yourself that his actions are somehow because of you.

He Said: If I had a dollar for every time we received a question about boyfriends/husbands watching porn I could treat myself to a decent night out on the town. Watching porn isn’t a relationship crime. Often, I can partially defend a boyfriend/husband porn-surfing with the explanation that men are visual, and their porn watching is merely a quick quenching of their aesthetic thirsts (and in most cases, this activity has no reflection on the passion/excitement between partners).

However, I can’t defend the indefensible. Live chats with porn girls is something entirely different. Your husband’s not just looking, now he’s interacting, talking/typing, exchanging, etc. … . Only you can decide what’s cheating to you, but personally, I would consider this a form of cheating. Your husband is spending time with live women (through a computer screen), and his interactions are most likely of the seductive/flirtatious sort. Additionally, the time he’s spending live chatting with these porn girls, he could be spending working on his relationship with you.

Regardless, it only matters how you and your husband define these actions. If you’ve already expressed to your husband, how this behavior hurts you, he needs to explain himself and/or adjust his behavior. If he continues with his live chatting ways, either he doesn’t understand how much you’re offended, or he doesn’t care (or maybe he’s addicted to the attention). Giving him the benefit of the doubt (that he cares about you and is not a bad guy), and make him understand! You’ve made it clear to us, how much this behavior bothers you. Make sure you’re just as clear with your husband. Live chatting with your love should always be more satisfying than live chatting with strangers.

 

Got a question for Eli and Josie? Ask it here.

Originally appeared at She Said He Said.

Read more on Men and Pornography on The Good Life.

Image credit: Mr. Stabile/Flickr

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About She Said He Said

Eli and Josie, friends since college, realized how lucky they were to have one another—an honest friend of the opposite sex who tells it like it is. They wanted to share that with the world and so www.shesaidhesaid.me was born.

Comments

  1. The Wet One says:

    Eh, why don’t we just accept that that porn is a relationship offense. It’s clearly a reason to end a relationship and to not start one.

    Fair enough? Can we all live with that?

    Now, almost all the men and about 30% of women go over there ——>

    <——— And 70% of women an a tiny fraction of the men go over there.

    Everyone stay in their respective corner and we can all be happy.

    Deal?

    Tiresome topic this one, but given that the foregoing solution is not tenable, I guess we'll all have to learn to live with this.

    Sigh….

    • Isn’t that where we already are? Most men in a corner without enough women? At least, that’s my perception… that most women don’t have the kind of sexuality that will make most men happy.

      I think the most honest answer is that 70% (who knows the true stats) will drift over to the other corner because a starving man has to eat.

  2. What is he talking about? I’ve seen some of the chats in the webcam women rooms and sometimes they’re just about “show me this, show me that” and other times they’re talking about random stuff like sports, hobbies, the news, etc. One is directorial, the other is more like friends.

    One suggestion is to maybe sit n watch n talk to the actor yourself n see if it’s as bad as you feel.

  3. the percentage of women cheaters is the same as men, if not higher.

    The thing is that a large proportion of male cheaters, cheat with prostitutes, go to strippers etc. Because for most men, these are the only options outside their relationship/marriage.
    women dont have to cheat with male prostitutes. Women can easily obtain sex outside marriage.

    If we ban prostitution, Its true that many men wont cheat (they wont be able to) But women would still do so.

    • Keep being so negative about life won’t solve any Issues.

      • whats the issue? There’s no issue. Its just a phenomenon. I’m not complaining. It is what it is and I’m only explaining why paid sex exists.

    • “Its true that many men wont cheat (they wont be able to) But women would still do so.”

      Sorry–logically this doesn’t make sense. Unless the women are cheating with other women, they’re cheating with men. So….men are having sex too. The women have to be having sex with *someone*.

      • Nothing illogical about it if the alpha male truly does exist. 1 guy with multiple gf’s, so the majority of men wouldn’t cheat but far more women could cheat, just they’re all sharing the same rooster:P

      • Aya

        In order to have the opportunity to be promiscuous men need to be good looking, charming and popular. Casual sex, flings, affairs are not something that many men can pull off.

        Women can be mediocre in every aspect and still be as sexually active and adventurous as they want. Furthermore, Average looking women can easily have casual sex with good looking men out of their league.

        Women are a lot more selective and have high standards regarding sex partners, than men.

