Dad Finds Porn on Son’s Computer, Leaves Compassionate Note

One word comes to Cooper Fleishman’s mind upon reading this story: Enlightenment.

This story is blowing up on Reddit… 
A dad finds porn on his son’s computer, and leaves him this note:

I want to start out by saying that I love ya and I’m not trying to embarrass you. Before you do anything else click the star in the upper right hand corner of internet explorer which is already pulled up and then click back on the icon to the right of the skype symbol in your toolbar to pull this page back up. —————————————> That history is the reason that you got that scamware and all the other crap on your computer. I want to tell you that it’s ok. Listen, I was 13 once too and it wasn’t so long ago that I don’t remember. I’m not mad or anything. It’s life and I did it too. I just want you to know that most of those sites are places that can and will ruin your computer. You were actually lucky that it only did what it did. There are viruses and other scamware that can completly ruin a computer and I can’t afford to buy you another 1800 dollar machine because you went to a site that fried it.

There are sites that are completely safe and you can go on them and not have your computer turned into a piece of junk. You can go to these sites and not screw up your computer. Don’t click on any links taking you to other sites and please only go to these. Ninty percent of porn sites have crap that can brick a computer.

[editor: links omitted]

Listen, I won’t tell your mom and I’m not gonna make a big deal out of this. In fact I’m not gonna make any size deal out of it. If you don’t wanna talk about it that’s fine and I completely understand. I’ve been on this earth three times as long as you and there’s nothing you have done or will do that I haven’t done before. If you want to completely ignore this ever happened then I can and will do that too. Please don’t act awkward around me because of this. You have nothing to be embarrassed about. I just can’t have an 1800 dollar machine turned into a brick because you haven’t learned where to go on the internet. I’m not going to put a child lock on your computer or punish you in any way because as I said you did nothing wrong. I would like you to not be back here so much though. You literally spend all of your time back here. I’d like to see you more often. I like doing stuff with you and miss it.

I love you and I couldn’t be more proud of you.

First of all, I’ve never heard of this—a parent responds to his son’s porn history by actually giving him better porn to watch, on sites that aren’t malware-infested! “Enlightened” is the word that comes to mind…
But what more could he have done? Does he have a responsibility to go more into detail about the differences between porn and sex? Is he underestimating the influence of porn on young boys? Should he have told Mom?
Image courtesy of Flickr/puresolitude

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About Cooper Fleishman

Cooper Fleishman is managing editor of HyperVocal.com. After graduating from Kenyon College in 2009, he moved to New York to follow his dream of book-publishing glory. Once here, he sold dog food on the street and copyedited celebrity-gossip tabloids, finally landing as senior editor of the Good Men Project, where he served for a year before sneaking into HyperVocal. Email: [email protected] Twitter: @_cooper.

Comments

  1. This is a note-perfect response; I wouldn’t change a thing. He even mildly suggested not spending as much time on this, without attempting to shame or denigrate the boy in any way. Well done, Dad!

  2. Best father ever!

  3. John Anderson says:

    You definitely don’t tell mom especially if he’s the baby of the family.

    • wow, really? Because women can’t possibly conceive of the attraction to porn?

      I’m a woman and I watched porn at age 13 too. We don’t need to be protected from it because we’re female.

      • I think it’s more to do with the difference in gender, similar to dad talking to daughter about porn. You can do it but the same gender is probably easier. Though really, it shouldn’t matter all that much. I know one thing though, more men understand my porn usage than women do, the threads on porn usually have a few women that understand and a wholleee lot of women that are so completely off-base it’s silly. Might be an exageration or generalization, but I do feel men understand porn for men better than women do. Make of that as you will. Doesn’t mean a mother can’t give advice or anything though, but I don’t think fathers are often telling their sons how exactly to masturbate…so their increased knowledge isn’t all that useful.

        It sounds like most of it is a guess that women aren’t into porn anywhere near as much as men, but that is changing quickly so maybe that idea is going out the window.

        • Why are women “off-base” and “silly” if they don’t see porn like you do?

          • No they come off as off-base and silly when they try to push their viewpoints on porn down men’s throats even as they are telling men they should talk about their feelings on it. What’s the point of asking of they have already decided that we are wrong?

          • Because they literally tell men what men want, look at, fantasize about. They are arrogant, think they know what men think, they ask men to open up, misread their comments, put words in their mouth, then demonize them for it.

            “I know one thing though, more men understand my porn usage than women do”
            MY porn usage Erin, hence they can be off-base because I know my porn usage the best and I don’t find many women actually understand. The most common mistake they make is assuming I look at fake tits even, or only like big tits. I’ve seen plenty of women think that is what men ONLY want in their porn, I find it silly. I’ve even had women try tell me what I want, what I desire, what I look at.

            It’s like a man saying to a woman that fantasizes about being raped that she must want to be raped, it’s like some people can’t understand that fantasy isn’t necessarily a reflection of what people want in reality.

      • John Anderson says:

        It has more to do with the child’s comfort level than your ability to understand porn. As a 13 year old boy, I would have been more comfortable talking with my older brothers (16 and 19) about sex and porn. Even if you don’t shame him, he may still feel ashamed. If his father is not around or is an incompetent parent and there is no alternate father figure, then absolutely it’s up to the mother to address the situation. That doesn’t seem to be the case here.

  4. Not shaming him for being a ball of hormones is one thing, but I’m not sure I’d direct him to new sites. Porn can be realistic. Often it’s not. The first thing he asks a girl during coitus probably shouldn’t be, ” Do you want me to blast on your face, on your tits, or in your mouth?” Some things need to be worked up to, whether within a relationship or via experience in the open market.

    Buy the kid some Playboys or something.

    • and in the event that word gets out to the wrong person the dad could get in legal trouble for distributing porn to a minor

    • Direct him to amateur porn if anything, I wouldn’t say go for the pro stuff.

      • i agree amateur porn would be best for guidance. playboy is certainly not realistic nor diverse in body shape

        • Playboy may not be realistic, but I’m pretty sure we’re still talking about masturbation and fantasy. Masturbation does not require political correctness. In fact, it’s generally verboten. The penis knows what it wants.

  5. I think it’s SO awesome.

    I hope I’d be able to handle this as well as this dad. Great story.

    • Joanna – As a mother, please choose to not ever handle it at all unless you absolutely have to. I can’t think of a reason why you’d have to, but perhaps one exists. Nothing personal, but as a former 13 year old, I can say that if mom tries to discuss rubbing one out to “Anal Piledrivers 3,” it might cause the kid to spontaneously combust like a Spinal Tap drummer.

    • Agreed! Very awesome. I’m not a parent so I don’t know how I’d handle it, but like you, I hope I’d be able to handle it this way.

      The “p*rn sex and real sex are different” is another conversation, I feel, and a conversation that should happen in person if possible. Leaving a note was fine for this context, but a sex ed talk should take place face-to-face (as awkward and uncomfortable as that can be).

      I still laugh when I think of the time my parents got in an uproar over finding porn in the browser history on the family computer. I think I was about 13 or 14 at the time, and I had heard the word “pornography” on TV (MTV I think) and didn’t know what it was. So being the ever-curious child, I just looked it up while online one day. I saw a few sites, got my answer, and totally forgot about it. And I got such a huge lecture and chewing-out about it when they found out. My mom warned, “Those images will be stuck in your mind for the rest of your life!” (And they are…because she said that. I don’t think I’d remember them otherwise.) Usually when my parents chewed me out I would get all sullen and sulky and resentful, but I remember feeling uncharacteristically nonchalant about that lecture, like What’s the big deal? I had no interest in it until they made it a “bad thing” worthy of yelling and punishment. Then my thought was hmm, if they’re so desperate to keep me away from it, there must be more to it than I thought…

      I wonder if they remember that too, or how they’d tell the story …

    • John Anderson says:

      Even if you don’t shame the boy, I’m not sure if it’s possible for a boy to not feel ashamed if his mother discusses porn with him at least not heterosexual porn. Granted I grew up a long time ago, but are kids today really that different?

    • Get the father to handle it if possible, that male-male bond is probably easier to deal with such an event. If you have a daughter though you may want to take care of it, but still either parent can handle it. Just don’t shame them, if they’re gonna look I suggest directing them to amateur couple based content which is the closest they’ll see to real sex (hopefully for a few years at least!!). There is plenty of good porn around, just gotta find it.

      I Highly! suggest though that they go through decent sex ed before porn though!

  6. wellokaythen says:

    P.S. Be careful not to make the keyboard sticky. It can be hard to clean.

    • wellokaythen says:

      P.P.S. If you find a site with your mom and/or me on it, let me know immediately. As far as we know those were all shut down, but some may have escaped our notice. Just so you know, we know they’re out there, so don’t be too surprised if you come across them. Happy surfing!

      • Nick, mostly says:

        Ooh, I might try that with my son.

        “Here is the only site I know your mother and I aren’t on. We’ve been trying to get our pics and vids deleted from the internet, but people keep copying and uploading them. Just let one of us know if you come across one and we’ll handle the DMCA takedown notice.”

  7. Shame he didn’t try to include something about how most porn isn’t really like sex in the real world. Unless he let the kid know sites with real people sharing sex instead of it just being done to women. Cos that would have been brilliant.

    • Nick, mostly says:

      Here’s what else he said:

      UPDATE: After he went in his room he came right out and talked to me. Although it didn’t last for more than five minutes I think it was productive. He thanked me for not getting mad or telling mom. I also talked to him about porn not being like real life and that women aren’t objects like they are portrayed in porn. I gave him the option to ask questions but he said he didnt have any right now. I hope he does later. It went really well.

      • Way to generalize porn, sheesh. Dunno about others but I don’t see women as objects in porn and watch content that has great coverage of both people and everyone gets their fair share.

  8. It’s disappointing that the father seemed more concerned about the $1800 computer and making a “big deal” out of it, than he was about talking to his son about sex and porn. It probably would’ve been uncomfortable, but talking to his kid about uncomfortable things is part of being a parent.

    • Nick, mostly says:

      See my post above. Also, he did say this:

      UPDATE: Seems some people haven’t seen the comments. I shortened this up substantially prior to him seeing it and took some of the preachiness away. I also took away the part about it bricking his computer which I knew wasn’t true but I was trying to scare him into not going to dodgy sites again.

    • I think he mentioned the cost of the computer so as not to make the porn a big deal in the child’s mind and make him feel ashamed. Deflection.

  9. I think he handled it perfectly.

    It’s hard to say if he could have or should have done something differently re the differences between porn and sex, because we don’t know what the links were that Dad sent. But you know what? This kid will learn the difference between porn and sex, because the real difference is in the relationship. And a dad who knows how to nurture his relationship with his son probably does a fine job nurturing his relationship with his son’s mother too. My guess is that this kid sees a real relationship in his home, and that will teach him plenty.

