Do you need to learn how to be a good guy on a sidewalk?
Let it be known how much I love Jezebel. Every day I go there, poke around, read a bunch of stuff I agree with, some stuff I disagree with, link something or another to my Facebook page…
But this one stopped me in my tracks. Mostly because I’m just not sure what to make of it. It’s called How To Be A Good Guy On The Sidewalk. They introduce it like this:
A number of men have asked us the same question recently: if you’re walking on a dark street near a lady, how can you let her know you’re not a threat? So this week, we offer some tips for dudes who’d like to help women feel more comfortable in public spaces.
I guess my first question would be, are Jezebel’s male readers really the ones who need this guide?
Beyond that, does anyone who voluntarily reads a guide about how to be less obtrusive on a sidewalk actually need a guide for that purpose?
This author (Anna North) is definitely doing something good: she’s being clear about how to make women comfortable. I have guys ask me this same question all the time: guy friends, guys Eli‘s and my sex and dating advice blog, She Said He Said, and guys here at GMP. Good men really do want to know how to ask out a girl without being a complete douchenozzle and making her uncomfortable. And it’s cool that you guys ask. We need your advice sometimes, too, on how to relate to guys (hence the birth of She Said He Said).
Probably the best advice in this article is about how to actually talk more to a woman without her feeling unsafe. I know it’s unfair that you should have to bear the burden of all those a-holes before you who made her feel unsafe, but the fact is, if you care about her comfort, it should matter to you. Just as it should matter to her if she’s making you uncomfortable—and yes, I’ve seen women make men uncomfortable plenty of times.
This is probably the most useful bit of advice offered by their expert, Holly Kearl:
If a man really wants to approach a woman to meet her, he should pick a populated area and preferably not do it when he is with friends but she is alone or when it’s dark. He could start off with a hello and neutral small talk and if she reacts well — smiling and eye contact — then continue on to asking more about herself or asking for her phone number. But making sure it is a setting where she will hopefully feel comfortable is important or else he could make her feel unsafe from the start without meaning to.
But I’d add even more to that, you don’t have to ask for her phone number. Just write down your number and hand it to her. If she’s interested, she’ll call. If she’s not, she won’t and you can just pretend that she must’ve accidentally lost your number…
All joking aside, this isn’t so much about whether people need the advice as it is about the tone set in this article which, to me, presumes that men don’t know how to be “normal” around women. And maybe some of you don’t… And maybe you do need an article like this. I’m really not sure, I don’t have the answers.
So I turn it over to you guys: Does a guide like this help or harm men? Does it harm women by making them feel they are too weak to speak for themselves, to defend themselves?
Are there guys you know who definitely do need a guide for being less creepy? (Personally, I think there are, but much less so than this article would have you believe—but what do you think?)
And what would a guide for how women can be less creepy toward men read like?
Photo by Mykl Roventine
Like I said, it is by no mean your obligation, it’s just the thing a decent human being would do. I’m not saying it’d make you some sort of hero or anything or some kind of incredible person either. It’s really, really basic courtesy and, yeah, essentially the absolute-bare-minimum required to be a decent Human being. I guess that even such basic human decency if too much for some. Basically, some men seem completely devoid of the capacity for basic empathy, and that’s the crux of the issue: “Why should *I*, as a privileged man, have to change side-walk? Even… Read more »
I agree that being mindful of others is something important to bear in mind even if its not in a situation where person A is specifically trying to talk to or show interest in person B. However…
After thinking about a bit a few months ago I’m still left wondering. How can we say that men must learn to accommodate women but its racist to so much as imply that black people should learn to accommodate white people?
“Are there guys you know who definitely do need a guide for being less creepy?” Creepy is a subjective assessment, often used by women who are approached by any , normal man to whom she does not feel attracted. It is the put down that will harm his self-esteem and, hopefully, drive him away more permanently than a polite no. “Creepy” is an appeal to any other men present to attempt to elicit the “protection” response and give men they are attracted to a chance to white knight for them. I own my creepiness, I know where it comes from… Read more »
Stop projecting your feeling of inadequacy. Women have a right to be outside and not made to live in constant fear of assault. It has literally nothing to do with women’s general lack of attraction and/or repulsion towards you and everything about simple basic liberty of movement. When a women you don’t know walks near you, keep your distance a bit or cross the sidewalk. Stop and check your email. Anything. It’s really not that complicated you know. No, you have no obligation to, just like you have no obligation of not being a douchebag I guess. It’s just what… Read more »
You start by telling men to stop projecting their own inadequacies and then you turn around and put the condition on men that if they weren’t scummy they would go out of their way to make women feel safe.