  4. She said:
    “That being said, your boundaries for what are acceptable to you in this monogamous relationship are extremely important. You do get to decide what you’re comfortable with, and he has an obligation to hear you and respect your boundaries.”
    What do you mean by boundaries? Looking for a definition I found:
    “Personal boundaries are guidelines, rules or limits that a person creates to identify for him- or herself what are reasonable, safe and permissible ways for other people to behave around him or her and how he or she will respond when someone steps outside those limits.”
    If the husbnd live-chats with sex workers only when his wife is not present, in which way is it behaviour “around her”? Now if he has promised her not to do such a thing, then there would be a case, but unlike having sex, it doesn’t seem to be a general consensus that live-chatting with sex workers is cheating and this couple doesn’t seem to have established that before committing.
    She said:
    “…and he has an obligation to hear you and respect your boundaries.”
    Related to the above: what if a husband has a newfound “boundary” that his wife has to wear a burqa in public, would you say the wife has an obligation to respect her husband’s “boundaries”?

    • everyone gets to define their boundaries in the sense that we are all free to walk away from a relationship. That’s how it works.

      • Sarah:
        “everyone gets to define their boundaries in the sense that we are all free to walk away from a relationship.”
        I don’t understand what the connection between “boundaries” and “walk away from a relationship” is. You are always free to walk away from a relationship, even if you have no reason to do so and your partner is perfect. But you didn’t address my other point: Why should anybody have an obligation to respect somebody else’s boundaries. If boundaries can be arbitrary, they can also be controlling and crazy. Like if I told you, that it is my boundary that you don’t drink coffee. Would you have to respect such nonsense?

        • coffee drinker says:

          I’m glad someone said it! They can have my coffee when they pry it from my cold dead hands!

          If the man in this piece has an obligation to respect her boundaries, she certainly has an obligation to set reasonable ones. Both, really big if’s.

          But, why not turn marriage into a showdown full of ultimatums?

        • QuantumInc says:

          Because ultimately in a loving relationship you MUST RESPECT THEIR FEELINGS. If doing something hurts the other person’s feelings in any way, then that is also damaging the relationship itself. You can’t have a loving relationship if you are doing things that make them hate you. Maybe you can’t understand their reasons, maybe their reasons are irrational, but if you can’t respect their request, you must at least respect the consequences of your actions. If your actions cause the person you love and trust to feel bad about themselves or feel badly about you, you’ve got to stop.

          Boundaries are more than requests, they are things that bring terrible emotional consequences for that person. If you have a close loving relationship, you are required to look out for their feelings and thus to respect their boundaries.

          Obviously, if their boundaries, or whatever word you choose to use, are so intolerable that you can’t respect them, then the relationship is doomed and you should get out. If you find such a request disgusting, controlling and crazy, then essentially you have a boundary against such boundaries and the relationship is doomed anyway.

          • I have a hard time understanding your words.
            QuantumInc:
            “Because ultimately in a loving relationship you MUST RESPECT THEIR FEELINGS.”
            What do you mean by “MUST”? If you mean it as a moral imperative, I disagree; not all feelings deserve respect.
            “You can’t have a loving relationship if you are doing things that make them hate you.”
            What do you mean with you can’t, is there some law? You say “can’t” and still people gravely hurt the feeilngs of the people who close to them and the relationships continue. Just because does something that hurts me badly, it does not follow that I will hate them
            “Boundaries are more than requests, they are things that bring terrible emotional consequences for that person. If you have a close loving relationship, you are required to look out for their feelings and thus to respect their boundaries.”
            Again what do you mean by “required”? Do you mean morally or that otherwise the relationship will not work. In both cases I would disagree. Although I would agree that there are essential emotional needs and not respecting those in your partner lowers the chances of the relationship continuing or being happy. But there are also “emotional needs” which are stupid and then it shows more respect for the person, not to respect those “needs” and it is likely also better for the relationship with this person.
            “Obviously, if their boundaries, or whatever word you choose to use, are so intolerable that you can’t respect them, then the relationship is doomed and you should get out.”
            So you claim that “the relationship is doomed” in this case, do you have any evidence that this is necessarily true?
            “If you find such a request disgusting, controlling and crazy, then essentially you have a boundary against such boundaries and the relationship is doomed anyway.”
            This is my main problem with the word boundaries. In your view my “boundaries” might violate somebody else’s boundaries. Now such a situation of conflicting “boundaries” has a moral dimension. One person’s “boundaries” might be reasonable (his right) and there is a moral obligation of others to respect those “boundaries”; this is what I would call a boundary. And there are other expectations of how other people should act; those are usually called entitlements.
            While I agree roughly with the advice in this post (it is reasonable to feel jealous in a monogamous relationship, when your husband live-chats with sex workers), it is not so much a question of boundaries, as of controlling of the behaviour of the spouse.
            In Spanish “esposa” means spouse and “esposas” means handcuffs.

