Men’s cheating and sexual acting-out may be less about women and more about seeking status from other men.
Marie Claire ran a story last Wednesday called “The Truth About Bachelor Parties.” It opens, as you might expect, with an anecdote about a groom going to a strip club with his friends and family members (including some male relatives of the bride-to-be). As Judy Dutton reports, the groom, “Adam,” ended up having sex with a stripper—but only after being goaded by his friends.
In another instance, the bachelor party sex was premeditated:
Take Kevin, 29, embarked on a “sexual scavenger hunt” during a bachelor party in Montreal. “We said we’d have sex with a stripper, a bride-to-be, a cougar, etc.,” says Kevin. “Two guys were married, one engaged, one single, and one with a girlfriend, like me. I slept with a stripper (full point) and kissed a bride-to-be (half point).” Kevin admits that bachelor parties are male bonding at its worst: “It was a twisted celebration of our bond, another chapter in our history,” he says.
Dutton’s point was that women should be leery of trusting what men say about bachelor parties, claiming that guys often conspire to deceive wives and girlfriends. But she buried the lead: the degree to which men’s infidelity and sexual acting-out is about seeking status from other men.
While it may be impossible for women to find out what their boyfriends and husbands are really up to during stag parties, the big take-away from Dutton’s piece is undeniable: the sexual behavior of even the straightest of guys is driven by the need for other men’s approval.
There’s a name for this behavior: homosociality.
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Scholars use this term to refer to the power of same-sex bonds. To put it simply, a man is “homosocial” (it has nothing to do with homosexuality) if he values his relationships with his male buddies over his romantic relationship with a woman. At its crudest, this idea is expressed in the old maxim “bros before hos.”
But while same-sex friendships are wonderful and necessary, there’s something very troubling about the way so many American men act out their homosociality. In Dutton’s article, men are consistently faced with a choice between remaining faithful to their female partners or engaging in competition with other guys. Over and over again, these men choose to break their vows. The “bros” win out.
In the Marie Claire piece, “Kevin” uses the language of scoring to describe having sex with a stripper (one point) and kissing a bride-to-be (half a point.) This isn’t new. Since at least the 1920s if not before, American men have used the language of sports, especially baseball, to describe sex. The terms are familiar to generations of American teens: first base, second base, third base, home run. (While there’s general consensus that simple kissing is first base and intercourse constitutes the home run, there’s long been heated disagreement as to what sexual acts “count” as reaching second and third.) As in baseball, one must “get home” (have intercourse) in order to “score.”
The obvious question hardly ever gets asked. Who’s the opponent against whom you’re trying to rack up points and runs?
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It’s obvious from Kevin’s story—and from the lived experiences of countless men—that the competition isn’t “boys against girls.” It’s man-on-man, a homosocial battle to prove who’s got the most “game.” School boys refer to a promiscuous classmate as a “player,” and they say it with admiration. And make no mistake; the player is playing against other guys. Women are just the necessary implements for keeping score.
What’s curiously absent in the Marie Claire article (and in the research on male homosociality and heterosexual behavior) is lust. Most of us were raised to believe that young men are in a state of near-constant arousal, with sex first and foremost on their minds. The reality, as Dutton unintentionally reminds us, is that orgasm is secondary in importance to homosocial validation.
Guys who need to be “goaded” into cheating clearly aren’t unfaithful because of biological imperatives. They’re acting in response to something even more powerful: the need to impress other men. This isn’t limited to “white” American culture either. In the anthology Muy Macho: Latino Men Confront Their Manhood, the Mexican writer Ilan Stavans describes having sex for the first time in a brothel:
Losing our virginity was actually a dual mission: to ejaculate inside the hooker and then, more importantly, to tell of the entire adventure afterward.
He’s not talking about telling his mother, either. He’s talking about a thrill even greater than orgasm: scoring points and winning approval from the other guys.
Ilan’s words would ring true to “Kevin” and “Adam” and countless other men whose sexual choices are driven more by homosocial pressure than by libido.