Instead of belly aching about male privilege (the usual fall back when women want to bully men) how about you not try to shame men into policing themselves for you?
I was photographing a very beautiful model today and had the odd car or 2 driving past with the guys whistling, cheering etc. Thankfully the model was fine with it and we laughed about it, the guys themselves also seemed to be quite tame, no negative comments just the random compliment going past.
Is it more common to get the random attention like that which is intended to be innocent and just a compliment by the guy vs the nasty stuff I seem to hear about?
This is mostly about perceptions. The fact is that men tend to underestimate and women overestimate the probability of violence in just about every situation. These inaccurate perceptions have gotten worse in recent years, not better.
This is hilarious. Jezebel is recommending the same things I was called out on this website for. Including being called pathetic. I guess we know who the real feminists are now don’t we? LOL
As someone who actually has to deal with being afraid of all people at all times, I find the overblown theatrics of these articles and their proponents disgusting. It is an element of my mental condition that I experience a strong fight or flight response upon encountering another human being. Above and beyond that, my mind defaults to a state of extreme nervous tension that leaves me jumpy, susceptible to fear and acutely aware of everyone around me as a threat rather than the state of relaxation common to the vast majority of mankind. Neither of these qualities respond to… Read more »
What I’m gathering from these comments is that dudes don’t want to be accommodating to women in any way? What does it kill you to be a little more mindful in how you go about your business? I’m a black guy living in the south. People of all designations are going clutch their bags, pull their children close, and go out of their way to avoid me on the sidewalk, even though I’m short and have a slight frame. A lot of people have preconceived notion about what a young black man on the street will do to them at… Read more »
“Unlike my blackness, our maleness is a trait you can find in all rapists.” Wrong, female rapists exist and at quite a significant rate. Please stop spreading lies, men already have a tough enough time being trusted without more bullshit perceptions of sexual assault being ONLY perpetrated by men. “So make her life and your world a little easier by making yourself appear a little friendlier. What’s it going to hurt?” Question is, what is enough? Why should we be pandering to the fears of others? It’s a nice gesture yes but if men stopped doing the highly avoidant activity,… Read more »
You do know that “massa” was the first one to claim that you black men are out to rape white women. Sorry but as a black professional I REFUSE to buy into that stereotype. I work with and around white women all day every day. I don’t rape white or any other color women, and they have no reason to fear me. I don’t go out of my way to be friendly because I am friendly in general. I am cordial, polite, and courteous in general – to everyone, black, white, male, female, young, old. If you (or I) have… Read more »
I just noticed something in your explanations of white people being uncomfortable with black people and women being uncomfortable with men.
You open with declaring that women have a legitimate reason to be uncomfortable with men but say absolutely nothing about the legitimacy of white people that are uncomfortable with black people.
If a woman assumes every male is a rapist, of course she’s going to be afraid of any and all strange men. Just another way feminism has made things worse for both men and women.
