Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?
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As I surveyed real friends, Facebook friends, Twitter friends, and total strangers about having sex on the first date, the unfortunate cow comparison came up no fewer than five times in my first twelve interviews. Everybody complained about it, bemoaning the lack of nuance, the icky imagery, and the overt transactional implications. And yet, it kept rearing it’s ugly little antiquated head. Are there kernels of truth buried there? Is first-date sex a relationship nonstarter? Are we, as we often claim to be, past the era of plastering A’s on each other’s chests?
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“There’s a lot of pressure on women to control the pace of the relationship,” said 24-year-old Jess, “and not ‘give away the milk for free.’” Ugh, there it is again. “But let’s face it,” she added, “we have hormones and sex drives us, just like males out there. Our generation is in conflict with this idea of restraining from sex to keep a guy interested. It seems to encourage us to find ‘randos’ at a bar to satisfy our urges, so we can be prim and proper in front of the men we actually want to be having sex with.”
It sounds preposterous, but it does make a certain sort of convoluted sense. In front of people whose opinions matter, like potential “relationship material,” we don’t want to seem promiscuous. Imagine you went on 10 first dates, and nine ended with chaste goodbyes. But on the 10th, things click into place, the mood is good, the vibe is there, and you really, really want to get it on. You hesitate, because this person across the table doesn’t know that the last nine got pecks on the cheek or ass-out hugs. He or she thinks that the freaky-deaky version of yourself you just unleashed is your usual M.O. Now you’re that girl, or that guy, the one who puts out “too soon.”
And that’s where the expectation game becomes a big soupy mess of missed signals, false assumptions, and dashed hopes. Rachel is 36, “I’ve definitely gotten into a couple of accidental relationships when someone followed up on what I thought of as a hookup.” Laura, in her forties, added, “The only thing first-date sex triggers is anxiety. If I’m not interested in next steps, I wonder how to extricate myself if he wants to see me again. If I’m hoping for a relationship, I worry that I’ve given the wrong impression, and he’ll think I’m a slut.” How many first-date, post-coital conversations begin with, “I swear, I never do that.”
“The only thing first-date sex triggers is anxiety. If I’m not interested in next steps, I wonder how to extricate myself if he wants to see me again. If I’m hoping for a relationship, I worry that I’ve given the wrong impression, and he’ll think I’m a slut.”
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But of course, for a whole host of reasons, sometimes we do. Harry, a married forty-something, calls sex “part and parcel of the decision making process about whether this person is a keeper or not. Do we have chemistry together? How do our bodies connect?” In fact, he slept with his wife on the very first date, “I think it’s a myth that getting naked too soon means trouble.” For some people, testing sexual compatibility early makes perfect sense. They want to know if there’s that initial physical spark before investing time into the growth and evolution of the relationship.
The reasons not to have sex right away are many and eminently practical. The less time you’ve spent with someone, the less likely you are to know his or her sexual history. Maybe you haven’t yet had (very necessary) discussions about STIs and protection. Medical risks aside, new partners should mean new conversations about boundaries and preferences, conversations most people aren’t comfortable having right off the bat. Leanne is a twenty-something New Yorker in a relationship. “Before I sleep with someone, I want to make sure I trust them to treat me respectfully, and that I trust myself to be assertive enough to make clear what I do and do not want.” Articulating desire is hard enough with people you know well, throw in the pressure-heavy mind games of first dates, and it seems damn near impossible.
Even if the stars align in your favor, and you and your date are both down for a good time, you might hold off. You might not want to risk whatever nugget of potential you two have by jumping into the sack. You might decide, like 22-year-old Cara, that waiting would serve you both well. “I might delay it to develop the initial bond further…. When we have sex, it can be an activity to truly add strength and another dimension to our already complex connection.” Or, no matter how badly you want to go for it, the mere possibility of a “slut” label, spoken or unsaid, just isn’t worth it.
And even those of us who do, from time to time, put out on a first date know that locker room one-upmanship and girl talk over brunch aren’t figments of our imagination. People do gossip, and they do judge. The question is, do we care?
Tom, 40, was shocked when he heard how horribly men speak of women they just hooked up with. Though perhaps times are changing; according to Colin, 24, “Out of the majority of my friends, frat brothers included, there’s very little slut-shaming. If she’s down, then odds are I’m down too.”
