Katie Ellison explains the difference between being an actual feminist man and being an opportunist.
With the advent of social and cultural discussion hubs such as the Good Men Project, TedX, and the #NotAllMen thread formed in reaction to/conjunction with the #YesAllWomen thread on Twitter, it’s becoming increasingly posh for dudes to claim a pro-woman stance publically. Of course, this hasn’t been the case until recently, and a viewing of just about any ‘80s movie will be a reminder of the little progress we’ve made over the years.
What has changed is that it is no longer social suicide—at least in progressive and generally urban settings—for some men in some circles to be expressive of their awareness/anger/compassion for women and the challenges we face on a daily basis. You’ve heard it before, but of course those challenges bear repeating: the catcalls, the uninvited touch at the office or at the bar, the sexual innuendo from someone who claims to be a friend. And this is, of course, to say nothing of the 1 in 5 women who will be raped in this country this year and the thousands of others who won’t report it and therefore will not be counted in that statistic.
You know, that whole deal.
So men who can espouse a line or two at the bar or on a first date about the power and importance of the Women’s Movement of the early 20th century or of the ‘60s or, especially, the movement we’re living now and those men know that chances are good he’ll get bonus points with intelligent, with-it, up-to-date-on-their-current-events kind of ladies. (Inevitably very sexy kind of ladies.)
The trouble lies in the dude whose very effort to roll out those sweet “feminist lines” (“Let’s split the bill?” or “What would Betty Friedan do?” or “Jennifer Lawrence looks great with short hair doesn’t she?”) is just a ploy to lure women closer. Aside from the obvious fact that such manipulation and dishonesty is very simply, the worst, there is a more global and profound issue at the heart of this behavior that reflects a problem within many of these feminist male movements, well-meaning or not.
In short, feminism and the true equality run way deeper than how much money a man or woman makes or whether she wears her hair short or long or any other way. And while knowledge of the history of the movement(s) never hurt anyone, unless those dug up facts are used to see more clearly into the sorry state of affairs that is the modern woman’s condition, it’s all fluff. In other words, as so many spiritual gurus repeat over and over again in meditation halls everywhere, it’s all in the intention.
To use the examples above, splitting the bill is a great idea, unless the person you’re dating—or interested in dating—likes to trade off who gets the bill, or always likes to cover it, or likes to be paid for here and there without keeping score. Reference to J.Law’s short hair and how great it looks is fine if you’re just a dude who digs pixie cuts or enjoys mindless pop culture discussion (and I’d totally hang out with you if you do), but if it’s a fetish, or the comment itself is a ploy to gain ground, or, I don’t know, there are other more important things on your date’s mind than a movie star’s haircut, the whole topic, well, kinda sucks. So the point is that it isn’t the thing that’s important in feminism—women with short hair, or the right to pay for the bill, or even necessarily the history of the movement if you’re really not into that sort of thing—but rather whether or not you can look across a table or a bar or a street and see a person instead of an attractive thing to be duped and won and claimed.
The bigger thing at risk with this particular kind of trickery, more so than the usual white lies (“Oh yeah, I love hitchhiking!” or “No way, I’ve never seen a movie with The Rock,” etc.) that humans tell in our twisted and desperate efforts for company and companionship if we’re going to give liars the benefit of the doubt, is that it confuses an already very complex and mazy cultural and social challenge. Feminism, in action, is tricky because every woman and every man is different. What is okay or pleasurable or preferable for one man or woman could be another’s nightmare or bore or torturously painful. Feminism allows for those differences and vascillations, for men and women. So when you claim a certain perspective or belief or lifestyle under the guise of being a feminist, and you really don’t care for any of it or you have no idea what feminism really is beyond splitting the bill or short hair, you water down the whole thing for everybody who’s trying to make their way in this crazy complex world we live in. Not to mention the fact that you immediately become a part of the very problem feminism fights against.
Pulling out lines to impress an attractive someone isn’t inherently wrong. I mean, duh. If that were the case, we’d all be in big trouble with whoever it is we believe we have to answer to. But there’s this line that only you really know if you’re crossing (in the beginning anyway—this attractive someone will figure out you’re lying if they stick around long enough) that separates saying something because you want to impress a crush and intentionally misrepresenting yourself to get in someone’s pants. The former is something we all do; the latter is manipulative and weird and will always end in tears, as my dad used to say.
It’s all too charming to make a fool of yourself because you think someone is sexy. But there’s a difference between knowing that there’s a whole set of flaws and neurosis and stories and experiences and whatever else in that hot body, whatever form it takes, and saying whatever you think will work to get more exclusive access to that body, paying no mind to the complexities that lie beneath the skin.