Got a good laugh at this one. Sorry Johanna,not much I can do to look “Less Creepy”. I’m no Micheal Fassbender (on either end). I’m old and wrinkled’and if you see me after a rough day at work, I can look somewhat grungy. However, I’m the last guy on earth that would assult any women . When I se a woman your age, Ithink of my daughters, awoman in her 50’s, my Wife or sisters, in the 80’s you say, my mother. The point is , I treat these women like I would like my daughters, wife, sisters or mother… Read more »
To me, the Jezebel piece is failing to make a clear enough distinction between internal and external things. A fear reaction may be an understandable response to the situation, but it is still an internal response. Even if it’s warranted in some cases, it is still from inside the person feeling afraid. If I walk on a sidewalk in such a way that triggers something in you, that’s not me forcing you to feel that way. That is your interpretation of something that may happen in the future. This kind of piece is to some degree imposing one person’s internal… Read more »
Here’s something I just can’t seem to get my head around. Maybe someone can explain it so I can understand. Scenario 1: I’m walking down the street after dark and I hear the sound of approaching footsteps behind me. Due to events in my past, I immediately become edgy and alert for danger. I stop walking and take a step to my left as I turn and watch for whoever is approaching me. I am not moving until I find out what is behind me and if I think it poses a threat to me. I then watch the person… Read more »
Once I heard men yelling at me from up above while they were working on a building. At first I got uncomfortable because I knew they were watching me walk across a parking lot. Internally I told myself to relax and that they can’t hurt me from up there. Any yelling and watching of construction men, we assume is going to be frightening, right? I decided to focus and listen to WHAT they were saying, “Helllloooo Beautiful Angel! Wow! There is a God.” I smiled. They laughed. I waved. They said, “Have a nice day.” I returned the sentiment. They… Read more »
I’ve wondered how much of the street harassment is simply dumbasses trying to compliment and tell a woman she is beautiful. They could think the girl would be ok with it or like it because it’s a compliment that they themselves would like to hear, but I think some…maybe many wouldn’t realize that it might not be a compliment most women want to hear. Wolf whistling I’ve seen here in Aus was always used simply to say a person is beautiful/sexy. Lame attempts to compliment someone but I guess the intention could be seen as different by some which would… Read more »
Personally I hate any kind of yelling or catcalls, even the “you’re an angel” variety. I don’t understand why someone thinks it’s appropriate to interrupt my day to make a stupid remark at me. I don’t think it’s threatening, just cheesy and stupid.
I paroused that site and it’s clear that it’s hostile to males. Whatever advice it offers comes from a place of malice toward males.
That was one of the most bizarre articles I have ever read. It was just really weird…like are most women afraid of random guys they see on the street? Really? Is there actually this great need to tell guys how not to be creepy or something? Because most of the time I’m not freaked out buy random guys on the street. And on the rare occasion that I am…I totally recognize that it’s my problem, not theirs. There were a couple of times when I was living in NYC that I got a bit of a creepy vibe off a… Read more »
Which now that I’ve read it I see that the first bit could be read as a bit sarcastic, that’s not how I mean it. I’m just surprised is all…because most of the women I know aren’t actually afraid of seeing random guys on the street. Some are a bit when it’s dark…but not to the point of asking that men alter their behavior at night to alleviate their worries.
Having almost exclusively lived in safe areas, and having never experienced any trauma related to strange men on the street, yes I have still gotten nervous on dark streets when men are walking near me. Not all men, but some. And I know in my brain that my thoughts are irrational, but that doesn’t stop it. Then again, I am short and have for most of my life been quite skinny, so it was also a matter of physical vulnerability. To be honest, I’m afraid of some women at night too, mostly the tall and tough-looking ones. Mostly it is… Read more »
Hmm…maybe the fact that I lived in some locations that are stereotypically seen as not being for women, and endured nothing more than verbal harassment made me less likely to be worried. Ya know? Like…I’ve been out and about and haven’t had anything more than catcalls hurled my way, so when I see a strange guy, my brain ends up quoting Douglas Adams and says “mostly harmless.”
I think it has to do with personality a lot, too. I am just a nervous human being in general. I am sure that people with a more easygoing and cheerful personality are more likely to assume the best of people they don’t know. I just happen to have a bunch of awful negative thoughts pop up that are not the easiest thing to just brush away. I don’t exactly think it is someone’s responsibility to make me feel more comfortable, but it certainly would be a better world if everyone tried to make sure they acted polite and unthreatening.… Read more »
Yeah…but like…asking people to be polite is one thing. Asking that “men and boys should not walk too close to women and girls,” is asking a lot more than just to be polite. I mean in the one quote they say, ‘ treat us like you would another man.’ And then the rest of it is all these ways in which men are apparently supposed to treat women differently.
Yes, but the article is specifically aimed at guys who understand that women are nervous about strange men, and want to know how to ease their fear. (“So this week, we offer some tips for dudes who’d like to help women feel more comfortable in public spaces.”) And undeniably, keeping your distance or crossing the street or giving a friendly smile and nod if you’re coming from the way they are facing will be seen as a friendly action, which is likely to make some (not all) women feel more comfortable. It isn’t saying everyone needs to, just that if… Read more »
“I don’t see a single thing in that list that would not be appropriate for putting either sex at comfort.”
Right…but then why isn’t the article written in a more gender neutral fashion? Well partly because it’s jezebel, I guess. But also partly because there’s this socially constructed idea that all men could be dangerous. So instead of some nice advice about being polite to strangers on the street…it becomes advice about how _men_ can be polite and alleviate fears in _women_ on the street.