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This survey was full of surprises. I posted the link on Facebook with the headline “First Date Sex?” and the first comment I got was from my 30-year-old married cousin, with whom I agree on just about every political and social front. Her comment? “Ew…just…ew.” I was shocked; her blanket statement was so far from my own heavily-caveated, wishy-washy, “if”-dominated multi-paragraph treatise on personal decision-making. How did we two, of such similar minds, arrive at such different answers?
My point is this: playing the assumption game regarding first-date sex will get you nowhere. To some, it is a clear indication that the only place this thing is going is to bed, so you might as well take it there. It means, “there’s no future here, but I’m into it, you’re into it, so let’s have some fun.” To others, it’s a sign that you want something more, a nonverbal way of saying “I really, really like you.” Harry called it a “diagnostic tool” in weighing potential. Amelia, 23, left my favorite comment of all, “It’s always a risk letting someone be that intimate with you for the first time, so I feel like it almost doesn’t even matter if it happens on our first date or the tenth.” She’s right, it is a risk, but it’s one we each have to weigh for ourselves. At the bare minimum, you can’t think ill of your date if he or she slept with you right away; after all, you did the very same thing.
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Thanks for this post, Emily! I think your article raises a lot of important points. I don’t think there is a ‘one size fits all’ answer to this question. If you think your date is responsible or mature enough to handle first date sex, I say go for it! Some people can handle it well and some people become uncomfortable about it afterwards. I don’t think having sex on the first date will necessarily ruin the possibility of a relationship down the line, I do think you should find out what your date’s intentions are. If your date is looking… Read more »
One sentence leaped out at me, because it’s so something:
“The only thing first-date sex triggers is anxiety.” Okay. My love and I met, in a bar, he took me to his home, and we got it going. First date, more like first look sex. It was also love at first sight, and I kind of think that the ring on my finger from my husband shows that we were right for each other, why wait.
Ok, so we all have to decide for ourselves. How do we go about making an informed decision? Are there any research studies on emotional and physiological benefits/consequences? Are there any “sages” err can go to for wisdom (rather than just let the blind lead the blind)? And how about long term effects? How does current behavior assist/hinder my ability to fully engage on all levels (physical, emotional, intellectual, spiritual) when I finally meet “the one”?
This was a fantastic read, so thank you for posting it! I understand that some people would be concerned with having sex on the first date, and how that might affect the other person’s impression of them. I’ve definitely encountered the “I promise I never do this type of thing” statement. And you know, there probably IS some partial grounding in reality. There probably have been experiences where two people were very attracted to each other, had sex on the first date, and things didn’t really progress beyond that. And from that experience, it’s easy to conclude “sex on the… Read more »
I am going to say something that might make me sound seriously creepy. I don’t entirely trust me. I have complex and mixed motives. I do stupid stuff. I make mistakes. I say one thing and do something else. I try and treat people one way and I end up treating them a different way. In other words I’m pretty messed up, but I also think I’m pretty normal. Now I know me fairly well, and I know that stuff about me. If I meet someone for the first time and they decide I’m safe enough to have sex with,… Read more »
Oddly I am not even sure I would date someone tell we had sex first.
This was an interesting read. I’ve never given it much thought. I’ve had sex on the first date twice and they both turned into long-term relationships. If it works for you, by all means. I’m not one to judge whether you do or don’t.
Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?
Why buy the whole pig when all you want is some sausage?
If someone wanted to have sex on the first date, great. If no sex for a while that was fine too. I never passed judgement either way
Well, I wish I had done it. Sexual compatibility does matter and it should be verified before going too far, emotionally speaking. Trust me. So, if the guy thinks you’re a hookup, it’s his problem not yours, so move on to the next guy, the one who’s a sexual match for you. You don’t want to be stuck with someone who does not match you in that area… I would rather be considered a slut, being called that does not make me one (he would be one too, right?), that having to go through what I did again. So, I… Read more »
I completely agree. Sex is not the only important in a relationship, but it is one of many important facets of being with someone. I have had first-date sex, and I have waited quite some time, and have dated men in both categories. In both situations, time & shared experience dictated whether or not we were made for each other and for how long (one night vs. months/years vs a lifetime). I’m not married yet, but I know I need someone who enjoys sex as much as I do, and is compatible with me in their love making style. For… Read more »
“At the bare minimum, you can’t think ill of your date if he or she slept with you right away; after all, you did the very same thing.”