So maybe the next time you tell a woman (or a dude, or anyone else for that matter), “I’m a feminist,” make sure you’ve done your homework and that you know what the means in your head, and in your heart. Cause that’s totally hot.
Photo— Flickr/QuotesEverlasting
Hear this guys? In the good old US of A, this person claims that a full 30 MILLION women will be raped THIS YEAR ALONE! Let that sink in guys, 30 MILLION! That means, for every 5 women you know, 1 will be raped THIS YEAR ALONE! How far do you have to take your propaganda to get support for your movement?
nonono im not going to date a feminist, not a American feminist at least. Never EVER, sorry.
nonono im not going to date a feminist, not a American feminist at least, never EVER.
I went out on a date. Was very promising as images of good-will and understanding danced merrily in my mind. It didn’t end well. First time was we disagreed on a very touchy subject, leading to the relationship put to pasture on my own decision. Oh we had a great time at first. She promised that if there ever was a cold shoulder to cry on, they’d be there to provide good comfort and whatever concerns I have they’ll be heard. Imagine how heartbroken I felt when I told them about the negative experiences I had garnered at the hands… Read more »
Whoops. Little bit of a contradiction. It should read that it was her who put the relationship out to pasture the first time. Not me.
WOW….. thanks for sharing this. I’m sure many share similar experiences but few can communicate them as well.
Ah, but Tom, I was speaking metaphorically. You should know who I am talking about. It’s the very thing in this OPs article.
That’s the only hint I’ll give you.
The role of the feminist man is to serve at the pleasure of a feminist woman. – See more at: https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/cac-im-a-feminist-so-go-out-with-me/#sthash.IOfPdq5D.dpuf
That sounds kind of kinky. Are you being sarcastic when you suggest that men not speak their minds when it comes to feminism? Equality means everyone gets an equal voice. It doesn’t sound like that is what you are advocating.
@ courage the cowardly dog I’m not advocating anything. What I’m saying is that based on my interactions with feminists both men and women, feminist men are expected by feminist women to take a back seat in the movement. Some feminist women won’t even grant the feminist men the title of feminist. They’ll only consider them allies. That’s how much they’re considered second class citizens. This wouldn’t match my definition of equality, but feminists claim to be for equality. Ironically many feminists will use as an excuse that men can’t be feminists because they can’t understand the experience of women… Read more »
“They’ll only consider them allies.”
And some are even suspicious of any man who considers himself a feminist ally, because, well, it isn’t a man’s place to say that he is on the feminists’ side.
As far as feminism and feminist men are concerned, I don’t really see a difference between what the author is saying and what many feminist men and women believe the role of a feminist man is supposed to be. The role of the feminist man is to serve at the pleasure of a feminist woman. When he acts as his own agent, he gets out of that role. Want to have sex with her. Bad boy it’s about what she wants. Believe in splitting the bill, depends on what she wants. Be an egalitarian feminist and are concerned about equality.… Read more »
Yep. Proxy violence for female feminists and throwing other men under the bus for male feminists. The one true scotsman. Also I am at a loss as to why GMP delete so many comments. Particularly when they shed light on the truth. If the article is wrong then surely it is more admirable for GMP to admit as much. Sure if they are hateful. But I have read my fair share of man hate comments on here and they don’t get deleted. But you comment something that might upset women or feminists and there is a good chance it will… Read more »
No thank you. Been there, done that, have no plans of going back.
Also, you aren’t entitled to a relationship just because of your ideology.
Wow!!! I am quite speechless about the comments above. I just wanted to speak out and say that I understand what Kate is saying. I called myself a feminist myself for the wrong reasons. Now I just call myself a man who is working to apply my values in my life, for the benefit of my partner and myself. She knows I want to practice in my career. And so does she. We talk about this often, and these days it is not an argument, but a conversation in which we listen empathetically to eachother and work at it till… Read more »
For most of their lives, men have been told that their only reason for existing was to provide for others and/or die if necessary. And we accepted it as normal. Feminists bought into the same lie we did without realizing that the same system they were so eager to be a part of was the problem. Now they are just as disposable as any man. Unless, of course you are a lawyer, politician or CEO.
You’re getting at the crux of the issue later in this article, a lot of the terrible behavior that people complain about in specifics comes from trying to learn the rules of the game. I don’t know if men try to figure out the game more than women, but the point is this: no-one’s been told that what we’re playing is Calvinball!