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As obvious and indisputable a factor as homosociality is in men’s lives, both men and women are reluctant to admit its power. For women, the reality of homosociality can seem almost insulting. If straight men are made “weak” by sexual desire for women, then at least women are foremost on guys’ minds. Many young women are raised to believe that male horniness gives women “power” over men, a power that “smart girls” will use judiciously. Homosociality is a threatening reminder that all too many men are more easily manipulated by their same-sex peers than by their wives and girlfriends.
Guys are unwilling to cop to the power of homosocial pressure because once exposed, the whole thing seems so juvenile. Most men will admit that when they were kids they went to great lengths to impress other boys. Far fewer want to admit that “scorekeeping” remains a major factor in their adult decision-making.
I’m wary of making sweeping generalizations about what a “good man” should or shouldn’t do. But it is clear, surely, that one difference between a boy and man is the degree to which he is able to walk away from the score-keeping that is as the heart of so much of “guy culture.” And as the stories of “Adam” and “Kevin” remind us, until we stop playing these games with the boys, we’ll keep right on breaking promises—and breaking hearts.
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I’m gay. I’m 52. The only monogamous relationship I’ve ever had was with a guy I dated for a year or so. He wanted exclusivity and I didn’t mind. Ironically, despite our having no other sex partners for 18 months, he nonetheless managed to be both faithless and disloyal. I’ve had two long-term lover-of-my-life relationships – one for 14 years and the other for 7. (I know, they keep dying, it sucks.) Neither relationship was monogamous – I don’t recall that we ever even considered it. While that required tact and consideration, what part of a relationship doesn’t? Monogamy as… Read more »
I know I’m late to this party, but… as a rule (obviously, I’m generalizing) it seems like it is a lot easier for men to have sex without emotional content, or that is, to view sex as an essentially meaningless act of obtaining physical pleasure from somebody else’s body. Again, I know I’m generalizing when I say that, because obviously women can have meaningless sex and men can feel loving toward people they have sex with. But I think there is a bit of truth to it, just in my experience. Men seem to compartmentalize more. Therefore, it seems like… Read more »
“Bros before Hos” comes from the need for men to do damn near whatever it takes to get into favor with a woman, which includes distancing himself from his friends sometimes when the woman doesn’t approve of them. Most men will forsake alot in get in favor with woman. Yes some men do choose their partner based on what their male peers approve of, but some don’t. His peers may at first state their disapproval but will come to accept the relationship later on if the he shows that he’s serious about it. Being a player is approved by both… Read more »
I think men do considerably better with women after they give up their male college or even young business friends. In other words, young men’s groups. I believe it’s common for more mature men to have one or two close male friends, and either some female friends, or, if partnered, some couples. Young men’s groups are fairly pathological, and pretty one-sided. Because young men are frightened of women, they tend to be sexist. Players are trashy, even if they’re affluent, and the women they can get are trashy too.
hugo is a wack job. Think about it. He was on his 4th marriage by age 35. If he doesn’t have a guilty conscience about that he’s a sociopath. It’s not like there’s a shortage of guys with less obvious and absurd problems than hugo. Either the GMP is intentionally a stage for scum or they can’t get anyone who isn’t scum to write for it. It ain’t tricky. Balanger, you’re the scum of the earth. Nobody anywhere should consider you anything but an example of what not to be.