Well – men are as a rule bigger than women, and it matters. I’m a big guy. I know that sometimes make people uncomfortable. Having a large person close by, in a lonely or dark (or both) spot can be scary for a lot of people. Even guys. So I try not to stand right next to single women or elderly people – or anyone, really – if I’m waiting at a metro platform at a late hour. I try to cross the street if a see a single women or an elderly couple walking in my direction ahead of… Read more »
Depends on what prejudice a person has, some men will act different around certain stereotypical bad guys, eg if they think someone is a thug or gangster some may avoid or be weary. I get this a little bit around bikers here but then I tell myself fuckit, and checkout their nice bikes:D. If someone is gonna attack me, I’ll try be aware but I can’t just be prejudice of a group. Don’t confuse not telling people of their fears, with people that don’t have fears. Many men probably do walk around with fears at times, worry about making others… Read more »
I’m not too sure what to think of the jezebel, there are some creepy comments on there.
ht tp://jezebel.com/294383/have-you-ever-beat-up-a-boyfriend-cause-uh-we-have?tag=gossipdomesticdisturbances
“Another editor slapped a guy when “he told me he thought he had breast cancer.” (Okay, that one made us laugh really hard.)”
An editor, at a large feminist site, doesn’t he/she realize that men actually do get breast cancer? Have a read of the comments, they’re real gems…they discuss their physical violence by females towards males with no remorse in plenty of those comments, quite a few feel it’s deserved!
ht tp://jezebel.com/5827427/once-again-men-can-be-raped-too
Some questionable comments here too
Jezebel creeps me out.
wildrebel. Among other things, the “sidewalk” is a metaphor for public spaces. But you knew that. Walk on the sidewalk. Where I used to live, in a small town, I would take power walks, trying to do 4mph for an hour. Used to run, knees aren’t what I’d like. That’s pretty fast for other people. I’d be out, sometimes depending on my schedule, at eight or later in the evening and for a lot of the year, it’s dark at the start. Certainly at the end. I liked the well-lit streets in the old residential areas. Other people would be… Read more »
You know it helps when replying to people if you actually use the Reply button. It was dumb luck I happened to notice this. Anyway, you can do what you want, within reason of course. If you want to cross the street I don’t care. I wouldn’t expect you to do it, and I sure don’t want others expecting me to do it for them. That’s especially true from people whose basic existence on the Internet pretty much revolves around empowering themselves and being offended at being expected to act certain ways to please others, which Jezebel seems to be.… Read more »
I don’t feel this way personally, but I do believe that women are more fearful, in general, than most men. And I don’t want to confuse what is, with what ought to be and these conversations sometimes conflate one with the other in a strange soup. And as already mentioned above, conflating annoyances with threats should also be kept in check. Statistically, males walking about at night should be more fearful, but not so, they are less so – they’ve never been very good at personal math – who can blame them… So here is my two pronged solution: men… Read more »
Agree. As I pointed out above – more men need fear other men than they do. Hence the higher rates of males as assault victims. Yes, there ARE abusive women, we know. However, I am more inclined to be cautious when alone and confronted by someone bigger and stronger than me (which most men are) being of average height and weight. I would also add that I am not shy of taking action if I see ANYONE being threatened or abused – it may mean simply making a phone call or if I think I can deal with the abuser… Read more »
This article is offensive because it treats women as though they are some how less than and therefore entitled to special treatment or handling. It would actually be useful or at least less offensive if it addressed the”tips” to all people about how to be less creepy. Creepy is such a subjective term on persons creepiness may be another persons normal behavior; but without knowing what their baseline behavior it is hard to tell. A more precise term may be behavior that causes a feeling of discomfort or unease. In the current climate of fear everyone is uneasy, on edge,… Read more »
You can walk down the street and take care not to seem threatening, or you can walk down the street and not take care. Buttheads do the latter.
And how am I supposed to do that, defer the sidewalk to women, step off and cross the street for them, or what? It’s not like I go down the street waving a knife in the air or following 3 inches behind people or anything like that. I guess I’m just supposed to avoid the sidewalk altogether since my mere presence might make someone uncomfortable. Thankfully I don’t have to worry about it very often, as sidewalks are almost a myth around here outside of subdivisions.