  10. This is a great response, all in all. I would like to see us develop to a point in our culture where actually talking about sex with your children isn’t so uncomfortable. I am sad that it is so separate. I don’t like the idea of a money driven entity such as the business of porn having a lone, unchecked influence on the developing sexuality of youth.
    I do believe objects of our first focus of sexual exploration stick with us through life and can form preferences and fetishes. I believe we would raise a happier generation if their first sexual focus was something more realistic, obtainable, and mutually satisfying. The more complex fantasies and explorations can come later in life.

  11. PEOPLE! Read the original post as linked above the article. The father addressed the porn vs. reality issue in a discussion he later had with his son. It is listed as the first UPDATE on the original post. I think he handled this damn near perfectly.

  12. Jean Brandt says:

    For one thing, the problem with porn is the shaming aspect, the hidden nature of it. If a boy feels he have to do it in secret, then he will habitually think that sex is shameful. I am glad the dad invited his son into a closer relationship without being judgmental. Then once they are talking again, it would be the perfect opportunity for him to explain to the growing young man what sex really is, and not to isolate and internalize his urges. Instead he should teach responsible and positive concepts about erotic expression.
    May I add that this is not something a mom can do effectively for her boy? There are things she can teach, but it is up to the dad to teach his son about sexuality. So dads step up and don’t let his open young mind soak up misinformation and shame.

    • “If a boy feels he have to do it in secret, then he will habitually think that sex is shameful.”

      This is a good point, but one important thing to note. Porn is not sex. Porn is porn. Sex is sex. Masturbating to porn is masturbation to porn. Even in the sweetest amateur porn, you’re generally still doing what feels good for the camera, not what feels good for each other (although there is some more instructional stuff out there that is focused on pleasure nowadays, but it’s quite a minority). It’s still a show; it’s still a performance. Sex, on the other hand, is a back and forth dance of giving. receiving, and communication between two (or more) people.

      • Joanna Schroeder says:

        Amen to that.

      • Nick, mostly says:

        I think sex can be filmed, making it both performance and including that give and take. Aside from instructional videos, it’s an even smaller part of porn, which is why I advocate being very selective in your consumption.

      • i’m agree. porn is porn, sex is sex, for me its different thing. But I want to add more from male point of view. Porn for me is just visual stimulation. I like to watch porn, but i NEVER expected my sex life is like porn. NEVER. yes sex in porn is rarely focus on giving the womens pleasure, rarely doing kissing and foreplay, but am i gonna do it in my real sex? HELL NO!!!!!!!!!! This is hard to understand for women. I like porn but i never want my sex is like porn? Why? because i love intimacy, foreplay, passion, I love it, i craving it, i do it not to please my woman only, but to please myself.

        And I dont need lesson and education about how sex in porn and sex in real life is different. I learn from relationship and comunication with women.


    • May I add that this is not something a mom can do effectively for her boy? There are things she can teach, but it is up to the dad to teach his son about sexuality. So dads step up and don’t let his open young mind soak up misinformation and shame.

      So you understand that this isn’t necessarily some effort to perpetuate the battle of sexes by not letting mom in on a father/son conversation?

      Thanks!!!!

      (I would change that to “…this may not be not something a mom….” but other than that I can dig it.)

  13. John Anderson says:

    “Shame he didn’t try to include something about how most porn isn’t really like sex in the real world.”

    It’s not? Next you’ll be telling me that wrestling is fake and Santa Claus doesn’t exist. :)

  14. It’s good that there was no “toxic shaming”…..it could have been better if he reminded his son that there’s more to sex than porn and that porn is not a true reflection of actual sex, relationships or women. Here’s hoping it’s a conversation that they will have, eventually.

    • The Wet One says:

      How stupid do you think kids are? How could porn possibly = relationship or even a reasonably fascimile of one? That’s so weird.

      Kids live with a parent, sometimes even two. Those that live with two parents live with an actual relationship every single day. They don’t see their parents having sex (which is the only part of the parental relationship that has anything to do with sex in one sense). How would a kid confuse the two? Are there really any men out there that think that porn = relationship? Really? Are there women that think this?

      I’m rather curious.

  15. I agree that he missed a chance to talk to his kid about various birds and bees issues. I also don’t think he should have provided him alternate porn sites to go to. Depending on who that kid tells about his coolest dad ever that could wind him up in a whole world of nothing positive going on in his life. I would imagine a teacher hearing through the grapevine if not overhearing it directly would likely not be as understanding about the sharing of porn between a father and son. Or any other mandated reporter for that matter.

    • John Anderson says:

      From a legal aspect, I think you’re right. From a parenting aspect, I’m not so sure. Is it better to provide moderate amounts of alcohol to your children and their friends in a home where they are supervised, where parents can monitor consumption? Parents can hold the car keys until they’re sure that a child is sober, etc. People argue against abstinence only education because they believe that children will have sex anyway and if they’re going to, we should provide them with the knowledge of and access to contraceptive and condoms to prevent pregnancy and STDs.

      I think that depends largely on whether you feel that some forms of pornography is harmful or more harmful and whether you feel that extended exposure to pornography is harmful. It might be better to control what and how much he sees from a parenting standpoint. Should the law be changed / interpreted to reflect this?

      • I have no problem with porn from my stand point. I’m also a realist that a kid is going to find something pornographic to look at if that is something he’s really interested in. Even without redirection of the father. I don’t even necessarily think that’s harmful. I’ve worked with teenagers and had many a long talk with them about porn, sex and all those things. Not once did I supply them with porn. I suggested they make healthy choices about it. Don’t do anything to infect their computers and don’t steal credit cards to access it and left it at that. With how accessible porn is there really is no reason to give out links to it and suggest sites.

        If anyone wants to make to share porn like that with their kids that’s a choice they’re going ot have to make. I don’t think any forms are more harmful than other forms. Different strokes for different folks. But I don’t feel the legal issues there are inherently bad either or restrictive of parenting since there are numerous ways to hold a conversation about this topic without busting out the proverbial stash. And the law does address some issues with sexual maltreatment of children and I would hate to see that removed for the children that really need it to be there. Not all children are willing participants in their parent’s sharing of porn as an education on sexuality. We all know that. I feel it’s more important to protect those children.

        • You do realize why he supplied the links right? It’s because the sites his son was visiting were harmful to the computer, and he provided safezones that he has vetted to ensure they’re ok. There is a huge difference in supplying or showing a son/daughter where to find porn to be safe vs showing it to them around you for grooming. If the kid is gonna look at porn, it’s best to do it in a safe manner similar to how I’d rather my kids drank alcohol at home vs going out n getting drunk at parties. It’s pretty much impossible to stop the kid accessing porn somehow if they really want unless you’re willing to cut internet and give them zero privacy, and at 13 they’re old enough to have their privacy for masturbation and left in peace in a safe manner.

          You can install filters etc, put the PC in the living room and that will help but they may look at it on their phone or at a friends house, hence why good education is needed on it.

  16. I think he gave him other sites to go to as a way of saying that watching porn in and of itself isn’t inherently bad (and I don’t think it is, one may get unhealthy ideas from it and SOME porn is bad but one cannot not just blanketly say “porn is bad”).

    Personally if it were me I probably would have pressed a bit more to have an actual conversation (in order to further push what I just said above if anything).

    I wager this dad probably has a hard time trying to have any conversation with his son, much less one on as hot of a topic as sex.

    Does he have a responsibility to go more into detail about the differences between porn and sex?
    As his parent I’d say yes. Being his parent means he is responsible for preparing him for the real world and this is such information is certainly something one needs in the real world.

    Is he underestimating the influence of porn on young boys?
    Possibly. There is a chance that he could develop unhealthy habits from porn watching and its possible that he won’t. It’s also possible that he’ll give up porn watching one day. Seriously I’ve know plenty of guys who straight up don’t watch porn.

    Should he have told Mom?
    Nope. If he wanted to include her then sure but I don’t think there is any necessity in telling her.

  17. Ironically, when I attempted to respond here, spam popped up.
    That’s a pretty great parent. It’s so important not to loose your cool, more parents should write letters to thier kids, about anything!
    I have a son who is pretty open with me, I’m frank and understanding about his ‘changes’ and hopefully will have educated him enough by the time his hormones take over completely that he still feels he can come to me with questions or concerns. I’m a mom, and I grew up with four brothers and know enough about guys to be able to warn him that God only gave men enough blood in thier body to operate either thier brain or thier penis, and not both at the same time ;)
    My friend is a single mother with a fourteen year old and they communicate just fine as well.
    Moms are not the worst person to talk to about these things. We can handle it – give us some credit.
    By the way, whoever started the joke about seeing his parents on the web – that was some funny stuff!! I immediately wanted to follow that person on twitter.
    Take it easy everyone and good luck out there.
    JB

    • “God only gave men enough blood in thier body to operate either thier brain or thier penis, and not both at the same time”

      so you think when a man getting aroused, he cant use his brain at all and he cant control his desire?? Even when i’m getting aroused, i can clearly think and i can use my brain. What you women know about men’s brain? Maybe you can teach your boys, that men clearly can use their penis and their brain at the same time, so they can control their actions and behaviours when they getting aroused.

      • John Anderson says:

        She was joking. Look at the smiley face at the end. You’re being way too serious.

        • wellokaythen says:

          And, if it weren’t a joke, it’s way off-base. My penis has nothing to do with the way that I think. That’s an outrageous stereotype. It’s my testicles that control my thoughts.

          • Actually... says:

            There have been studies proving men aren’t able to think as clearly when viewing cleavage, breasts, or adult material. There was a study just on MSN today. Also, look into the Coolidge Effect and how porn directly affects men’s labido, stamina, and erectile dysfunction- even at early ages 18 years old and up.
            As a former adult film actress, I didn’t perform for children. Adult content is called ADULT CONTENT for a reason. It is against the law for minors to view adult content, hence the “ENTER IF OVER 18″ and “EXIT IF UNDER 18″ splash pages on every website containing adult content. The psychological effects pornography has on developing brains outweigh any “fantasies” young boys and girls believe they “need.” Bottom line, they should not be viewing hardcore pornography. They should learn how to use their imagination and learn sex through experience and proper sexual health education. It would be much more beneficial, and extremely less damaging for their future sexual health and sexual experiences.

        • so what if i’m being too serious?? I just stating a fact, that man can use their brain when aroused. You realise that phrase can use to make excuse for rapist right??? Oh i cannot think because shes makes me aroused so i raped her.

          I’m a guy and i hate stupid jokes like that. It makes guy looks like stupid horny dogs that only think of sex

  18. It seems really wrong to leave a parent completely in the dark about something significant in their kid’s life. “Don’t tell mom”. Really? Does the mother not have the right to have input into raising the kid just because the kid is male?