I think this is a great site, even though I often weigh in as a friendly critic. One erroneous supposition that sometimes operates here, though, is the idea that men can become more like women. So ideas like “Dadchelor Parties” seem pretty silly, since probably only 20 men in the country would ever actually do this. I think men and women are physically pretty different. This includes brain and hormonal physiology. I think men have and will always have the ability to defend themselves, women, and children physically. From time to time historically, they need this. We live in a… Read more »
I do agree with some notions of sexual dimorphism–although I’ve seen some men who I could probably take down (all 5’2″ and 120 pounds of me) and women who could kill me with their bare hands. But the thing about brain physiology is that it’s extremely plastic for all sexes. Brain plasticity is greatly affected by reactions to environment; for example, I do music cognition research, and it’s generally accepted that practicing a musical instrument regularly has huge effects on neuroanatomy. So it’s probably appropriate to question whether at least some sexual dimorphism in that area has to do with… Read more »
I think this is a great piece but I do disagree with this statment: “Guys who need to be “goaded” into cheating clearly aren’t unfaithful because of biological imperatives. They’re acting in response to something even more powerful: the need to impress other men” Guys who let themselves be goaded into cheating are working in combination with so called “biological imperatives” AND the need to impress other men. I never understood why men wanted to celebrate the marriage to their future partner, or their buddies future partners; with other women. It’s a real slap in the face as a woman.… Read more »
Men really aren’t great at PR for their gender. If everything “bros” say is to be believed, they’re naturally cheaters and have to “spread their seed” and are completely incapable of empathy or caring. They think that being selfish and narcissistic is a show of strength or virility. We women just think it’s douchebagginess. But somehow, men don’t seem to care what women think of them (we-and I am generalizing because I know some women who don’t care or find these things disdainful- like men who value family, treat their wives with respect and are faithful husbands, are good fathers… Read more »
I look at the elements of male culture that get publicized the most and it makes me depressed. This article really hit a nerve for me because, to be quite honest, I worry all the time about what my boyfriend may be pressured into doing when he’s around his friends. For the guys out there, take my word for it – it’s not a comfortable situation to be in. While one of the smaller instances of this pressure may not seem like a big deal, they add up really quickly. But I what I try to emphasize is change. Anyone… Read more »
This “biological imperatives” argument is baloney and has been done to death. It’s a biological imperative not to use toilets and take dumps in the woods or to go everywhere without shoes on. We’re living in a society and we are social creatures.
It doesn’t dictate specific behavioir to be sure. But testoterone is a big push to men, even at my age. It makes men more simple, linear, and, yes, more agressive, generally speaking.
For years, men have accused one another of being “p***y-whipped” if, for example, a guy declines to attend a strip club bachelor party, or makes (and keeps) an agreement with his female partner to return home by a certain hour. How interesting to contemplate that men may be equally “d**k-whipped,” in particular by the exact men who lob the “p-whipped” allegation. Imagine if men were to be called on their “d-whipped” behavior (not only by their female partners and friends, but by their male friends as well.) In the hands of a decent socially-conscious humorist, the sit-com possibilities practically write… Read more »
hahahahaha D**k-whipped! Please, please try to make that word happen. I would totally see that movie.
C0ck Slapped has a better ring to it….
“I’d rather be pυssy-whipped than cοck-slapped”… good retort!
Men are much better than this and a little bit worse than this. I have no doubt that there are bachelor parties like this. I also have no doubt that many men who participate in such “scoring” systems inflate their numbers. In fact, I’d say men exaggerate to their buddies about their sexual experiences more often than they actually have sex for points. The peer pressure is as much to report high numbers as it is to actually have the sex. No doubt many grooms in that position make a cynical win-win compromise – don’t have sex with the stripper,… Read more »
Most of the time that I hear someone say, “I’m not saying it’s good, BUT…” it’s usually just to focus on why something happens rather than to focus on whether it’s right or wrong. In a practical sense, it doesn’t really matter where some men’s motivations for bad behavior come from – the behavior is still bad. It’s worth discussing the potential causes only in as much as understanding something makes you more capable of changing things for the better.
for every man who actually participates in this sort of party there are 10,000,000 hugo schwyzers who talk about it. The subject is BS. Hugo has set up a straw man to knock down. Easy BS for living garbage like hugo to talk about.
Agree, agree, agree with this article. I recently found out, after twelve years of marriage, that my husband went to a strip club the week of our wedding after promising that he wouldn’t. It was the one and only thing I asked him not to do, because I feel very strongly that entertainment involving naked women is degrading, and can escalate quickly to really bad situations (i.e. infidelity) when alcohol is involved. So please, I asked him. Please don’t do this. It is really important to me not to do this one thing. I wouldn’t ask if it weren’t really… Read more »
My ex-boyfriend’s friend had sex with two different women over 1 weekend because his wife was hormonal (she was pregnant and a few months along and she was tearful and apparently feeling insecure about how he felt about her body) and his buddies said nothing about it at all. Apparently, he “deserved” it after dealing with his pregnant wife. My ex was like, “But Jon’s a good guy. What he did wasn’t right, but he’s still a good person.” No word on whether Jon actually bothered to use a condom.