A person need not say they are a feminist, they need only adopt feminist ideology. Adopting an ideology is reflective of one’s values and if you live by your values those values will influence your behavior. A central tenant of feminism is equal opportunity in the work place and that the woman’s career should not take a back seat to the man’s career. So in that instance when a husband and wife’s career opportunities conflict what then? Who yields? If the man yields and his career path is disrupted or damaged so as to affect his future earning capacity the… Read more »
If someone says, “I am a Feminist/Democrat/Republican/Baptist” or any other kind of label right when I meet them that is an automatic warning flag. Self-labeling is just as limiting as having other people do it to you. Why limit your options?
If feminism is just an ideology to recignize the equality and full humanity of every living person without assumptions and prejudice, then I will kindly ask you to treat me in the same manner you wish to be treated yourself!
Just as you say that we shouldn’t take anything for granted based on the gender of a person without asking questions first, You have actally no idea where I am coming from and making suspecting assumptions about my person and the way I phrase my conversation does nothing to progress the cause.
If the women in the ideology praise and value men when they say awful things about men and see women as up on a moral pedestal – the ideology is not going to attract “good men”.
“What has changed is that it is no longer social suicide—at least in progressive and generally urban settings—for some men in some circles to be expressive of their awareness/anger/compassion for women and the challenges we face on a daily basis.”
I was born in 1948 and for me nothing has changed—it has never been social suicide ‘ to be expressive of their awareness/anger/compassion for women’. But then I clearly live in a different world, a world where feminism is a political ideology and not a lot to do with equal human rights.
Oh and I wouldn’t date a feminist, or anyone because of a political label, I would date a woman and hope that she, like me, would be a person with a personality not an ideology.
Beyond the universally relevant point of ‘don’t be disingenuous’ there are a few things to keep in mind: First and foremost is that people date other people – a person can’t have a relationship with an ideology, or list of talking points. Any relationship needs to be reciprocal, or at least have some measure of reciprocity. If my identity becomes so intertwined with my ideology (or my religion) then the effect may very well be alienating to those who are not as equally zealous as I, or those who don’t see their ideology (or religion) as central to their identity as… Read more »
Date you? So I have to take your blood alcohol level before I take your “yes” to mean yes not influenced by a beer or two that you drank without fear of being charged with rape.. No thank you. My son who is in college and a fairly good looking kid tells me he and his friends stay the hell away from any girl that they see drinking or appear to be even the slightest bit intoxicated because of the fear of being accused of rape. Feminists have created this environment let them live in it alone.
Date a feminist? I was a feminist and I married a feminist. Feminism destroyed my career and ripped my family apart. I wouldn’t date a feminist and I would caution any young man thinking of doing so not to. Who yields when career opportunities conflict. Who’s career takes the hit when one has an opportunity and to pursue that opportunity the other person’s career could be adversely affected. What about care of children. If both are aggressively pursing their careers don’t children suffer? Nannys and child care workers don’t replace a mom or a dad. And I could produce for… Read more »
“of the 1 in 5 women who will be raped in this country this year and the thousands of others who won’t report it and therefore will not be counted in that statistic. ” – the author It’s simply not true that 1 out of 5 women will be raped this year in the USA – that would mean about 30 million women would be raped in just one year and this is simply not happening. US JUSTICE DEPT RAPE STATISTICS. “From 1995 to 2010, the estimated annual rate of female rape or sexual assault victimizations declined 58%, from 5.0… Read more »
I agree. Even the source Katie references does not support her claim. It is depressing though. “Nearly one in five women surveyed said they had been raped or had experienced an attempted rape at some point, and one in four reported having been beaten by an intimate partner.” Basically, that statement supports what she is saying, unchanged, but she is not accurately presenting it. She has a strong overall argument and writes a persuasive essay, but she does not feel the facts are bad enough to support it. So she either deliberately or, I’d guess, passionately presents them as worse.… Read more »
The problem with feminism is that there is no such thing as “feminism”. Oh there is the word and the dictionary definition of feminism, but ask 12 feminists to define feminism and you’ll get 13 answers. I fully support the ideology of feminism, although I steer clear of ever putting a feminist label on myself. What it means to one person may mean something quite different to someone else. Heck, there are many feminists who think it is offensive for a man to even consider calling himself a feminist. They see the term ‘feminist’ as an IDENTITY and not an… Read more »
typo:
“social suicide for a man to call himself a suicide”
social suicide for a man to call himself a feminist
“Oh there is the word and the dictionary definition of feminism, but ask 12 feminists to define feminism and you’ll get 13 answers.”
YES YES YES YES YES. Best comment on feminism ever. The term feminism has lost it’s meaning completely, it’s been so watered down to mean everything n anything. Just look at how much infighting goes on in feminism, there are just way too many differing ideals in feminism. Eg anti porn vs pro porn, anti-sex-work vs pro-sex-work, men’s issues are welcome vs gtfo men, etc.
Yes, thankyou. A very powerful post.