    • Does the mother not have the right to have input into raising the kid just because the kid is male?
      Of course not. It’s more about getting the son to open up. If the son doesn’t clam up over getting mom involved that’s great. But which is more important, making sure mom has input or making sure the son has a safe space to talk?

      It’s the same logic behind parts of a mother/daughter relationship that dad might not be privy to.

      • John Anderson says:

        Agreed, it’s what’s best for the children not the parents.

        • Basically and I wager that we were talking about whether a dad should be in on every single detail of his daughters life rather than her sharing stuff with mom only people would be tripping over themselves to call him a patriarchal tyrant of some sort. But I guess moms really are the better parent so they should be told anything and everything regardless of the outcomes.

      • Great way of clarifying Danny!

      • UPDATE: After he went in his room he came right out and talked to me. Although it didn’t last for more than five minutes I think it was productive. He thanked me for not getting mad or telling mom…

        also, that dad and son both independently came to the same conclusion not to inform the mum. suggests that she has a less liberal view of porn, sex etc, and would have made a big issue of it

        • You may have a point. You know I’m wondering how the “he was teaching his son shame by cutting mom out” crowd feels about mother/daughter relationships where dad is not in the in know about all the details of the daughter’s life.

          I won’t try to speak for all that are thinking this but I have noticed in my own experience that among those who think that way there are those who carry the gendered presumption that moms are more loving so they should be told everything but dads are controlling so it’s okay to leave them out of the loop sometimes.

          I guess it’s blanketly okay to declare such situations as shameful when mom is left out but necessary when dad is left out with no room to adjuestment.

          In this particular situation the dad isn’t necessarily teaching shame. He could be wary about how the mother might react. He could be trying to create a safe space for his son to talk openly (a “men’s space” I dare say?). But I suppose since that goes against the conventional wisdom of mothers being all loving his weariness is automatically judged as unjustified and wrong.

  19. I work in the tech field. I clean malware and viruses every day. I have been doing it for over 15 year. I have never, ever seen a virus or malware infection that “fries” a computer. I challenge anyone here to find a single known virus or malware infection that “fries” a computer. The worst virus or malware damage I’ve seen was undone with fdisk and a complete system reinstall. Of course, that can mean losing all your data but that’s also why people should learn about data backup. There are lots of things that can happen to a computer that can cause complete data loss.
    Having said that – redirect to “better” porn sites? Really? How about talking to him about the difference between love, sex and porn. I know too many men and a few women who are so addicted to porn they find regular relationships with real people impossible. That is the real problem with porn sites. They will do far more damage to a young boys ability to relate to others sexually then they will ever do to the computer.

    • Nick, mostly says:

      I’ve been working with computers for almost 30 years now. I don’t know of anyone viruses in the wild that destroy hardware, but I’ve seen enough network controllers destroyed by programming errors to know that someone with malicious intent could do the same. Of course, since the purpose of most viruses is to setup botnets, that would defeat the purpose. However, I once wrote a virus that could fry ATI graphic cards, just to prove it can be done. Never released it into the wild though (I’m not evil).

      You should read some of the other comments and perhaps the original post on reddit before you get all indignant. He did have a talk with him. He did admit the part about “bricking” the computer was meant to be a scare tactic, rather than factual.

    • My last computer got “fried” by a virus. It wasn’t even from visiting porn sites. I don’t know where it came from. Apparently, the first thing it did was disable my anti-virus software, then it opened doors for a lot of other bad stuff. My computer became a spambot, part of some network controlled in eastern Europe or God-knows-where. I noticed it was running slower than usual, but thought it was just old. I seemed to be having trouble getting my anti-virus software to update. I shrugged it off . A few weeks later, my computer wouldn’t start at all. I think the guy at the tech store did use the word “fried.” Also “stupid” and “very stupid” and “did I mention you were stupid?” (kidding about that last part) :-)

      • John Anderson says:

        The theory as I understand it is that if I can cause one part of the computer to work constantly, I could genera enough heat to fry the part. Your computer may have proved the theory, but some techs will use the term fried when talking to a user because it’s easy for the user to understand and a lot more professional than FUBAR, the last 4 letters standing for up beyond all repair. You can infer what the first letter stands for.

  20. I think the father missed out on a prime opportunity to really have a discussion with his son about sex. Our conversations with kids need to go deeper then the obligatory and gruff “you know that’s not real right son”. I think a big part of the problem regarding sexual material is that parents don’t really talk about it with their kids. They skate around it with little comments here and there. This letter skates around a real discussion for me. I also don’t like how he made a point about not telling Mom. Like it was Son and Dad against Mom. Not to mention not being a fan of father and son sharing porn sites. It’s a bit too close for comfort to me. It’s like the Mom who wants to wear the mini skirts from her daughter’s closet.

    I don’t think we should shame each other for our sexuality. But I don’t think we should tip toe around it so much that we don’t want to rock the boat or make a big deal out of it either. Sex is a big deal. there is nothing wrong with that. the messages young boys are going to take away from looking at all that internet porn is a big deal. A single letter or a single conversation isn’t enough to teach young boys about the complexity of this issue.

    I’m kind of surprised there is such a positive response to this letter. While I think the father was doing the best he could, for me, the basic message was one of shame. He wasn’t going to tell “mom” because he didn’t want the boy to feel shame, he wasn’t going to confront him face to face because he doesn’t want his boy to feel shame, he wasn’t going to make a big deal out of it because he wanted to tip toe around the difficult topic…the letter is basically shrouded in secrecy and shame if you ask me because of the father’s unwillingness to confront his son directly while also creating a “it’s you and me against Mom” back drop by purposely saying he wasn’t going to tell Mom and giving the son tips on great porn sites.

    Is this what men do though? They share their porn sites with their sons and don’t tell “Mom” about it? This is healthy and positive?

    Women are never going to get a break on this issue are they. It’s just going to always be about pornography and how much men love it and need it and teach their sons not to feel ashamed for their desire for porn even as porn shames everything about what real women are. This is so sucky.

    • Is this what men do though? They share their porn sites with their sons and don’t tell “Mom” about it? This is healthy and positive?
      I think the don’t tell mom part was a measure meant to spare the son’s feelings. Sure we could make this about the mom’s possible feelings or try to make this about the dad trying to consciously perpetuate the battle of the sexes. But why can’t it be just a matter of trying to get the son to open up in a way that he wouldn’t feel right about with mom?

      Yes it would be nice if kids were more open with sensitive topics like this with their opposite gender parent but is that worth basically telling the kid, “Screw your feelings your (opposite gender parent)’s feelings are more important?

      I know that as a son when I was that age I wouldn’t have wanted to have that conversation with my mom.

      Women are never going to get a break on this issue are they. It’s just going to always be about pornography and how much men love it and need it and teach their sons not to feel ashamed for their desire for porn even as porn shames everything about what real women are. This is so sucky.
      So you’re just going to ignore the folks that are saying the conversation should have gone deeper?

      • I’m not trying to make it about Mom’s feelings. Infact, my comments really have nothing to do with her personal feelings. I don’t like the idea that a father is purposely pitting him and his son up againt his Mom in a conspiracy bonding thing. He didn’t even have to mention Mom in the letter and could later discuss with his wife what he found and that he had it under control. I do think sex education shold largely come from Fathers toward sons. But if you teach your child to be ashamed of their sexuality even with their other parent, then you are still teaching shame on some level.

        I am also not ignoring the people that said the conversation could have gone deeper. But there seems to be a higher positive response to the letter then what I thought.

        • I’m not trying to make it about Mom’s feelings. Infact, my comments really have nothing to do with her personal feelings. I don’t like the idea that a father is purposely pitting him and his son up againt his Mom in a conspiracy bonding thing.
          Fine if it’s not about mom’s feelings your comments still seem to point towards this being an intentional battle of the sexes on dad’s part.

          I think we differ at your use of “purposely”. I don’t think dad’s exclusion of her on this was for the intentional purpose making it a dad and son vs mom but rather son doesn’t have to include mom if he doesn’t feel comfortable about it.

          But if you teach your child to be ashamed of their sexuality even with their other parent, then you are still teaching shame on some level.
          Is he teaching his son to be ashamed of his sexuality around mom or is he giving him room to not be forced to include her in it (until the time comes when he is more ready for it)?

          • I would feel the same way if it was two Dads or Two Moms raising a child and one parent told the child that they weren’t going to tell the other parent. When you pull stuff like that you create a misplaced overly incestious bond with your child that isn’t healthy and you are pitting the two of you against the other parent. Which I think lowers respect for the other parent. Doesn’t matter if the other parent is of the same sex or of a different sex. I would feel the same way if it was a Mom keeping something from a Father as well.

            • wellokaythen says:

              I think you make some very good points here. The conspiracy of silence can set up a bad dynamic. Though, it’s possible in this case that the mom has let it be known that she doesn’t want to hear about such things about her son. I imagine many old-fashioned dads don’t really want to hear about their daughter’s menstrual cycles, so they buy into the policy of an exclusive mother-daughter conversation about it. I’m not saying that’s always a healthy approach, but it’s not the end of the world either.

              I also think there is a bit of a balancing act required here. On the one hand, it’s important to be open and honest and not always tiptoe around sex. On the other hand, there ought to be some level of privacy about one’s masturbatory habits. Parents should be able to break through some discomfort about talking about sex, but some discomfort should be respected. There’s a difference between wanting privacy and feeling ashamed, though it can be hard to tell sometimes when it comes to sexuality.

            • I’ll agree that it CAN create such a bond I am not so quick to go straight to making that accusation here.

              What if she doesn’t want to know about it?

              Do we then switch from “Dad and son shouldn’t have left her out.” to “She’s old fashioned and needs to get over herself for not wanting to know.”?

              This set up of son’s porn/masturbation/sex could be something that he wants limited to dad for reasons that could be just as valid as a daughter wanting to limit such conversation to mom.

              I think what is bothering me is that dad/son is not being given the same consideration (because Erin while you may have a problem with mom/daughter leaving dad out of something most people range from thinking it’s a good idea to thinking something is wrong with the dad for wanting to be left out to lord knows what).

              I’ll ask again, what’s more important? Making sure mom doesn’t get left out or making sure son has a safe space to talk about those things?

    • John Anderson says:

      @ Erin

      A friend of mine was shot when he was about 20 years old. That was roughly 25 years ago and his mom still doesn’t know. A female friend of ours was incensed when she heard. She told us that if she was his mom, she’d want to know.

      Sons love their moms as much as moms love their sons. A boy / man will protect his mom and his relationship with his mom. I’m 45 and my mom still thinks I’m and angel, if only she knew. She still uses the phrase he’s a good boy to describe me to her friends and relatives. Boys are scared to death of losing that. I think moms know this. I remember reading advice one mom was giving to another. She stressed the importance of raising a son properly when he was young because when he’s 6’ 5”, 300 lbs, and built like a tank, how will you get him to come home from the park at 11:00 at night. It won’t be fear. It will be respect and not a small amount of love. He doesn’t want to hurt or disappoint his mom.