            • I didn’t get the impression from the article they were trying to say that either partner has to control the others’ behavior, far from it. He basically said that she needs to decide what her boundaries are (which I think in this case sort of mean “deal breakers”, things that she knows she could never be happy with in the long term). Once she’s decided, then she needs to share her feelings with him, giving him the chance to decide what his boudaries/deal breakers are. Ideally, they will meet in the middle, he may give up the chat girls and she may accept the porn. Sometimes you have to compromise in relationships. It is up to the two people involved to decide if something is worth compromising to keep the other happy. He might compromise on chat girls, she might compromise on the porn. Either might compromise on other issues unrelated to this one. However, if one of them isn’t willing to compromise at all, and they can’t reach an agreement, then one or both of them may decide to end the relationship and seek someone else with more similar values/lifestyle. It takes two to make a relationship, and I haven’t seen successfull one yet that didn’t involve some compromise from both parties.

  5. There was a time when porn was seen as cheating too. I suspect in another ten years, talking over the computer with other women will be perfectly acceptable to men. It’s only because this is a newer type of porn, that people are more resistant to it in their relationships. Soon men will be defending this as well.

    Funny though how women don’t defend communicating with men in sexy flirty ways under the justification that women are so “verbal”. Yet all day long women have to hear about how “visual” men are. How much men need porn because of how “visual” they are. Yet we all know that most women use more words then men. We know that women love to communicate. Yet it’s perfectly unaccecptable to seek out verbal communication that is sexual with other men, either online or face to face. Yet it’s okay for men to seek out images because of their “visualness”.

    Sometimes it feels like men don’t really love their women at all. And that what is most important to men is looks and sex.

    • Sometimes I feel women dont really love me for who they are and desire them for their bodies ad what they look like. They just want men for their usefulness in life.

      If we do a a large scale survey, We’ll see more men complaining about lack of sexual interest from their wives than vice versa.

    • I think it’s because words are interacting, whereas watching porn is passive and relies solely on what the actress/actor does without direction.

    • coffee drinker says:

      Sometimes I read your posts and you seem really bothered that men aren’t women. That we don’t think, act, love, and fuck like women.

    • QuantumInc says:

      I would be okay with my girlfriend flirting with other guys. However I would imagine most guys would not. I would imagine it would bring a strong sense of jealousy similar to the question asker above, and you could debate endlessly how “legitimate” that jealousy is. It involves real interaction with real people, and may or may not harm the relationship. The verbal equivalent of a pornographic film isn’t flirting, it’s a romance novel, or some erotic poem or story.

      There is a massive stereotype that men only want to be close to women for the sake of sexual access. Any scientific examination shows that this isn’t true most of the time, though it’s more true of men to seek pussy than for women to seek cock to the exclusion of personalities.

      • The important thing is that if a man wants to express his sexuality by watching whatever and interacting however–he MUST be ok with me expressing my sexuality with other men. No hypocrisy. I need to get my outside sexual kicks too.

  6. A husband live chatting with sex workers is ok and not cheating? I agree he’s not actually having sex with them, but, seriously — I would not tolerate it in a relationship. How would he like it if his wife was having sexy chats with random guys?

  7. Also, I disagree that the sex workers are “not competition'” They are absolutely competition for his time and sexual and emotional energy. He’s looking at porn right next to her ? That ‘s mean and disrespectful. I would ask him — why are you even in a relationship? What are you getting out of your marriage ? Do you value your relationship with her? Honestly, he sounds like a jerk and she should consider looking for someone who will be more interested in having an actual relationship with her. Maybe the porn is a sign that he is just not that into her or the marriage.

    • married guy says:

      I agree. To the extent that a picture of a woman on a screen is able to “compete” with a living breathing person in your own house… certainly, it’s a reflection of value and whether he’s very into her/marriage.

      I’d suspect, however, that he’s looking for something he’s not getting from her. Whether he’s a jerk or she’s a frigid shrew, or some other assortment of stereotypes… who can say?