I wonder what it would take to be a “bad guy”? Cheating on your wife multiple times while she’s pregnant with your child seems pretty sleazy to me. I think that guys are too easy on other guys. If a guy friend of mine did that to his wife, I think that I’d distance myself a little.
This is no defense of anyone’s infidelity, because I tend to think cheating is cheating is cheating, but are there really aggravating vs. extenuating circumstances for a man cheating? I think I know the answer, but I’m curious as to why cheating on a woman when she’s pregnant is actually morally worse than if she were not pregnant. The flip side of that argument would be to tell a woman, “yes, he cheated, but it could be worse, you could have been pregnant at the time.” Or, “hey, at least he waited until after you gave birth.” And those just… Read more »
While I agree that the example in the article is extreme, I do think that lesser instances of this occur very frequently. Something that has always bothered me is that men bond over women’s bodies. Going to strip clubs, viewing porn, and swapping sexual stories is a significant factor in male bonding. I find this misogynistic and, quite frankly, unfair. Men should be able to bond in ways that are not degrading to women. The pressure put on men to behave in ways that are not female-friendly is a major part of most male-driven comedies and TV shows. While probably… Read more »
Lindsey you articulated so many of my own thoughts! I totally agree with you that there is a tendency for men to do this same form of homosocializing over “smaller” instances. And alot of your insights are really just spot on.
As a woman who made a living stripping at bachelor parties I will say that while Not All Men are Like That….there are enough of them that it is worth mentioning, and if the women in their lives, from their mothers to their lovers, knew how they behaved and the crap they tried to pull- they’d be flat out horrified and the Bros just might find themselves without anything except their homosocial friends and antics.
A little bit of me does wonder if, if women talked about sex with men (or whomever) among themselves more, they might be open to/enjoy it more. Even though much of what men say to each other about sex is innacurate (and porn is certainly inaccurate), there is a permission giving from sex talk that women don’t always get. The sexual dialogs in “Sex and the City” are probably more the exception than the rule in real life because women are trying to avoid an unspoken “slut” label with each other. Someone once commented here (citing Nietzsche) that his resentiment… Read more »
Totally disagree. First of all, there’s a difference between respectful talk about sex and degrading talk about sex – point systems, etc. How men at bachelor parties and such talk about women is most definitely in the latter category. That’s nothing for women to emulate. Also, there’s also the issue of privacy. Your partner shouldn’t have to assume that you’re spilling all of the details of their sexuality to your friends. It’s just disrespectful – for both genders – to share something that most people feel is be private. If women don’t talk about sex in the same manner than… Read more »
My impression is (and I’ve asked women about this) is that women often take the safe route with other women and don’t talk about sex. Okay, the one general exception is Jewish women— who do talk about with other women and with men. My general impression (and I know that this is generalizing wildly) is that Jewish women are much more intact sexually than women who are Protestant or Catholic. I can remember my first wife (Jewish – I’m Protestant) and other Jewish women talking comfortably about sex at the table. Jewish parents will often say “what a cute little… Read more »
Well, I don’t hate Hugo’s article, but I think this is true of young men, not older ones. My young men’s group was basically intellectually inclined Army buddies in Germany. We drank so much, we didn’t really have time for women, and most of us didn’t have girlfriends during the year and a half or so we hyng out. I had one for about a month and a half at the beginning of this period, and another friend had one right at the end. We were fairly destructive in plenty of ways, but I don’t recall us being particularly misogynistic.… Read more »
the sexual behavior of even the straightest of guys is driven by the need for other men’s approval. This premise is pretty much false. Sure in certain cases social pressures such as peers (the homosocial you speak of), family, community etc will motivate men and women to do things that they wouldn’t normally do and yes this would include sex but it isn’t the only motivator. Men’s sexual behavior will work counter to these social pressure. Men have plenty of sexual experiences that they “keep to themselves.” Men will do things that they don’t want their male peers, their family,… Read more »
That is true, however, Hugo has a point to the extent that when men do make such comparisons or use a point system that the goal is not to impress women but to impress other men.
That said, I cannot think of any instance in which men I know cheated on their partners to please other men. I actually do not know anyone who has cheated on his partner, but I would imagine that if they did, it would be because they wanted to, not because their friends told them to.