      If the father knows that the mom won’t let on that she knows, I think more men would be sympathetic to telling her. I think the dad knew that his son would be deathly afraid that his mom would find out. He told his son that he’s not telling his mom to ease the boy’s fears. The boy is more likely to open up to his dad now that he knows his dad won’t instantly report to his mom. The dad wasn’t teaching shame. He knew that his son was hiding his porn use (rather poorly) because he was already ashamed. The dad was trying to create a safe space for the boy to talk.

      • Yes he was. And I hope that one day it will be possible for those mothers and sons, as adults, to have conversations about things honestly. It’s saddening to hear how much fear the loss of love, how much shame is out there. I’m sure there are things my sons might do that I won’t respect or like, but you know what? I’d never stop loving them, or stop wanting to know who they were.
        That being said? I think everyone has the right to their own privacy about topics.

      • John, I appreciate the desire for a man to want to protect the woman in his life. Be it mother, sister, grandmother or wife or girlfriend. But I don’t think it’s a totally healthy way to go about the situation. I don’t think the mother needs to be part of the conversation with the son directly. I don’t think the son needs to go to the Mom or even know she knows. I do think the Father has a responsibility to say, “Hey this is what is going on with our kid. This is what I’ve said to him. I got it covered.” That’s what parents do. They talk about the things their chidlren are going through together as a team. If one partner wants to handle a certain facet of teachings, that’s fine. I just don’t like that the male bonding is on teh back of keeping secrets from Mom.

        And unfortunetly, I see this problem regularly with guys. They have “bro codes” or things they keep among themselves. They honor a code of honor among one another that sometimes seems disrespectful to the woman in their lives in my own opinion. I think male bonding is important. But I don’t like the secrets and walls that men sometimes build up between themselves and women in favor of male bonding.

        I remember when I was growing up and my Mom talking to me about sex. I was embarressed as heck and hated every second of it. But a few years later when I was 15/16, I knew I could go to her and ask her things. She also cultivated that same kind of relationship with my brother. And as adults, he also talks about how he hated it first but knew he could go to her. Of course we were embarressed about it at first! But her openness and willingness to talk to us about it eventually paid off. Although, I am not saying that always has to be the way it’s handled. I am not advocating for the boy and Mom to have a deep conversation or for the boy to even know that the Mom knows.

        I simply think the Father is missing the boat on communication both with his son and his wife. It’s all “hush hush”. He doesn’t want his son to feel ashamed for his sexuality. He even gives him websites that clearly the father knows about and enjoys himself. When you say things like “I’m not going to tell your Mom”, you are creating that room for shame. Then, when he grows into a young man and has relationships with women, he is going to carry that same mentality along with him that his partner doesn’t need to know what he is really up to. Which is a root problem because men are not honest about what they are really doing. And then the woman is left shell shocked after stumbling accidently over his “I want to bang the babysitter” porn.

        Again, I am not saying the boy needs to say anything to Mom or that Mom needs to say anything to the boy. Although I see nothing wrong with embarressing your child a little to talk about them about sex if it means they know your open to the discussion, man or woman. I am saying that the Father has responsibility to his wife and to his Son and not to shut his wife out by keeping things about their child together away from her.

        I think his method is teaching that boy that his sexuality is shameful to his mother and thus, shameful to women. Sure, the boy might feel relieved in the moment. He is a young boy after all. But now he knows that his sexuality is something to be hidden away from women.

    • Yes, it’s not about you and it’s not about making you happy. This is a father communicating with his son, and their relationship doesn’t have to satisfy your criteria to be positive and constructive.

      Since you’re coming into this situation with a preconception that there can be no such thing as a healthy attitude toward porn (other than hatred), this conversation is never going to satisfy you. And that’s fine; it doesn’t need to.

      • Copyleft, I think you are being a bit harsh on me. I am not trying to make it about me or what makes me happy. Anymore then I am sure you are. We all have different ideas on how the situation should be handled. I am not even saying that the Son and Mom need to have a huge conversation about it. Although I don’t think there is anything wrong with that if they did. I think the majority of sex talks probably does need to come from a boy’s Father. But I wish the Mom was included as well so that she can offer her son advice in her own feminine way. Without that, the boy is only getting half of the picture. The Father can’t speak for women can he?

        All I am saying is the Father shouldn’t pit him and his son in secrecy by keeping things from Mom. He didn’t even need to make mention of Mom in his letter. He could tell his wife what is going on an say he has got it covered and keep the conversation between him and his Son at the same time.

        I don’t think my attitude toward porn is unhealthy. I don’t think that people who like and accept porn are neccesarily holding healthy views of porn either. I do really dislike porn and I hate the women are represented and treated in it. The fact that it’s fantasy doesn’t take the sting out of the way men wish to see women sexually. A way that is heavily imbalanced and infavor of men more then it is mutual sexual enjoyment.

        • “I don’t think my attitude toward porn is unhealthy. I don’t think that people who like and accept porn are necessarily holding healthy views of porn either. I do really dislike porn and I hate the women are represented and treated in it. The fact that it’s fantasy doesn’t take the sting out of the way men wish to see women sexually. A way that is heavily imbalanced and infavor of men more then it is mutual sexual enjoyment.”

          Which is why educating people when young is a great opportunity to steer it towards a middle ground. Do you dislike ALL porn, or just the majority though? Are you ok with ethical stuff, egalitarian based, mutual sexual enjoyment? (and yes I know you believe it’s very rare)

        • wish? for me porn is just visual stimulation, not WISH…..so if some guy watch porn with guy only doing penetration no foreplay no kissing its his WISH in real sex, real relationship? give me a break, what kind of guy do you ever dated to??? and youre not a guy, you dont know how we guys think, stop thinking like you know all about guys !!!!!!!!

    • Looks like my other comment got modded away?

      “Is this what men do though? They share their porn sites with their sons and don’t tell “Mom” about it? This is healthy and positive?”
      Sharing sexuality and views on it is healthy, keeping it from mum though is an issue.

      “I don’t think we should shame each other for our sexuality.”

      You say that, then you say

      “Women are never going to get a break on this issue are they. It’s just going to always be about pornography and how much men love it and need it and teach their sons not to feel ashamed for their desire for porn even as porn shames everything about what real women are. This is so sucky.”
      So you generalize about porn shaming EVERYTHING about what real women are. Don’t you get it yet? When you say that, you’re shaming the men and women who look at porn. To like porn is to like something that in your words “shames everything about what real women are” so there’s no positivity there, it’s only negative, porn cannot be good so that boy looking at porn is using something that is negative to women only, never positive, how is that not shaming him? If you ever have kids, I highly suggest not saying all porn is bad, but encourage them to find good porn if they do look at it as it is out there.

      If the mother has a view of porn like yours then I can see why he’d want to keep it from her. I myself have this feeling that I should feel ashamed to look at porn from what you say about porn, you seem to see it as only negative and degrading to women so how can someone look at porn and feel anything but shame from that? How would a son feel if their mother (or father) said porn shames everything about women and generalizes about how bad it is without being able to accept there is good porn or even mention it? If that kid has seen good porn then he’ll be confused, wondering why you think all of it is bad and quite frankly he probably won’t feel very close to you because of it as it’s a lie.

      You can point out the bad porn n talk about how it’s bad, but I see no benefit in casting it all under the same blanket. It’s actually a great opportunity to teach the son or daughter to look for good, ethical, egalitarian porn and support it. If more people did that then even the pro industry would probably clean up it’s act far more. It’s possible to enjoy porn in a healthy manner, as long as you also have education from other places on things like respecting men and women, consent, high quality sex ed, relationship advice etc.

    • Quadruple A says:

      Erin wrote: “porn shames everything about what real women are.”

      Erin, I like porn when it portrays women as beautiful, sexy, sweet, and wonderful human beings. I think that women who are in porn are real women who deserve our respect and should not be shamed.

  21. Quadruple A says:

    There are a number of reasons that you might be uneasy about a 13 year old viewing porn but I think one of the most obvious ones is how brutal some porn can be. If I knew that my child was going to be watching porn no matter what I’d probably want to steer him or her toward Youporn rather than those other sites like Slutload. Malware would not be my biggest concern. Porn portrays certain social and political realities as well that aren’t always the ideal even when porn isn’t brutal.

    • Joanna Schroeder says:

      Great points, Quadruple A.

      I think my biggest worry, as a mom of sons, would be my kids’ understanding of how sex REALLY works and how porn can damage that.

      I wish someone would make great porn that models active consent and partner-driven pleasure. That would be brilliant.

      • Yeah, and dont forget to keep your daughters away from romance(erotic) novels too.

        • ^ this. A thousand times this.
          I don’t know if you meant this ironically or sarcastically, but there is a nugget of truth in this statement.

      • “I wish someone would make great porn that models active consent and partner-driven pleasure. That would be brilliant.”
        That’s been around for years, hell a LOT of porn includes that. When the actress is saying “F me baby”, that’s active consent. Granted quite a lot has a very stereotypical view of pleasure for both but a lot of porn has a HEAVY focus on pleasure for both male n female. But the type of pleasure only works for some people I suspect, but you can look up more sensual porn which has a heavy foreplay emphasis, feminist porn, etc.

        Do many people just not understand porn or something? I can easily find what you’re talking about…hell amateur porn is heavily focused on both having pleasure since they’re usually a couple. Maybe my interwebz is magic and has access to porn that most people don’t see? Or maybe porn has such a bad stereotype that people haven’t really bothered to look at what is there and just follow what they hear from others on the matter. Porn has soooooo many different types, categories, styles, ranging from beautiful to grotesque, you can find nearly any type of porn if you look.

      • do people really believe only men watch porn? Your daughter could watch porn too (in this days of free internet porn, its probably ) . Or porn can only have bad influences on boys not girls for you?

    • Porn addiction? Hello?

      A 13 year old is not emotionally or psychologically equipped to deal with porn addiction just as she/he is not equipped to deal with alcohol addiction. This is so wrong.. to condone porn as part of ‘growing’ up. Sexuality is a gift.. don’t ruin it.

  22. The discussion of Porn vs. Reality is what’s really important here.
    Boys need to know that Porn is Fantasy, and the expectations created in porn are generally unattainable.
    There does seem to be a growing movement to educate –
    a terrific place to start is the poorly named
    makelovenotporn.com
    which sounds judgmental, but is actually pro-porn, pro-love, and pro knowing the difference.

    • what are those expectations?
      That women find your sexuality as delicious and irresistible as you find theirs? That women can get turned on and ready to fuck just as you are by looking at their genitalia?

      The fantasy that porn creates is female sexual availability. We do need to teach boys that women are different, their sexuality is different and that obtaining sex in real life is difficult if youre a man. I guess most young men know this already.