    • QuantumInc says:

      First off, if there is even a slight difference in libido, or even willingness to express yourself sexually, then the person with greater libido is going to need something extra to stay satisfied and avoid feelings of sexual frustration. It seems that it is usually the woman in a heterosexual relationship who either has a lower libido or is hesitant to have more sex.

      Secondly, porn, masturbation, chatting with sex workers, these are fundamentally different experiences, and different expressions of one’s sexuality compared to making love with your wife. Some people feel the need for both, for multiple ways of having sex. I suppose the solution is sexual experimentation, but I would hesitate to suggest that unless both parties wanted more out of their sex lives.

  8. The woman doesnt metio anything about the sex life. Is he interested i having sex with her when she offers? Maybe he feels she isnt enthusiastic about having sex with him.

    It is ironic that many women are insecure over not being attractive to their husbands in whom they have little sexual interest, themselves !

    • married guy says:

      Exactly. I think this got off track with the first sentence: “Without knowing your husband, it’s hard to say why he’s doing this, but I feel pretty confident in saying that there’s nothing about you that causes him to do it.”

      I’m pretty confident her husband could rattle off a few things about her that lead to this behavior. Likewise, I’m sure she could list a few of his failings.

      Or maybe he just needs to know how much this bothers her. I’m sure his online habits are a reflection of their marital bliss.

    • QuantumInc says:

      This has come up on the GMP before. The mainstream model of sexuality insists that men are the ones who are sexually desiring, and the women are the ones who are sexually desirable. Often the only way for a man to feel sexy and physically attractive is to go to a gay bar.

      Women face a lot of sexual shame growing up. Some might learn that sex is something to avoid long before they learn what it is. Comprehensive sex education is way more likely to bring up male masturbation than female masturbation, more likely to bring up sexual disease than the clitoris. Abstinence only sex education often straight up tells little girls and boys “Sexual contact RUINS women.” But that’s not the only thing in our culture to make that claim.

      Meanwhile the only shame men receive around sex is if they don’t do it enough, or aren’t good at it. (Women sometimes receive similar shame, creating a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation). With this sort of upbringing it’s no wonder that men are more sexual than women.

      There’s a lot of stuff that insists that romance is the domain of women, and sex the domain of men. However these are things that don’t really make sense unless all the people involved desire it. Thus you get women desperately seeking romantic men and finding few, and men desperately seeking sexual women and paying $34.99 a month to watch internet videos.

      • Not so sage says:

        Actually, I think the mainstream model of sexuality makes a lot of sense for a lot of people. Certainly there are exceptions, but are you saying there aren’t in fact more women looking for romantic men? Or that men generally aren’t the ones who are looking for sex and paying for internet (and other) videos?

  9. Any woman can flirt with the hot guys in her workplace, in public, bars etc. An average looking woman can easily have sex with any of her male friends.

    Most men philander with hookers and on these online dating sites. Women just dont get caught having fun on the side because sex comes so naturally to them.

  10. Why not try flirting with men online, as long as it doesn’t go too romantic and cause you to leave him? It could take the edge off. Women’s sexuality has a lot to do with being desired. Sometimes porn alone doesn’t fulfill that, and chatting and flirting does. Chatting and sending pictures is a great way to go. If he can do it, so can you. :)

    • and lets no forget, women can do it much more easily.
      Sex is sometimes more easier for women to obtain than food and air.

      Any woman can have an affair with a man much better looking than her husband.

  11. The day when men no longer have to spend every waking moment worrying about what women will ‘tolerate’ from them is coming soon. And sites like this play a part in helping that day arrive even sooner. Viva la Revolution!

  12. I think women shouldn’t mind if their men look to internet porn, strip clubs and live chatting as an outlet.
    Women can get their validation from their male friends, acquaintances and coworkers. Women can flirt with men for real, and easily have affairs. Women are desirable outside the relationship as well. Most men are only desirable to one woman (they are in a relationship with). Most men are just invisible to women at large. But when an average looking woman goes out, plenty of men check her out and hit on her. In the workplace an average nerdy plain jane can easily have sex with the charming popular guy on the floor.

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  14. I’m so tired of hearing about how women have it easier because they can get laid easier. Yes, it’s true, technically having a vagina means you can probably find someone who will put parts of himself into it if given the chance. It doesn’t mean you can easily find someone who will satisfy you sexually, and it doesn’t make it any easier to find a good relationship. If you’re a very attractive woman you can be choosy, but if you’re not, you can find guys to fuck and run but few to stick around. Whereas an unattractive man still has other ways of getting a girlfriend, often a girlfriend way more attractive than himself, if he is smart and respected, charming and funny, or has money, power or fame. None of that will help an ugly woman get anything.