Thank YOU! The number of time I’ve heard “she/you slept with him too quickly” as a reason for a relationship failure is ridiculous. It’s that double standard – I might have slept with you too quickly but what, I did it all by myself and you had no say in the matter?
I think this is one of those things that is basically a bad idea. You don’t know the person well enough to trust them the way you need to before having sex. That should apply to guys, too – you don’t want to end up getting an STD or making a baby, etc. As for finding out if you’re sexually compatible, it’s not like dating a few times is going to use up all the time you have left in life. Anyhow, you can probably tell if there’s chemistry just by how you feel, but a kiss would work without… Read more »
What a refreshing article! I say do whatever works for you, as long as you can look yourself in the mirror the next day and own it.
Thnks, for everyone and i am use this information as single men for find a sex partner and this different type of topic is very helping me ….
The chase can be so fun. I’ve generally held longer relationships with guys when we waited because the anticipation becomes so intense. It’s easier to get bored earlier or caught up in just the hook-ups when sex happens immediately. That being said, it’s not a dealbreaker either. My current long term, live in partner and I had drunken sex very early, before we even dated, and things are still hot after years. (No, being drunk does not take away consent, there’s a difference between being passed out and raped and having a healthy, or even sloppy, buzz and sexing it… Read more »
Fastest way to find out if HE is looking to play or looking for an actual relationship: HOLD OFF ON SEX. Period. If the man is willing to be PATIENT in that department, then has run the race and is now looking for something a bit deeper than a hot night of sexual healing. Women truly control the whole process. Men are built to breed every 10 min, women 2 to 3 times a month. Biologically speaking, women have more patience in that department, since they are built differently. However, if that pleasant garden is given up too quickly for… Read more »
Thanks for chiming in, Christian. I’d hesitate to lump men OR women into homogeneous groups regarding how often they are “built to breed.” I think the range in sexual desire among women is huge, as is the range among men. In fact, the differences between individuals are probably great enough to make any sort of “men want this,” “women want this” dichotomy useless.
Agreed. But we can’t deny the chemical differences in oxytocin, testosterone, and estrogen, and how they intrinsically alter how each gender perceives and interprets sex. It is why I tell the women I work with to be very careful with whom they invite into their beds. They might think they can handle the casual sex with a guy they fancy, but once that oxytocin starts flowing in their system, it will tell their bodies to latch on to that mate, regardless if he is a complete moron or player. Some women can regulate the biochemical reaction, certainly in the 21st… Read more »
I used to have one-night-stands – I won’t call them first dates because they weren’t really dates. It was a VERY long time ago and that section of my life lasted for about a year until I got very bored with the same-old same-old of new bedmates. I was a student and at the time it was fairly normal behavior back in those days. Only very narrow-minded types thought badly of me as far as I was aware. When I met my husband a number of years later – we slept together on the first day of our relationship –… Read more »
Two words: garbage science.
The idea that women are more biologically inclined to form monogamous attachments through sex has no evidentiary basis. Period. No serious evolutionary psychologists argue that women in prehistory were not promiscuous, up to and including sexual encounters with strangers (a behavior found in most foraging societies and in our nearest primate ancestors).
Citing biology to support social norms is fairly typical among people who are looking for reasons to believe the narratives they’ve been fed. It’s a huge impediment to progress in understanding gender. Please don’t be part of the problem.
cant agree more. Speaking of women, but it applyes also to men. Women who are monogamous is mostly because their culture and education have implanted them the idea that multiple partners is bad. Women who are free sexually, have a good time.
So basically its not a harware issue, but a software. A obsolete software who needs a update 😉
interesting topic, cant even follow the conversation because half the comments are hidden….
are people really this weak minded nowadays that they allow the opinions of others to determine what is or is not offensive to them????????? pathetic
From what I can see, these comments took some crazy tangents. All I know is, I’m getting ready to head out the door with the guy I slept with prior to even a first date.. 2 years after the fact, we’re going to the bridal shower our friends are giving us. Whether it can or can’t work is totally subjective. A person who accuses their sexual partner of sluttiness after contributing to it isn’t someone to be in a relationship with.