      If anything we need to teach young girls that 99% of men dont measure up to Christian Grey and they should consider giving some affection and sex to normal men they come across in their lives.

      • Well said!

      • “If anything we need to teach young girls that 99% of men dont measure up to Christian Grey and they should consider giving some affection and sex to normal men they come across in their lives.”

        Seriously? That’s what you get from this story?

        Girls have no obligation to ‘give sex’ to anyone. Not ever in their lives if they don’t feel like it. Girls are not sexual vending machines. Sorry if that’s difficult to grasp but they’re just not, any more than you feel as though *you* are one.

        If the influence of the piece of crap erotica you mention is actually a problem any boy or man affected simply needs to find more interesting and intelligent women to date.

        • The influence of crap erotica is that some women expect men to be dominant alpha male like Christian Grey in sex inside a relationship. I don’t expect any women to give sex to me but don’t expect all men are sex hunger super confident dominant alpha male like Christian Grey also. Some men like vanilla sex, some men don’t like to be dominant, some men don’t like have to always initiating sex all the time, and some men cannot ready all the time to have sex.

          How many women said ” My husband reject sex, he must be cheating, gay, or addicted to porn. Because men should be wanting it all the time”.

        • Kate J
          In any discussion relating on this matter, it is very common for women to accuse men of being ‘entitled to sex’. Whatever that means.

          Here is the ‘expert ‘advice commonly dispensed to young regarding porn usage – “Boys should be taught that porn is not reality and they should not hold the women they date to the same standards of appearance”

          I simply reversed the sexes in the above advice. I get that the male perspective didnt go down well with you

          Read more at http://goodmenproject.com/good-feed-blog/dad-finds-porn-on-sons-computer-leaves-compassionate-note/#CAMDE2wb0TKSAfh0.99

          • Why don’t you ask her what she meant by men acting entitled to sex rather than tell her she doesn’t understand your male perspective? Obviously you’re the one who doesn’t understand.

            • Why are we men told by the anti-porn feminist brigade that one of the adverse affects of porn usage is men’s raised expectations of women’s appearance?

              When in reality womens expectations are a more common and widespread issue?

              Do you like being told that women should stop reading romance novels, stop fantasizing about Christian Grey and stop holding men to unrealisitic standards in dating?

              You dont. Because when a man tells you that, you feel it reeks of entitlement.
              But you want to reserve the right to tell men how porn affects their standards regarding women.

            • This was completely unrelated to both my comment and Kate’s. No one said anything about attractiveness. I mean, you already admitted to not understanding what she meant by men acting entitled to sex, so you should be asking questions instead of giving really irrelevant and shitty answers.

      • Exactly. Having read ’50 Shades..’ it is astonishing how the stereotypical male is rammed down your throat — as in all female-orientated porn: wealthy , atheltic body, dominatant yet submissive knowing just when at the right times.

        UK / US society attacks visual porn for all it’s stereotypes, yet the BBC et a loves 50 Shades and anything that is female orientated despite the ludicrous stereotyping.

        That = hypocrisy.

  23. Parents can visit this site http://makelovenotporn.com/ to get some perspective for teens. It is not anti-porn but it promotes realistic sex ideals. I just heard about it on CBC this week and plan to spend some time researching it to talk to my own kids about sex/porn/reality.

  24. It looks like this father is taking the first step in having a discussion with his son about porn. Not embarrassing his son or throwing a shit-fit is going to allow this guy to get the opportunity to explain to his son the endless differences between porn and reality, and, who knows? maybe even have a healthy discussion about sex.

    • My understanding is that at 13, it’s already a little late to start talking about sex. I’d say 10 is a better age, when kids actually still listen to their parents.

  25. wellokaythen says:

    (Not kidding in this one.)

    I can see how some people might think this note was a less-than-ideal approach, but c’mon, the most common alternative reactions are mostly far worse. There is no great, wonderful solution, I think, just some that are less awkward or more compassionate or more realistic than others.

    Considering I never got any sex talk from my parents whatsoever, I’m very impressed by this dad’s approach. I raise my hand to say, “you know, there are much worse ways to handle this….”

  26. That dad was AWESOME.

    He took a harm reduction approach

    He knows he has a son and his son is going to look at porn, just like 99% of American males do (as dad himself probably did and likely still does).

    He just told his son to only look at porno sites that won’t damage his computer. He also lovingly told his son that he wants to spend more time with him, so he asked his son to spend less alone time on the computer and more family time with dad.

    That dad is an excellent parent and I’m sure his son will grow up to be a really good man.

  27. i’m 22 years old guy and until now, both my parents dont know i like to watch porn. My friends, my brothers, and my girlfriends know it, but my parents dont. They are so religious and conservative i dont think they can understand porn at all. Even my father never watch porn at all in his life, i know hes not lying because hes the most honest, loyal, and kind man i’ve ever known. My mother still think i’m her handsome innocent angel, i think she would be so dissapointed knowing i’m watching porn. I think if my parents have open minded view about porn, i would not be ashamed telling them i watch porn. BUt they are not, they even never talk about sex , even once, to their children. I learn about sex first from my friends and porn, sadly. BUt the weird thing is from the first time i watch porn i know that real sex is different from porn, and i never expected my real sex in relationship is gonna be like porn ( porn is just visual stimulation for me ).Maybe thats hard to understand for women. They think men watch porn are never want foreplay in real sex and they just want penetration and they just want to cum in womens face ( LOL ). But i really glad there are sites like Goodmenproject, where i can learn more about being a man, and how to be a good man.

    • You know, quite a lot of women don’t find facials degrading.

      • Maybe, but my point is just because i watch facials in porn doesnt mean i want to do it exactly like porn. What visually stimulates me in porn is different from what i want in real sex.

        And I dont really enjoy facial because i dont like kissing woman after sex with her face full of cum lol. But i dont have a problem cleaning cum of her face with my own tongue. I’m serious, its kind of hot, and my cum dont taste so bad.

        But I think the point in sex is not doing what not degrading or not. If both parties enjoy it, it would not be called degrading right???

      • Wow – really? I would grant you “some,” but “quite a lot?” I need to talk to these women and hear their perspective on what makes it not degrading, because I can’t get my head around that.

        Degrading or not, I have yet to encounter a woman who actually likes it, prefers it, or asks for it. I can only assume such women must exist because, hey, 7 billion people in this world, there’s gotta be at least a handful of women who get personal gratification out of it.

        But as sexually open-minded as I am… it would take a hell of a convincing argument to get me to change the way I feel about it.

        • wellokaythen says:

          I agree with KKZ about the likelihood of a woman liking it.

          There is a THIRD possibility — they tolerate it but find it neither wonderful nor degrading. There may be some who are more in the neutral camp. Enjoyment or repulsion are not the only two possibilities….

          • I didn’t realize I said women love it:P
            But yeah, tolerating it is probably common although I’ve heard of some that are turned on by it. I think how you view the act matters the most, if you think in the stereotypical anti-porn women are degraded manner then it won’t be enjoyable, but if you see it as just another act in sex that doesn’t have to be degrading then I think the likelihood of him/her enjoying it is much higher.

        • John Anderson says:

          I think the problem with facials is that it pretty much means you weren’t wearing a condom when having PIV. I’ve never bothered to whip it off just to finish on a woman’s face. That does bring up a question though. When receiving oral sex, would a woman prefer that a man finish outside her mouth? I never have and never had a woman complain, but I’ve also never asked before.

          • I use to whip it off after PIV and receive oral as a finisher sometimes. I’d always ask her though first. Has more to do with me not wanting to orgasm whilst PIV even with a condom and the pill, scary thought having kids when you’re broke! So it’s either finish with masturbation or oral until my trust in contraception increases. Seeing as men have zero reproductive rights after sperm has entered her, it scares the living shit out of me since I can’t afford kids, let alone have the energy to be a father or stability in my life at the moment.

            • John Anderson says:

              It’s not that I finish inside her (all the time). I’m just too lazy (or distracted) to take the condom off. Most women I’ve met don’t have a problem with blowing a guy using a condom of course there’s always the possibility they just don’t tell me. Some of it may have had to do with the push in the 90s to practice safe oral sex. I never did that cellophane thing when giving women oral though. It didn’t seem that serious and just felt weird besides who carries around cellophane?

        • Ask the women in the thread for Camille’s tips on how to recieve a bj. I asked there and a few were fine with it. Whether they enjoy it is a diff story but what is degrading about it? The intention to degrade is more important than the act itself as it can be very sexy to see your juices on your partner, and yes I find female juices highly erotic too. ;)

          Dunno what percentage, but I doubt more than 5% would downright feel it’s degrading, I think most women are intelligent enough to realize that when done with a partner that cares about them then it isn’t degrading. Sex itself can be degrading if your partner is treating you like shit, blowjobs can be degrading, etc.

          Why is it degrading to you?

        • Lets get on topic here this isn’t about women (even though most think everything is about them) This is about a 13 year old boy whose father caught him watching porn. The first thing that is going to happen is that he’s going to be embarrassed that his father knows then he’s going to panic waiting for the punishment bomb to drop. The father did the right thing he wrote a private letter for his son to read in private, no he’s giving the sonb time to digest what he said and when the son is ready he will come to him to talk about porn sex and hopefully everything he needs help with in life. Or he could have done like many suggest gone in guns blazing lecturing and scolding while the child is in embarrassed panic; thenb we end up with one more sexually disfunctional member of society who turn into a rapist or serial killer because he was treated like an abnormal at an emotionally tramatic time in his life. Its never a bad idea to give children and adults time to process what is going on in their lives and every reputable psychologist will tell you it is better do do what the father did and wait for the child to approach you WHEN THEY ARE READY not before.

          • Michael Rowe says:

            Well said, Wilmbear. It’s amazing how quickly even discussions as specific as these get derailed that way.

          • Suzy F. Jones says:

            Wilmbear–well stated. I am glad to see the father appoached the subject tactfully, respectfully, and lovingly, instead having mom talk to the son or ignoring it. Porn and sexting are realities that we must address. Porn is affecting all of us, most of these affects are negative. Also it is starting to damage our sex lives. I did some research on this and copy-pasted some of it for readers.

            “In one study [on pornography] approximately 65 percent or close to the majority of women felt “luke-warm” about a man’s usage of pornography, yet women indicated moderate levels of diminished self-esteem, comparison concerns, and unattractiveness. One third of the women in the study reported high levels of distress towards pornography and intimacy problems their partner. Those women likened pornography to infidelity and her partner’s propensity to cheat. Also, they reported pornography usage had negative effects on love making, they felt treated like objects, diminished her self-esteem, believed they could not compete with attractiveness of women in images, lost respect for her partner, and degraded his worth as a man. Frequency of use had an impact on women’s perceptions: low use was less than once per month to high use was 2 hours per day. Medium to high frequency porn use elicited the strongest negative feelings towards pornography. Income and religiosity do not have a significant relationship to the scores.”