I’ve known quite a few men who have evaluated a partner in terms of how the partner’s physical qualities and characteristics would enhance their own sense of self-esteem and status. It hit me after reading this article that while they might not be requesting approval explicitly, they are seeing themselves through their buddies’ eyes and gaining self-esteem not from the love and kindness she gives, but her physical appearance and the respect and envy it may invoke in his peers, through his own perception (however flawed). I have lots of female friends who date guys that we don’t approve of… Read more »
This is true. A lot of guys will date a girl that they don’t really click with just because she’s hot and it would be a self-esteem boost and “bragging rights”. Not only is it horribly cruel to the woman, but the self-esteem boost comes from knowing that his peers envy him. It’s essentially using a woman as a tool to gain favor with other guys.
I think these ideas might speak to the deeper role of social networks within human culture and society, regardless of whether or not this article speaks to the extremes or the norm (I’d say this bachelor party example *might* be an extreme, but the underlying message re: same-sex bonds is valid – for instance, simply take the dudes who will lie/misinform/avoid going home to the missus, and perhaps say something derogatory about her, to stay out with his buds). We often put romantic *monogamous* relationships on a pedestal as the end-all goal of our adult lives (even our jobs can… Read more »
Another interesting point is looking at female homosocial bonds. I truly believe women can develop strong homosocial bonds as well, and that they are very significant in human social interactions. HOWEVER. For a very, very long time, women have been conditioned against creating such bonds, and have often instead been encouraged to compete with one another. Yet, when we overcome that societal conditioning, we create lasting friendships.
Actually women create deeper and more intimate homosocial bonds that are fewer in number while men in general form less intimate homosocial bonds that are generally greater in number.
“Actually women create deeper and more intimate homosocial bonds that are fewer in number while men in general form less intimate homosocial bonds that are generally greater in number.”
Preposterous. SOME PEOPLE create deeper and more intimate homosocial bonds that are fewer in number while OTHER PEOPLE form less intimate homosocial bonds that are generally greater in number. When it comes to friendships there is no use generalizing along gender lines.
OP, and when women engage in exactly the same behavior, is it said that all women do it too, also are their actions more incorrect and irresponsible, even malicious and selfish because they, not living in guy land are not motivated by the homosocial validation or is there another set of social pressures making them do it?
Actually they are also motivated by homosocial validation: i.e the girls.
From my anecdotal evidence of 5 or 7 data points, I am almost entirely convinced that women propagate eating disorders. No dude I’ve known has ever suggested or implied that I’m fat, whereas plenty of female friends just couldn’t stop talking about how they lost five pounds by eating tons of food and doing nothing, as if it’s an accomplishment. So yeah: girls are homosocial too.
I knew I had been agreeing with you far too often Hugo. Now we’re back. The Marie Claire article and your follow up are so wrong. Make no mistake, I’m not saying that kind of stuff doesn’t happen on some bachelor parties. I’m sure it does. But I’ve been to dozens of them now and my friends are more than a little crazy. But never—not even once—was there any cheating that went on. And we’re all great friends. The only competition is an occasional keg stand, not to see who can rack up points sleeping with a stripper. The guys… Read more »
Strip Clubs and Strippers degrade women. Most of these girls are just 18 years old and have been sexually abused as a child. 80% of Strippers are also part-time prostitutes! Think of the STD’s. There is NO WAY that I would let my husband go to a Strip Club or hire a private Stripper for a Bachelor Party etc…! It is sinful and morally wrong! Ladies, do you really know what goes on during Bachelor Parties??? Believe me, it isn’t just the girl dancing and taking her clothes off. Most men participate in sexual games and actually have physical contact… Read more »
“Strip Clubs and Strippers degrade women. Most of these girls are just 18 years old and have been sexually abused as a child. 80% of Strippers are also part-time prostitutes!”
When making claims like that, please support it with evidence.
I think the main focus of the article is not that this behavior is normal or that it happens a lot — I think it’s just that it happens for “non-mainstream” reasons. The popular stereotype is that men cheat because they can’t keep it in their pants, they’re just that horny. Meanwhile, people don’t usually point out that there’s an element of impressing other dudes in there as well.