This comment, from MediaHound to Liz was on the post “As Equals and as Friends: Amanda Marcotte’s reply to Tom Matlack.“
Liz,
I have to say that I agree whole heartedly with your concerns about The Binary Gender World View and the damage it causes to people who do not fit within it. I recognize your concerns about reprising all the relevant material – and I recognize your jaded view of how little it would be read and considered. If I have to yet again explain why forms with tick boxes for gender, with only two options of male and female, are wrong and even discriminatory, I may just scream! Very Loudly.
I have to disagree with you on The Idea that Tom has a limited world view that excludes others. Tom has his world view, as we all do, which is informed by our own experiences and existence within the world. That does not make it right – it just makes it what it is.
I have not seen Tom at any point indicate or claim that his world view is correct or right – in fact the setting up of GMP indicates quite clearly that Tom is not only willing to question his own world view, but he’s allowing and empowering others to do the same. Now that is to me courageous and even very Manly – It’s a Good Man Thing.
I can understand Tom’s Frustrations and even his use of Irony in light of the number of people who have come along, seen what he is doing an assumed that they have the right and even the obligation to impose their world view upon Tom and What he is doing.
So recently people have been on the streets under the banner of “Occupy”. They are not imposing a world view, they keep on promoting questioning of World Views. It seems that Tom is in tune with culture and the need to Question.
So I have to wonder why so many believe they have the right to impose their World Views and ideals upon Tom’s work?
It strikes me as anti-cultural and antisocial – and then when Tom rightfully and reasonable expresses frustration, he is the one held to account?
Hmmmm? I think that some really do need to look at what is going on and who is doing what!
It’s like that Tick Box issue – A or B. Tom seems to be Looking at and for other Options, so why are some so willing to have their pens handy and demand that it’s A or B?
Why is it that when they don’t get the answer They want, they scribble at high speed all over the Net about Tom being wrong?
“The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.”
George Bernard Shaw
It’s evident that some wish to see Tom as The Unreasonable Man.
In that case they can count me as well.
I hope they have enough Ink and pens to keep up with the comments! P^)
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photo: cmichel67 / Flickr
Trying to address men’s issues and simultaneously maintain credibility with modern feminism… I don’t envy Tom his position, or all the plates he has to keep spinning on those poles.
Copy I agree I am also getting fed up with people who are using what I see as swear words and cuss words when referring to Tom and GMP. They are sneakily got past the Filters and keep appearing all over the place. They are extremely pernicious and I wish that more people would call them out. I see people using these cuss words when they say “Tom is trying to do…” Did you spot the cuss? It comes as a three letter word. TRY. Tom has made it clear where his roots lie. He said “social justice was (and… Read more »
Tom: OK I got a mens website but I’m cool, really!
Feminists: No, you got cooties
Tom: You’re mean!
Feminists:Misogynist.
This made me laugh, DavidByron.
It was my first draft trying to understand the dynamics. I do find it interesting to look at how people behave. Now I’ve got a day off I didn’t expect and bizarrely I appear to be using it to read that twitter conversation carefully. When the feminists say “No, you got cooties” they are basically saying that they are really suspicious of Tom because his stuff smacks of all that “men have issues too” stuff the MRAs are always on about. So their reaction is to pick on him for silly stuff and then they start to talk up their… Read more »
I just think defensiveness and that particular kind of Nyah Nyah doesn’t help anyone get anywhere. Eh. This whole week has driven me to gin!
Marcotte said at one point, “It’s demonizing to portray women as a faceless mass of man-haters who nag men into submission.” So this is a reaction to Tom’s really very pianissimo suggestion that maybe “men got issues too”, and it’s a total maximal, all hands on deck, death con 5 sort of reaction. Is it possible to say men have issues without it being “demonizing women”? Possibly. But only by a very trusted source that a feminist would know wouldn’t really mean it, or would cache it carefully within a context of “but women are much worse off of course”.… Read more »
That’s quite an idea, DB. A$$holisheness as superior performance art for social justice promotion 😉 We might have the beginnings of an amazing artistic collaboration 🙂
Oooooh I wonder if Tom got the wrong idea about why they were all angry with him? He said, That doesn’t mean that I believe in a binary/essential view of gender. But from what I can see only Jenn Pozner had that issue with him. She was quite pedantic but she was not angry with him. She just determined to read him wrong. Tom: Is a good man more like a woman or more truly masculine? Pozner: rests on assumption that there’s only 1 way to be “truly masculine.” Many ways Tom: not at all [tries to explain] Pozner: That’s… Read more »
I can see that Off Broadway and getting awards! P^)
But who would you cast?
I’m discouraged by the emergence of what what I’m starting to consider a pro-Tom propaganda train. Certainly people are entitled to agree or disagree with him, but when those comments that praise him receive such positive foregrounding as this and those that criticize him are labeled as “feminist wrath,” I find myself displeased with the narrative being constructed. From a site that claims to actively represent multiple view points, I’m disappointed by the poorly disguised bias being displayed by the very founder. Such a trend of behavior makes me thankful for Hugo Schwyzer’s response to the recent debate, a response… Read more »
Boston – I agree with your concerns, though I have to disagree with you over the quality of the work of a certain contributor. However considering the level of Tom Bashing that has been going on, not just here but across the net in general, I am actually glad that some have chosen to be a bit defensive around him. I also note that through all the Tom bashing and critiquing so many haven’t even had the courtesy to ask him if he’s alright. Rather selfish and self centered from where I’m sitting. Remember I have stated that I don’t… Read more »
Bloomin Hell!
I’m honored that you considered my comment in this way!
I just considered it a way to make clear that Tom may be portrayed as unreasonable, but that does not stop him being a Good Man!
I had better buy some extra ink! P^)