            “Note another contemporary trend. Pornography induced sexual-dysfunction in males is on the rise. A growing number of young, healthy pornography users report having delayed ejaculations, an inability to be turned on by real partners, and sluggish erections. One article mentioned that many men in their 20s or so, can’t get it up anymore with a real girl, and they all relate having a serious porn/masturbation habit.”

            Internet porn is serious issue that parents must face. Kudos to the dad who wrote this letter.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0MZ_2PxnGk

            • Suzy F Jones

              Yeah right.

              “Porn is screwing expectations of what women should look like”
              BUT
              “Men would hit anything on two legs”

              Why do women like to perpetuate incompatible myths?
              Porn is a poor substitute to the real thing for most men. Its a masturbatory aid. Most men who watch porn would love to have sex with real everyday average looking women if they had the opportunity. Men are much more forgiving to women on their looks when it comes to choosing sexual partners.

              I’m more concerned about women devouring that 50 shades of shite novel. Already women’s standards are too high regarding the men they like to fuck and the popularity of such novels wont make it any easier for the common young man.

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              Tim– I don’t know who wrote those two quotes you have listed, but you are right that porn and 50 Shades are distorting expectations. A by-product of porn and 50 Shades, is lower self-esteem and emotional issues that parents are dealing with in their homes. Parents are trying to control their kid’s usage of technology and porn and battling self-esteem issues related to this. Mass-consumption of porn (written or visual) it is having negative effects on relationships and both sexes’ self-esteem.

            • Suzy

              I dont agree that porn is distorting men’s expectations of womens appearance. Men are much more forgiving to women on their looks when searching for casual sex. If porn was distorting men’s expectations, by now it would’ve been impossible for average looking women to get laid. It’s the opposite actually.

              You dont realize that the majority of regular porn consumers are single young men who have trouble getting laid. The immense popularity of porn is due to the fact that obtaining casual sex is not easy for most men and the sexual frustration. It is a cheap substitute for the real thing. Give your average porn addict an average looking woman and he’ll be more than happy (ok, this sounds demeaning but you get my point)

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              Tim–I take no offense and recognize the concerns for men. I think you may have hit the nail on the head with the term ‘casual sex’. Most women and cannot speak for all women, but most women are not seeking casual sex as an end, rather they seek quality committed, relationships.

              I am not certain if you have been keeping up the dilemmas that people experience with casual sex FWB arrangements, but the feedback is a resounding “it doesn’t work.” Both men and women are getting hurt in casual sex arrangements. It depends on the couple, but usually one partner wants more than the other and it ends abruptly.

              It is relatively easy for a woman of even modest looks to have casual sex, any halfway savvy woman can seduce a man into the bedroom, however that does not mean it will yield a quality relationship for her.
              On the other hand, any half savvy man can start a relationship with just about any woman, but that does not mean it will yield sex.

              In my personal opinion, I am not anti-porn, I wish we didn’t need porn in our lives and started rebuilding lasting connections with one another, instead of lasting connections with our computers and erotica novels.

            • “In one study [on pornography] approximately 65 percent or close to the majority of women felt “luke-warm” about a man’s usage of pornography, yet women indicated moderate levels of diminished self-esteem, comparison concerns, and unattractiveness.”

              So the negative effect is these women were insecure? Porn didn’t cause that, it’s just the temptation, they and their partner did. Partners need to work out what is acceptable and what isn’t and for those women porn isn’t acceptable, that’s an issue they have to work out with him. Blaming porn for disrespectful behaviour of partners and insecurity is pretty sad.

              “One third of the women in the study reported high levels of distress towards pornography and intimacy problems their partner.”
              So feelings of jealousy were causing intimacy problems? Again, a problem the partners need to work out. Porn is a tool, the user is at fault. This begs the question of why those women are insecure and have intimacy problems with their partner? Did they also include in the study how many of those women withheld sex from their partner? (the most common reason I’ve seen men turn to porn in relationships). How many of those women also feel distress if their partner has very attractive female friends? (A common issue I’ve heard of). There are legitimate issues with porn usage yes but I dare say quite a lot of that comes down to self-esteem issues in those women. How do you fix it? You encourage women to boost their self-esteem and stop putting a woman’s worth solely on looks n sexuality, why is it those women have such an issue yet plenty of women are fine with their partner looking at porn?

              “Those women likened pornography to infidelity and her partner’s propensity to cheat.”
              Any of those women read romance novels? Again this comes down to the woman’s negative views of pornography, how exactly is porn to blame? I’m sure there have been plenty of men in the early days of feminism who felt discomfort towards their partners getting a job and that caused issues too, does that mean women getting a job was to blame? I still hear of people who think a man should be working, a woman should be raising the kids and still hear of that causing issues in relationships, doesn’t mean feminism was to blame.

              “Also, they reported pornography usage had negative effects on love making, they felt treated like objects, diminished her self-esteem, believed they could not compete with attractiveness of women in images, lost respect for her partner, and degraded his worth as a man.”
              So basically women were insecure about their ability to please their partner, which then made them feel like objects, believed they couldn’t compete with the attractiveness of women in images, then lost respect for their partner AND DEGRADED HIS WORTH AS A MAN??? Good riddance to those women if they are willing to degrade his worth as a man.

              1/3rd of women surveyed degraded men based on unfounded perceptions they had of their relationship. Did they even bother talking it over with their partner, or just automatically assume they weren’t as pretty as the women in porn? These studies speak hugely about the level of insecurity women face but also of their own negative views towards porn and their partners. I would dump 1/3rd of those women if they were to degrade me for whatever reason and didn’t respect me.

              “One article mentioned that many men in their 20s or so, can’t get it up anymore with a real girl, and they all relate having a serious porn/masturbation habit.””
              How many men? A few, the majority? What you just said is about as useless as me saying an article mentioned many women in their 20’s rape children without mentioning a number or specifying an approximation such as minority of women, majority of women.

              To me is sounds like “many women” have negative views of pornography and are degrading n losing respect for their partners based on those views. Instead of blaming porn so heavily, maybe they should try figure out why they view it so negatively? And why there are “many women” who are completely fine with porn and even look at it themselves? Porn use CAN get excessive, it CAN be addictive, it CAN cause issues of intimacy, but that relies hugely on the person watching it and their partner.

              So I ask you, what do you personally have against porn usage?

            • Thank you for the critical thinking Archy. I am happy that there are parents who are figuring out ways of communicating with their kids in a way that doesn’t make the child feel attacked. Like anything porn can be very negative, it can also be positive. I sometimes watch porn with my partner to see different positions and try them. The one problem that i have personally about porn is the actual industry it self, there are a lot of people that are forced to do things that they do not want to do, but that happens everywhere, its just a bit more intimate in the porn industry.

            • I agree Anon. I actually hate quite a lot of the industry for the bad practices, hence I stick to amateur content where possible or sites where the star is their own boss type stuff.

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              Archy – This topic is sensitive and I respect your hesitation and analysis. At first glance, it appears like an attack or blame on the porn industry, which it is not. Pornography is big business; however big business does not always care about you, your partner, or your child’s well-being.

              Without deviating too far off the original intent of the article, you probably know this, but for readers who do not, women’s emotional needs work differently than men. Generally speaking, women feel loved through acts of attention and men feel loved through acts of sex.

              In a relationship, when a man focuses his attention on another woman, whether it is real or two-dimensional and is gratified by it, he is essentially taking love (attention) away from his partner and focusing his love (attention) on someone or something else.

              This is one reason, certainly not the only reason women start having comparison concerns, lower self-esteem, insecurities, feelings of unattractiveness, or jealousy. Typically it is subtle and it happens over time. Prolonged or excessive usage has caused problems.

              The male equivalent of those feelings would be akin to your wife or lover taking attention from other men. A few instances probably wouldn’t bother a man, but if she were receiving prolonged or excessive attention from another man, it will chip away at man’s self-esteem and make him jealous or insecure, and he may degrade her worth over time.

              We know two people’s behavior will affect each other and their feelings towards each other. Porn and erotica novels have a dominant niche in the marketplace; however the impact and accessibility of these things in our lives and our loved one’s lives is cause for concern.

            • Nick, mostly says:

              Without deviating too far off the original intent of the article, you probably know this, but for readers who do not, women’s emotional needs work differently than men. Generally speaking, women feel loved through acts of attention and men feel loved through acts of sex.

              This is nonsense.

              I don’t mean this as a personal critique, but rather I think the core idea expressed here is so much malarky that has been fed to us via John Gray, Inc. and Gender Stereotypes Amalgamated, LLC.

              First, men feel and women alike feel loved through words and behaviors that demonstrate caring and affection. This idea that a way to a man’s heart is through his penis (the PG variant is “through his stomach”) is a pernicious lie meant to essentialize men’s emotional needs to physical counterparts. Men and women alike should be insulted by the suggestion.

              Second, love is not a finite resource. I can love more than one person at a time. I do this with my two kids everyday. Likewise, I can have feelings of romantic love towards one person without it diminishing my love for another person. Which is somewhat irrelevant since people don’t “love” porn the same way they love a partner. Their use of pornography doesn’t take away some amount of love for their partner. That’s not to say that “time” is similarly unlimited, but here’s a question for you: if your partner only watches porn while you’re asleep, and makes sure your sexual needs are met, what is his porn viewing actually taking from you?

              Finally, while some people ignore their partner in preference for porn, that’s not an attribute or pornography, it’s an attribute of that person. Other ignore their partner for XBox, or hanging with their bros, or any number of other activities. The only difference here is that porn is “sexual” and some people have come to expect absolute sexual exclusivity from their partners. For some that extends to prohibiting any number of activities, including porn viewing (of all types), masturbation, and even glancing at attractive people as they walk down the street.

              If you’re going to analyze why women have self-esteem and insecurity issues, you need to look a little deeper at a culture that hammers it into a little girl’s head that her primary sense of worth is related to how attractive she is, and her primary purpose is to please others. We need to examine the source of the lie that “if a guy loves you, he’ll have eyes for only you” that lets so many women down. Porn is a convenient scape goat, but it’s by no means a primary cause of this cultural malignancy that ails us.

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              Nick- I mentioned below about brevity sake, I certainly didn’t intend to offend.
              Gray’s work was contested and faulty many ways about women’s needs. If couples followed his tips, most would find themselves in divorce court. He was in the process of a divorce himself as he was finishing Mars and Venus.

              Men and women’s self-esteem and emotional security issues are not all driven by societal norms, society has a major impact on our perceptions and distortions, however much of it has to do with how our esteem operates. We’re different many ways, women and men are different on esteem too. Men tend exaggerate their esteem (their performance, importance, and appearance), while women tend to downplay their esteem, but also build others up in the process. Women say common things like she’s so much prettier, smarter, better than me.