Men go to bridal showers now? Yikes! 🙂
“A person who accuses their sexual partner of sluttiness after contributing to it isn’t someone to be in a relationship with.”
Great point. It’s like sitting in your car alone in a traffic jam complaining about the traffic. You’re part of the problem!
I understand a woman’s wants to move slow. BUT!!! When I was 19 I really liked this one girl who I knew was finishing up college and coming back in a year or so. Every time she came back from college, which was pretty far, we would meet up and talk and make out. We made out a dozen of times, and because she said she didn’t want to be serious because she lived too far, I waited for her. I waited a year. When she finally moved back, she said that she didn’t see me as boyfriend material and… Read more »
Long distance relationships are usually a mistake. However, it sounds like you are upset because she didn’t want casual sex (and it does sound like a casual relationship), not that she ultimately didn’t want a relationship. It doesn’t sound like she led you on, as she told you she didn’t want to be serious.
“uneducated men in dead-end jobs”
wow,there are a TON of educated guys in dead-end jobs,and its not for lack of motivation and
poor work ethic.For some perhapsbut thats a ridiculous statement and further proves that alot
of women are completely out of touch with the economy.lack of job opportunity and competitive
nature of alot of jobs.Alot of people bust their asses in their field and never get ahead-smdh.
oh and by all means do not settle for us unwashed chumps with dead-enders….screw us and the
horse we rode on.
You are misreading what I wrote. My father, the one with the master’s degree in engineering and the successful career, is actually unemployed right now due to layoffs. Our family is currently solely supported by my mother. This is the second time this has happened in our family (the first was in the dot-com bust of the early 2000s). I know full well how the economy works. I wouldn’t indict my own father! Obviously, when I talk about men in dead-end jobs, I’m not talking about my father or other educated, hardworking, and ambitious men who got hit by the… Read more »
S. I think that you are being unnecessarily unkind to Rod and young men in general. In todays world men are discriminated against and women on average are coming out on top. Because women practice hypergamy the group of men that are “losers” as you call them, is growing while the group of women that see them as unacceptable partners because of their relative lower social status is also growing. As relationships and sex are basic human needs its pretty understandable that members of this disenfranchised group are being vocal about their situation. Were you sexually marginalised, I’m pretty sure… Read more »
And by the way, here’s a message for your jerk commenters. Growing up, my parents NEVER taught me that my value was related to my sexuality. My value was ALWAYS correlated to my behavior, my education, and my success in life. I didn’t hear the “cow…milk” saying until my late teens, and I remember telling my mom about how sad it was that some people thought women’s only value was in their virginity. As a direct result of my upbringing, I have made it to age 21 with an Ivy League degree, a high-status job that pays close to six… Read more »
you don’t depend on men to support you from a monetary standpoint ? Does that mean you would date men who have less income then yourself? That flies in the face of feminism,their whole battle cry is ‘don’t settle,were special because were women”….so zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz! WOMEN DO NOT MARRY/DATE DOWN PERIOD.@ ive heard this from women’s mouths myself.Women f–k up just as much as men do but you don’t own YOUR f-ups.
My boyfriend makes a little less than I do. My mother makes far more than my father and they have been happily married for 25 years. The reason it works is that both my boyfriend and my father have advanced degrees, intellectual personalities, and high career ambitions. Just because my mother and I wouldn’t settle for uneducated men in dead-end jobs doesn’t mean we chase neurosurgeons or millionaires. There are a lot of good, hardworking men in between there.
Rod 22% of married couples have a female breadwinner but When it comes to controlling money, there are some disturbing statistics about who controls the money in a marriage. “A recent PEW study of 30-to-44-year-olds showed that when a husband is the primary or sole breadwinner, household spending decisions are divided roughly equally. He makes about a third of them, she makes a third, and they make a third jointly. But, in the 22% of households studied in which the wife earned more, she made more than twice as many decisions as her husband about where the money would go.… Read more »
You don’t know what you are talking about. I’m an attorney and I make more money than my boyfriend. I personally know several women who have high pay professional jobs while their husbands are stay at home dads, are in school or working part time.