If you are threatened by me just walking down the sidewalk, the problem is with you, not me.
Don’t men ever feel threatened when walking alone by other men? Statistics would indicate they should, as most victims of assault are men attacked by other men.
As a woman, when out late at night I am on constant alert – and it has paid off having managed to avoid a very dangerous situation (or two).
As for article – I give the majority of men the common sense NOT to try an hit on a woman who is walking alone at night; that is just dumb.
Where did people get the impression that men are the kings of the sidewalk and never feel threatened by each other? I would like men I meet on the street to act in ways that don’t scare me as a fellow guy. I’ll be the one to bring up the race/gender comparison. It’s obnoxious, but it’s also valid to some degree: What would our reaction be to white people giving advice to people of color about how to make us white folks feel safer when we share a sidewalk? Why can’t black people respect the fears that we white people… Read more »
That Guy- I totally agree about men feeling threatened by other men. Especially when society also expects you to protect women. A few years back I was with my husband and our little boy who was in a stroller. A member of the paparazzi started toward Paris Hilton who was walking toward us. I popped off at him and called him an asshole or something. The guy ignored me, but my husband was irritated. He’s like, “you do realize that if he yelled back at you or came after you, idhave to get in a fight, right?” I know he’d… Read more »
Things like this are a double-edged sword. If I have some nasty criminal intentions, this is a list of ways for me to get closer to a woman without her being alarmed. This just adds more energy to the “stranger danger” mindset, which hinders the fight against sexual assault as much as it helps. Statistically, you are in much greater danger from men that you know than from strangers. In fact, odds are if you are sexually assaulted, you will be escaping from someone you know and contacting a stranger to help you. Odds are you are probably in more… Read more »
North switches between discussing random men on the street and men who are trying to pick up women, as if they are the same thing and have the same intentions. Such an interesting point, Chuck. I think it is the duty of all people to be sure that they don’t scare or upset other people unintentionally. I don’t think this is purely a male on female issue, however, as I know women who make men uncomfortable … one example is this friend of a friend who is always touching my husband. Personally, I couldn’t care less, I know he’s not… Read more »
Joanna, Personally, I have less of a problem with the article leaving out how uncomfortable men feel, unless you mean how uncomfortable men feel around other men. It’s my belief that a man is more likely to be attacked or threatened by other men than is a woman. Not sexually, but if a group of guys wants to beat up someone just for fun or try to provoke and justify a fight they’re going to go after a man. So I’ll admit that inter-sexually, men have less to fear from women. But to address your original question, I believe that… Read more »
Chuck: “Personally, I have less of a problem with the article leaving out how uncomfortable men feel, unless you mean how uncomfortable men feel around other men. It’s my belief that a man is more likely to be attacked or threatened by other men than is a woman. Not sexually, but if a group of guys wants to beat up someone just for fun or try to provoke and justify a fight they’re going to go after a man. So I’ll admit that inter-sexually, men have less to fear from women. ” I suggest you read my “Bullied by Girls… Read more »
As you say, “one man’s account”. Of course boys and men get bullied by women. But more men get bullied by men, and more women get bullied by men. In an article about bullying or street harassment of women by men, it isn’t necessary to distort truth to still come to the conclusion that the Jezebel piece is still incorrect.
Thank you, Chuck. You just used the same old “More men get bullied by women” and “More women get bullied by men” I point out in my article that I’ve encountered when trying to point out the ignorance towards females that bully or hurt men, proving my point that you’re no different than those bigots who invalidated my experiences. You know, I have support from people in the comments section below that article, some of which had the same experiences that you’ve just dismissed as well. I’m seeing red right now as I type this response but I’m going to… Read more »
Chuck: “As you say, “one man’s account”. Of course boys and men get bullied by women. But more men get bullied by men, and more women get bullied by men. In an article about bullying or street harassment of women by men, it isn’t necessary to distort truth to still come to the conclusion that the Jezebel piece is still incorrect.” Okay, let’s try this again. I’m a little better. Maybe instead of basing your dismissal on a sub-heading, you should actually read the article in question. Also, read the commentary section below it. I also suggest you go here:… Read more »
As a survivor of sexual and physical abuse, I almost always find myself at least a little uncomfortable around people of both sexes. Do you really think it’s other people’s duty to try and make me feel comfortable? Because in many cases I don’t know what they could do.