              It is important to watch a woman’s self-esteem because naturally downplays herself in comparison to others. Porn can become more important than her, children’s needs can become more important than her needs, husbands needs can become more important than her needs, etc. Over time, she can ‘feel’ so low in esteem that it can dismantle a relationship. This is not about stereotypes, it is about natural tendancies.

              Porn is personal choice, but I wouldn’t want to run the risk of my wife/lover feeling less capable in the bedroom or less pretty because she feels porn stars are prettier or better than her. Some women’s esteem is extremely high and they feel bullet-proof, but most people I speak with these days are struggling with a lack of sex and attention in their marriages and a lack of self-esteem.

            • Suzy, you’re believing too much gender stereotypes. We men don’t feel love trough sex, we feel loved trough love. You could have sex every day with a man, but if you don’t give him affection, care, and respect, he would not feel loved.

              Men are human too, not some brainless sex machine who don’t have emotion.

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              John, I’m glad you said it, for brevity sake I used it. That’s exactly what every men reports. Love is received through various means, especially respect and gestures of care from your partner, sex is large part it, affection is a large part of it, gestures of gratitude, demonstrated trust, and words of praise. There are many ways to experience high esteem, emotional security, and love from your intimate partner.

            • I think part of the problem is the couples assuming the man wants to have sex with who he sees in the porn video, that it is indicating he wants to sleep with someone else. There seems to be this view that fantasy indicates reality, eg a man watching a video of 2 lesbians but has a wife wants to cheat on his partner with those 2 women if given the chance when that may or may not be true. I’ve watched orgy videos and in fantasy land of the mind it can be hot, sexy, erotic, lustful, but in reality I doubt I’d ever do it. I like to fantasize about being a hero too, a James Bond, but in reality I wouldn’t want to be him because the love of his life get’s killed, he and the family he has would always be in jeopoardy.

              I also find certain body types in videos extremely sexy but face to face I find a wider variety of body types as sexy, it might just be what is rare for me to see but not sure. Not everything I see or want to watch in porn is what I want in reality, in porn it’s all about lust for me but that completely ignores the romantic n love feelings. Watching love n romance whilst being single depresses me so I avoid it, but lust is ok yet when I am in love I am fine with watching romance n love. The porn I watch skips straight to the sex and ignores all my feelings on wanting to do massages, the cute romantic love-building stuff, looking into each others eyes n what not so if you only look at the porn I like it’s possible to completely misunderstand what I want in a woman, it’s a narrow view into my sexuality and some of it is only sexy in fantasy.

              A woman looking at porn could make the mistake of thinking I want to have orgies, have sex with a lot of women, etc yet that is only some stuff that turns me on for PORN ALONE. The reality is I want to be in love with one woman, I MAY try a 3some once in my life but that’d probably be the limit of “kink” for me. I’d say it would be quite easy to have a woman’s insecurity be worsened by watching the porn her partner watches and viewing it through HER lens, not his, seeing what she wants to see, making judgments of what he likes from her own insecurities and that could easily just make the feelings worse.

              I get this feeling that commonly women think the man’s love is less for her if he looks at porn? Why? It’s possible to love your partner 100% and still look at other people, not everyone is a straight 100% monogamous, some people’s level of polygamous feeling extends further than that and porn may easily be enough to satisfy any of those feelings. I think there is an unfair level of pressure to assume a person should always only ever feel monogamous feeling, to only be attracted t their partner and never anyone else.

              “Without deviating too far off the original intent of the article, you probably know this, but for readers who do not, women’s emotional needs work differently than men. Generally speaking, women feel loved through acts of attention and men feel loved through acts of sex.”
              I feel loved through both, sex alone won’t make me feel loved, but simply wanted. One could argue the same would happen if the man simply masturbates, he’s taking sexual attention away from her and having it solo? One could also argue that women who don’t have enough sex with their partner are not loving them properly, considering how often I hear porn usage occurring after the women have withdrawn from sex then I do wonder if you could say these women are failing to love their men adequately. It also means that if he’s too busy at work, she’ll feel unloved, if she has a baby and doesn’t have sex for 6 months then he’s going to feel unloved as well? Sounds like an overly simplistic view of a complex relationship.

              I’d like to know if women would be as bothered by porn if they were able to not feel as threatened by it, by not viewing it as the men wanting to have sex with other women but only just wanting visual stimulation? At times I feel porn is like a vibrator, increasing the pleasure of masturbation but I don’t find there are any of the bonding experiences that I get from meeting or talking to people, let alone sex with them. It seems there are a lot of assumptions from women about what their partners want in porn, are they accurate? It’s extremely important to talk to your partner, and chances are if he says it’s no big deal in that he doesn’t feel attached to anyone in porn, he’s probably telling the truth.

              Porn is nothing like a real person, at best it’s visual stimulation (cam girl chat sites probably differ) and a huge amount of the stimulation is simply seeing sexuality itself I think. Seeing sex is sexy, the mechanics of sex is also quite sexy I find. I often see porn and think of previous sexual encounters I’ve had, I’m sure there are men who look at porn and think of himself and his partner in the scene, I know I’ve done it before.

              Porn can be quite negative, but it can also be positive. I guess it depends largely on how you view porn. Incases where the man is horny and his partner isn’t, I can’t see too many problems with porn usage. If he is ignoring her to goto porn though that is a big problem, if she is willing and wants sex then have sex with her!

            • Archy – Very well stated and balanced. Your response is what most men echo. It is difficult for us to speak for all women or men on this earth, without making some generalizations. To reinforce what she is saying, the majority of women have an issue with men looking at other women (or focusing too much attention on other things)…and it sounds like what I experienced too.

              For example, back in my 20s I was seeing this man and he looked at porn the whole time we were dating. I didn’t speak up because I was afraid to appear too insecure. I wanted him to see my strength, not my insecurities. So I just put up with it, I pretended like it didn’t bother me.

              Bear in mind, we never talked openly or constructively about sex or attention, either!!! (In my 20s, I wouldn’t have been able to communicate it anyway)

              I desperately needed his attention, but I didn’t want to seem needy and ask for more reassurance, emotional support, or help. I assumed he should know what I needed. He assumed I should know all about sex. False! We were both clueless.

              If someone were to ask me about the sex life, I would have said, ‘it’s fine, couple times a week’ but in hindsight, I suspect he would have a different response. (He initiated most of the sex, I tried to initate couple times early on, but he turned me down those times…so I rarely intiated again. I felt like the porn girls were prettier and sexier.)

              On the flip-side…If someone were to ask him are you giving her enough attention, he would have said, ‘yes, I give her lots of attention, we’re together all the time.”

              Which was completely false, he didn’t. We did everything for his career, his job, his training, his interests, his friends, TV shows, even his food choices. I was involved in his stuff, but he neglected building me and my interests.

              His attention was on his life, his future, and I think he looked at porn more often. Over 4 years, he did not take an active interest in my career, goals, or my interests, nor did he help. (When I was talking about school, he didn’t even pick up a college catalog to show he cared. How simple is that? )

              As far as romance, we got dressed up fancy only once in 4 yrs. He didn’t consider that I needed to ‘feel’ sexy, wanted, or important.

              Porn is part of it, because it’s where a man focuses his attention and sexual energy. If men are spending time and energy on porn, but not giving me attention…it will affect me. LIke Suzy mentioned, I’m not anti-porn either…I just do not want a man’s behavior to make me feel like crap and vice versa I don’t want to make him feel like crap either.

            • Yeah, in this case it sounds like porn is the tool he used, and he was the problem. Porn can be used for good n bad, but it’s down to the person themselves in how they use it. I’m sorry your partner was like that, he sounds like a real jerk.

              I am interested in my partners hobbies, etc, when I do have a partner that is. Even my friends I show interest in what they do, because it’s interesting! Your ex sounds very selfish, better off alone probably.

            • Archy- It happens to the best of us, especially when we are young. I’m not blaming him or porn, I accept 50% responsiblity too. Complacency happens when two people are not working together or communicating.

              I’m not some stodgy, puritanical woman. I like the sexiness of some porn too…when I’m seeing someone. But also, when I feel a little more in control of the sex-life and I’m confident he values me and gives me enough attention.
              This was a classic case where he was ‘withholding’ attention. I don’t think he was purposely withholding, I think we were young and we didn’t know any better.

            • Ah ok. Makes sense. People withholding anything is a big problem, makes me sad that it happens.

            • I’m afraid men feel the same when their partner’s ‘lose themselves’ in erotic fiction with a stupidly wealthy fictional steroetype — though of course I’m sure you don;t see that as a problem. Only men looking at pornography. Hypocritical.

        • I doubt if they enjoyed it that they would actually admit that to any of their friends. some things are just private.

      • And another lot find it degrading and either like them because of the degradation or hate them because of that.

    • Nick, mostly says:

      I wouldn’t be so certain your parents never watch porn. My father was an upstanding Christian pastor who worked law enforcement for his day job. He was very honest and loyal. And, as I discovered one day, he had a hidden porn stash. I doubt he looked at it with any frequency (most of it was on 8mm film which isn’t nearly as convenient as internet porn) but he had it all the same.

      • wellokaythen says:

        And, I wouldn’t be surprised if religiously strict people were actually MORE likely to have a porn stash instead of less likely. Sometimes fear, shame, and guilt makes the porn experience more intense….

      • no i’m so certain my dad never watch porn. I just know, because i’m his son and i know him very well. He doesn’t have porn stash in his room, and his laptop and his internet history are clean from any porn sites. Hes a professor, if hes addicted to something all i know he is addicted to research and books lol. But yes, men who don’t watch porn at all are exist, and i respect them

        • Suzy F. Jones says:

          John, it sounds like you have a lot of respect and good things to say about your dad and your mom. That’s great. We never talked about sex in our house either when I was growing up, but we didn’t have the internet to browse either…I’m in my 40’s now.
          I learned about sex from my first boyfriend. I’m not sure if that’s the best way for a girl to learn, but I learned a little. I learned a lot more about sex and relationships later. Lots of families have a difficult time talking about porn, sex, women’s needs, and relationships. Those are sensitive subjects for most families.

  28. Looks like he is giving his son the space and comfort needed to approach the issue as he sees fit.
    I think that because of the ‘no guilt’ situation the son will eventually be comfortable talking to his father about it then he can counsel him about the entire situation.

    Wise note.

  29. Dad’s an idiot. Viruses and scamware cannot “fry” your computer. You don’t need to replace an $1800 computer cause a virus got into it. Just wipe and reinstall.

    And yes, he should be concerned about his 13y/o kid watching porn, but not because he’ll need to replace the computer…

    • OK, did you not catch on to the fact that Dad was casting it as a computer-safety issue to avoid embarrassing the son?

