– [Producer] What are your thoughts on Stonewall?
– It was probably the most significant gay event
in the history of the world.
– [Producer] Do you ever look back at that moment in history?
– Unfortunately, no.
– No. – I don’t either.
– [Producer] I’m going to take you back to Stonewall
and get your perspective on it.
Sound good? – Sounds good.
– [Producer] Great, let’s get started.
What was life like for queer people before Stonewall?
– There’s a whole history of life in repression.
– For me, it was always hiding the fact that I was gay.
– And you’d kind of sneak in your enjoyment.
Gay bars, you’d enter from back alleys
so you wouldn’t be seen.
– [Producer] What was the significance of gay bars back then?
– A gathering place. – A yummy gathering.
– I walked into a gay bar, I looked at who I’d like
to go home with and– – Yeah.
– Mission accomplished, I was out the door.
That’s what a gay bar was for me.
– It was the center of gay life.
It was the only thing you knew about other
than park cruising where you could meet other gays.
– [Producer] Was homosexuality illegal?
– No. – No.
– [Producer] Were you aware that you were gay?
(laughing) – Oh yeah.
– Very gay.
– And I’d done everything too.
– I didn’t know I was gay.
The most important thing I was looking forward
to that summer was the moon landing.
– I had a lot of landings.
– [Producer] How did you find out about Stonewall?
– Television. – Black and white.
– Radio. – I remember hearing about it
– but I was a good little church boy.
– And you still are.
(laughing)
– And I didn’t hear the news that much.
– It was actually, for as big event as it was gonna turn out
to be, it made just a little ripple in the national news.
It wasn’t that big of a deal.
– Yeah.
– Because they didn’t want it to be.
– No, but it was the beginning of something very big.
– [Producer] Describe what happened at Stonewall
to the best of your recollection.
– It took place after Judy Garland died.
– Right.
– A group of drag queens went to the Stonewall Inn
to have a drink to commiserate with each other
because their icon had died
and instead there was a raid, a police raid.
It was common. – Mm-hm.
– And they’d had enough and I guess there was a beer bottle
that went over once of New York City’s finest
and it just accumulated and accumulated.
– And they also sent a very small contention of policemen
there and that’s why the policemen were trapped
between drag queens in the back
and drag queens in the front.
– And the owner of Stonewall, he was,
what do you call those bad guys?
– It was owned by the mafia. – Mafia.
– And they did not have a liquor license.
– Yes but he got around it by paying the police off.
– Oh yeah, that’s the bar.
– That’s it, that’s a tiny little thing.
– Yeah, I sorta remember that picture.
– Yeah, there’s Bob in the back.
(laughing) – Ha.
– This guy seems to be protecting–
– Or is he’s (chuckles) pushing her in front of him.
– I dunno. (laughing)
– This one looks scared, with this police right here.
And confusion too.
These are young people who are like, what is this?
– And there were a lot of young people at Stonewall
so there was a lot of male prostitutes there.
There were a lot of kids that had run away
from home– – Hm.
– They didn’t even have a place to rinse the glasses,
they rinsed the glasses in a tub and boom,
you were served a drink, it wasn’t the healthiest place
in the world. – Okurrr.
– Does anyone remember how gays
were referred to in the news?
– Oh, I remember, it was a homosexual riot.
– New York experienced it’s first homosexual riot.
We may have lost the battle, sweets,
but the war is far from over.
I got excited just reading that.
– [Producer] Do you remember it being more of a riot
or more of a rebellion.
– They said that it was a riot.
– Yeah, it was broadcast as a riot.
– [Producer] Recent depictions of people
who were there described it as more of a rebellion.
– It probably was, they were fed up with it.
– Yeah, had enough.
– [Producer] Who threw the first brick at Stonewall?
– Don’t know.
– Wasn’t there.
– I have a friend that actually threw a brick, though,
(chuckles) at Stonewall.
– I think we romanticize the event
a little too much.
– I agree.
– It is the basis from which a lot of things have sprung
from and I think what happened afterwards
is the story and we’re still living that story.
– [Producer] What happened after Stonewall?
(chuckling) – In terms of what?
Our personal lives or the gay movement?
– [Producer] Gay movement.
– Literally one year to the day after the Stonewall Inn
was raided they had parades in New York, San Francisco,
and Hollywood and that was really
how most people found out about Stonewall.
– Things started, kinda, bubbling to the surface
in the late 70’s.
– The city council began passing laws to protect gays
and lesbians in housing, in terms of the bars,
you know, the raids stopped.
– Gays were becoming more visible as an element of society.
– [Producer] How significant is Stonewall to you?
– I think it’s very significant.
– It truly was the beginning of the gay revolution.
– What I would say is, it had to happen.
It was going to happen somewhere.
If it didn’t happen in Los Angeles,
it was gonna happen in New York.
– [Producer] Is there anything you want people to take away
from your experience of Stonewall?
– There’s a connection, I think, young LGBTQ
want to make with the event.
All I would say to that is, yes understand what took place.
Why, but that they are a part of the story now.
‘Cause it’s still unfolding.
—
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