Hi Jill
I was quoting an article from time mag. not giving my personal opinion.
The saying “no one buys the cow if you give the milk away for free” has always deeply disturbed me. It implies that the most valuable thing about a woman is sex, and that is what men are after. It implies that, once a woman “gives away” sex, there is nothing worthy left in her for a man to want to pursue. And it implies that women want men to buy them, and that women have to withhold sex from men in order to convince men to want them. That is just incredibly pathetic. That said, there are plenty of… Read more »
Sounds like alot of the female posters here
are prime candidates for some good ol’ valtrex action !
Keep on screwin’ on the first date and you’ll eventually get
that souvenir for life you always wanted and spare us the protetion tripe.
Learn some restraint and not to be so impulsive and brazzen with sex.
Emily and Erin How would you view a man who hid behavior, sexual or otherwise – from you that would otherwise cause you to chose not to sleep with him, or pretended that he was something that hes not in order to coerce him you into sleeping with you? If you would have a problem with that happening to you I suggest that you don’t do it others. and I submit that modern feminists are not ready yet to competently discuss the double standard in question for a number of reasons including Effective gender dialogue cannot be gynocentric The tendency… Read more »
What’s a “biological double standard” and how is that different from a non-biological double standard?
Mommys baby Daddys maybe is the biological double standard, women don’t have to worry about cuckoldry.
h tt p://cognitivebackflips.blogspot.com/2011/08/daddys-thinking.html
Women don’t have to worry about … “HALF of all women would lie to their husbands or partners to keep their relationship going if they became pregnant by another man, a survey said today. Figures showed one woman in two would not tell her man that the baby she was carrying was not his – if she wanted to stay with him. * The survey questioned 5,000 women, average age 38, across England, Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland. and Emily and Erin have said they have no qualms about lying to men in order to sleep with them. So it… Read more »
Hi Trevor,
I think the cuckolding question is one for its own post… clearly there’s a lot to discuss. I have not, at any point, said that I have no qualms about lying in order to sleep with men. Please refrain form inaccurate accusations and stick to commenting on the subject at hand.
Rosie
Fear of cuckoldry is whats behind the double standard and you did say ““It seems to encourage us to find ‘randos’ at a bar to satisfy our urges, so we can be prim and proper in front of the men we actually want to be having sex with.”
That’s what the men that women call players do,
Sorry forgot the source for the survey,
htt p://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/139/139613_women_lie_cheat_and_steal.html?ref=emtaf&archive=archive
and you only have to look at recent articles here and on Hugos blog that many women could give a toss about men and children that are victims of paternity fraud.
Again, please show me exactly where I said I had no qualms about lying. Hugo speaks for himself, as do I.
“It seems to encourage us to find ‘randos’ at a bar to satisfy our urges, so we can be prim and proper in front of the men we actually want to be having sex with.”
Actually, that’s a quote from someone else, one of the many surveys and interviews conducted for this piece. I believe i stated that very clearly. You wrote, “and Emily and Erin have said they have no qualms about lying to men in order to sleep with them” which implies that I, personally, have no qualms about this. I’d also like to add that taking home a random person from a bar, whatever you think of that, isn’t “lying.”
Ok, I apologize for that.
Talking a random person home isn’t lying, I didnt say it was. If a woman is pretending that she is something she is not in order to sleep with men who are looking specifically for something else as per the quote, they are being dishonest.
Thanks for the apology.
I would say there are different kinds of “first dates.” If you’ve known a person for five years, decide to go out, and have sex on the first date, that’s one thing. If you have a blind date with a total stranger and have sex with the person after an hour of conversation, that’s a totally different first date. The conventional wisdom (right or wrong) seems to be that a long-term relationship needs to be based on more than sexual chemistry, and that having sex “too early” makes the relationship much more based on sex and less based on anything… Read more »
“It seems to encourage us to find ‘randos’ at a bar to satisfy our urges, so we can be prim and proper in front of the men we actually want to be having sex with.”
Don’t some women also put men in that position and have a very poor opinion of men that do that?
I think we just uncovered another double standard.