  30. To the father that wrote this note, I’ve been down this road with my son when he was 14. I am a curious sort so I asked what about the porn that he liked. His response was it made his skin feel like it was burning. I asked him if he had sex dreams, he said yes and sometimes he woke up and his bed was wet. I asked him if he thought that what he dreamed about was his own personal production of porn? He thought about it and agreed that it was. I asked him if he thought his own head was deciding the kind of sex he would enjoy and he thought it did. I asked him if he thought it was appropriate to have his ideas of sex directed by anyone other than himself. He said no. I then suggested that reading erotic literature would be a good introduction to giving his head more imagery to manufacture his personalized porn. I also suggested viewing still photos of women from the 30’s to the 50’s to increase the imagery of what women really looked like. Like anything else sexuality has aesthetic qualities and before letting someone else play with your body you should play with it yourself and find out how it works. I should probably mention my son started looking at women in fashion magazines on the store rack when he was 7. The first time I noticed I walked over and looked over his shoulder to see what he was looking at. He looked up at me and said “when I grow up I want a girl just like that.” I told him to look around and show me where all these models were.
    Even at 7 years old he got it.

    • I love your response. I think the response of the dad who wrote the note totally overlooked the fact that porn would skew his sons brain and rewire it to the detriment of himself and any future woman he wants a relationship with. Don’t overlook what porn does to the psych of men and women. It’s harmful in more ways than ruining a replaceable computer.

      • Prove that it has 100% chance to rewire the brain for detriment to himself and future women. Something that can be harmful, DOESN’T MEAN IT’S ALWAYS HARMFUL.

        • Yeah, there’s a lot of porn that’s very soft-core (I know there’s lesbian porn written and directed by lesbians for lesbians so it’s tender and soft and romantic and soft music and such) and, I mean, a teenager doesn’t need hardcore stuff. For all we know, he just got the Playboy site or something.

          • You should watch that so-called very soft-core lesbian porn. It’s pretty much all the opposite of what you think of it! The only difference with mainstream porn is the fact that it’s lesbians. Not giving a f*** about men.

            • I have watched it before, it’s mostly sensual. There is a lot of touching of non-genital areas which for me does nothing, but others would love. You can find porn of pretty much anything you want if you bother looking.

          • Yes, when I was 14 years old I only look at naked pics of women on the net. The actual sex like intercourse disgusted me back then. I even couldn’t look at women vagina in porn. And back then when I was 14 years old hardcore stuff are hard to find, especially in my country in Asia (not Japan ).

            I think what is harmful from porn industry is the hardcore stuff are so mainstream. Yes you could find more soft core stuff if you look for it, but when kids opening porn sites, the stuffs on front page mostly are the hardcore stuff, because that’s are the majority of porn are. When teenagers think anal sex are normal, hard pounding is normal, ejaculating on face is normal, ugly fat guys can f*ck any hot women is normal, yes I agree thats f*cked up. Its just give the wrong impression of what sex is really like for kids and teenagers who never receive any sexual advice from their parents like me.

            I think looking on porn when you are single are not wrong ( if you are in relationship I think its wrong ) , if you know the differences between sex in porn and sex in real life. That’s why parents are so important for teaching their kids about sex. The actual evils are the people behind mainstream porn industry, for creating mostly shit movies all the time. Kids who are watching them are not wrong, that’s why its important I think for not shaming them. After they feel safe not shamed, then we could talk about women, about men, about real sex and love.

            • “ugly fat guys can f*ck any hot women is normal,”
              Not any hot women, but rich “ugly fat” guys probably do have a lot more chances to have sex with hot women.

              First porn I saw I was about 10, saw labia and thought they looked amazing. Sex didn’t gross me out, I thought it was a beautiful act and my curiosity was peaked (science minded I guess).

            • John

              Most mainstream male pornstars these days are very good looking, have perfect bodies, and ofcourse big penises. The age of ugly fat men (Ron Jeremy types) is gone.

        • Suzy F. Jones says:

          Archy- it may not re-wire the brain, but imagery does effect the male’s usage of his brain.

          Below is a copy-paste of some research.

          “One study found correlations between misogyny and how men view women. “Men who scored higher on the misogyny scale showed no activity in the part of the brain that considers another person’s intentions or thoughts. In fact, it was the area of the brain mainly responsible for tool use that showed much activity.” Other studies show when exposed to sexually violent materials over time, men can develop callous attitudes towards rape, violence against women, and aggression towards women.” [These affects were not found in female subjects]

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0MZ_2PxnGk

          • And how about porn effects on women who watch them? You talk like only men watch porn. Like Mara said, shes lesbian and she watched women on porn ( if women look at women on porn, is shes a misogynist too? ). My gf likes porn and she watches hot men in porn. How about that? She is a misandrist? How about the fact that many women are get visually turn on by porn? Oh yes, many young girls watch porn , you cannot forget that facts

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              Women find curiosity and delight in the human body and erotica too, but typically we do not find a stash of porn in 12 year old girls’ rooms. Men are the primary consumers of porn and for the most part, always have been. It is not to stereotype or judge; men are more imagery-oriented than women. Yes, I have viewed porn too, so I am not standing on a pulpit.

              Males and females have different psychological/emotional responses to porn usage and violent porn. “Females tended to empathize with the victims of rape or violence [in violent materials].” The majority of women in the studies reported that they viewed porn in order to add variety to the sex life; however that variety came at the cost of diminished self-esteem, comparison concerns, and unattractiveness.

              With that said, make your own decisions what role porn will take in your relationship. If men or women are doing things to themselves, or in a relationship that potentially could harm each other’s self-esteem, is it worth it? At the end of the day, only you can answer that question…not me or your partner.

              Since porn is accessible in our homes 24/7 and involves men, women, sex, relationships, esteem, and respect: both sexes need to take responsibility. As adults we choose WHAT we self-regulate in our lives, and WHY.

              John, there’s absolutely no judgment, but we all know porn is low-grade substitute for the real-deal. Simply because it’s easy to access doesn’t mean it adds value or connects us to our partner.

            • “but typically we do not find a stash of porn in 12 year old girls’ rooms.”

              Thats ten years ago, when we couldnt find any free porn on the internet. When we need to buy porn magazine and porn movies ( which all of them only caters to men ) in shop. But now, in the era when we can easily find free porn on the internet, many 12 year girls do watch porn. Not just straight porn, but gay and lesbian porn too.

              “Males and females have different psychological/emotional responses to porn usage and violent porn. Females tended to empathize with the victims of rape or violence [in violent materials].”

              That is because most of the violent victims in porn are women. Of course they would empatize more. I never heard women who like to watch gay porn ( yes there are many, just google them ) complained about violences towards men in gay porn.

              “The majority of women in the studies reported that they viewed porn in order to add variety to the sex life”

              My gf told me she watch porn ( mostly gay porn ) from the age of 14. Before she had any relationship nor sex life. Women viewed porn to add variety t sex life? Actually most of them do watch porn because of the exactly same reason why men do it. Because its arousing and they masturbate over it.

              Yes I do believe that majortity of porn viewers are men. But I think the reason why more men watches porn is simply because majority of porn only caters toward men. If more female oriented porn are created I bet more women would watch porn.

              We are not that different.

            • Suzy F. Jones says:

              John- I’m not here to discuss why men and women look at porn. I think we both understand why.

              The comment I posted was to discuss the effects it has on people. Porn usage has negative effects on self-esteem. Parents need to know that.

              Put this piece of info in your memory bank. In the future, if your girlfriend or future wife has self-esteem issues, comparison concerns, or feelings of unattractiveness, consider how porn usage may be negatively effecting her emotional well-being or the quality of your relationship.

            • I have to ask why are people looking at porn if they have a partner, not to judge but curiosity. I look at porn because I have no partner, it’s a fill-in to bide the time whilst searching for someone.

            • Archy–Thank You!! That’s exactly the point. Porn is a stop-gap, not something to bring into a relationship.

              As a woman, I want a man’s attention on ME, so I can gratify him. I do not want him focusing his attention on other women and being sexually gratified by it!! I feel twinges of jealousy and like I have to compete with airbrushed porn-images.

              I had a boy friend years ago who watched porn while we were seeing each other. It didn’t seem to bother him, but it bothered me, but I was afraid to tell him. I just went along with it. But we could have had a much better time in the bedroom and the relationship, had he dumped the porn.
              Don’t people want to spoil their partners with real-affection and touching?? Maybe I’m the only one.

              Sorry, it’s off topic of the article.

            • Well not saying I disagree with people looking at porn in a relationship, I just think the couple needs to work out what is ok to look at. Plenty of couples look at it together which is fine for them, but with couples where one is bothered by it then they need to discuss it and try find a way to either make it work, make their own porn maybe, or just don’t have porn.

              “I feel twinges of jealousy and like I have to compete with airbrushed porn-images.”
              I can understand the feeling, I’d suggest talking it over with a partner who does it. What I can say is porn has never ever even remotely came close to any feelings I’ve had for someone I love. I don’t think most porn users really think of it as seriously as you may do, as in don’t feel any sense of attachment or major focus except a few minutes to get off.

              For me personally I don’t mind if my partner looks at porn, I’d probably stimulate her whilst she did letting the porn act like a visual vibrator so to speak. If my partner didn’t like porn I’d maybe try find a way to relax her fears n concerns but I probably wouldn’t look at it, I’d be too busy looking at her.

            • Nick, mostly says:

              Don’t people want to spoil their partners with real-affection and touching?? Maybe I’m the only one.

              You’re not the only one, but you’re not universal either. Different people have different levels of desire, and sometimes the mismatch can be quite large indeed. If you’re a woman who likes sexual touch daily, and your partner prefers to go without for weeks at a time, you might change your opinion a bit (particularly once you’re entangled with kids and mortgages and the like).

              It’s also interesting to think of where we get our attitudes towards porn. While yours is a common one, there are women who enjoy porn as well, both solo and with a partner. I think we’d all be better off if we realized that our preferences are ours alone, and didn’t shame others for their preferences. It’s sufficient for you to say, “porn bothers me, and I want a partner who doesn’t use it because it bothers me.” Where we often step over the line is where we start to view others who don’t share our opinions as deficient, particularly when we haven’t examined where our own attitudes come from.

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  1. [...] on The Good Men Project, Cooper Fleishman agreed that the letter is “enlightened” but wonders if dad had a [...]

  2. [...] Finds Porn on Son’s Computer, Leaves Compassionate Note goodmenproject.com/good-feed-blog… via [...]

  3. [...] Dad Finds Porn on Son’s Computer, Leaves Compassionate Note — The Good Men Project September 26, 2012 Leave a reply [...]

  4. […] One dad left his son a compassionate, non-judgmental note. As reported by The Good Men Project, the dad wrote his son a note, explaining that the son’s visits to pornographic sites were probably what caused malware to mess up his computer. The note explained that porn sites are notorious for malware — and directed the son toward some more reliable, not-malware-infested porn sites. […]

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