    • Rowan, you are talking about extremes.
      I cant even begin to point out the logical fallacies in your post.

      An average looking woman has much more dating AND sexual opportunities than an average looking man. You see, I am making a comparison between equals…ie men and women who are on a similar level of attractiveness.

      Some people like to disregard and de-value the obvious and unmistakable advantages women have in the realm of attracting the opp sex, dating and sex, by saying things like “men would fcuk anything that moves, sure its easy for a woman to have a man put his penis inside her vagina”. It shows the clear discomfort and reluctance on part of people like you to acknowledge those advantages. It makes some people very uncomfortable with admitting that women have an upper hand in some aspect of life.

      In between ‘fcuking and running” and “marriage/LTR” there are many things – there is dating, hooking up, Flings, Friends With Benefits, affairs, casual relationships and so on. Women can do all this easier than men.

      An average looking woman can be as sexually active and adventurous as they want to be. There are countless women who are promiscuous and reaping full benefits of this ‘dynamic’. There are some women who dont want this and its their choice…its a self imposed limitation. Most men dont have the option to be promiscuous.

      Its funny you talk about ‘quality of sex’. Women can obtain casual sex with men who are much more attractive than them. much more popular, successful, charming than themselves. I have seen how women who are mediocre in every aspect have flings with the most attractive and popular guy in the proximity ( workplace, dorm, class, hostel) and have a good laugh about it. Women actually want casual sex relationship and flings with attractive men only, no matter how average they are themselves. And you talk as if they can only get a short bald fat shcmuck to bang them. And remember I am talking about AVERAGE LOOKING women, not very attractive ones. Average looking women have plenty of choice.

      As far as relationships and marriage is concerned, men dont have it any better than women. Unattractive and old men have more opportunities because they bring money and security to the table. THEY ARE NOT DESIRABLE in the relationship ! Its more about what the women want in such relationships. Women hate to be wanted for these reasons. They hate to be seen as a utility and loved for how useful they are rather than what they look like. I guess men need to learn some self respect from women.

      Women actually have no shortage of men they can date and have relationships with as well. whats difficult is to find a man who will put more effort than her in the relationship, who will ‘court’ her. Whats difficult, is to find a husband who will commit to her for life, a provider and someone willing to raise children with her. They dont have a shortage of men willing to be their lovers, sex partners and provide them companionship.

      Women are also more selective and idealistic about their partners. The concept of Ms Right doesnt exist among men. Most average looking men have extremely few requirements an would be happy if an average looking woman is nice to them and gives them some attention. Women are likely to reject a large number of men because they are ‘losers’.

      Fat women can easily date fat men, ugly women can easily date ugly men, nerdy/shy/boring girls can easily date men who have the same drawbacks, disabled women can easily date disabled men, short women can easily date short men, autistic women can easily date autistic men, broke/poor/unemployed women can easily date broke poor/unemployed men…BUT THEY DONT. Because they still have ‘standards’, they pride themselves for not being ‘desperate’.

      Only a very small proportion of women are ugly. Men are a lot more forgiving to women on their looks. Men find a variety of women attractive atleast to some extent. Around 80% of young adult women are attractive atleast to some extent. But men are mostly considered ugly and unattractive. When you talk about unattractive men, you dont realize that youre talking about more than 50% of young adult men because women consider majority of men to be unattractive. A woman would have to morbidly obese or hideous to be considered unattractive.

      • Even if that is true, then LET your woman be promiscuous if you’re getting your kicks through web chatting. You can’t get yours through chatting and p0rn and not let hers get them anywhere.

        And you’re wrong that casual sex can be fulfilling just because the guy is attractive and popular. That matters very little. There needs to be a connection and a story.

        • Hell no, if he’s getting his kicks through chat n porn, why shouldn’t she be limited to chat n porn vs real life sex? It’s like you get the cookie, she gets the cake.

          • It doesn’t always work that way. It’s like telling someone who dislikes sushi “hey, if I get sushi, so do you!” One person gets all of the benefits and the other one doesn’t.

            • But your not comparing her reading romance novels or erotica, but him watching a video n typing vs her actually touching, feeling, and adding the sti risk, pregnancy risk on top. They’re 2 very different things.

              If he was going to prostitutes I could understand but in no sane world is it a fair trade for one to look at porn n talk to the pornstar and the other gets actual sex.

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