Hi Doc,
This isn’t exactly about dating, but it’s about relationships nonetheless.
So, back in 2016, I met this man, we’ll call him Thomas, on a dating app. We went out on a couple dates before we mutually decided that we’d be better off as friends. I’d say we weren’t so much friends as casual acquaintances. And then, towards the later part of the decade, we lost touch for a few years. Fast forward to spring of 2022, he invites me over to his place to watch a show that him, his boyfriend and I all enjoy. After that, the three of us became virtually inseparable. I would hang out with them upwards of three times a week. I even helped him move into his house that July.
Fast forward (again) to September of last year, I meet this new couple, their names are Chris and Elliott. Over the past 5 months, I’ve grown very close with Chris and Elliott. They make me feel loved and supported in a way that I never have. They’ve given me a key to their apartment. They’ve become my chosen family. They also live in the same town as me, which makes hanging out with them easy and convenient.
In about October, Thomas made a very inappropriate comment about one of Chris’ best friends that I felt was super uncalled for. But, you know, none of us are allowed to be mad at him for it (Thomas has a very fragile ego.) Mind you, he had not yet met either Chris, Elliott or said friend of Chris’. Thomas still has not met them and, after that, mostly likely will not be meeting them as Chris and Elliott have expressed no interest.
After all this, Thomas and I lost touch for a couple months (during which I kept hanging out with Chris and Elliott), and when I saw him a couple weeks ago for the first time since before the holidays, he told me that he feels like he’s being replaced. However, I’m also starting to feel that I might simply be outgrowing him. Plus, I love him but there’s a few things about him that makes it a little exhausting to be around him. For example, he doesn’t let people enjoy things, he complains about EVERYTHING, he’s always gotta be right and overall, he’s kind of a downer of a person. And to top it all off, he’s making me feel as if the fact that we lost contact for those couple months is my fault. Meanwhile, he doesn’t reach out to me to make plans. With the exception of Chris and Elliott, that’s how it is with all my friends; if I don’t reach out, I’ll never hear from them, and that’s exhausting.
I’d love to hear your two cents on all this.
Sincerely,
Don’t Make Me Choose
OK, before I get into the dynamic of you and your rotating cast of characters, I want to address the “reach out first” thing because this is something that a lot of people struggle with and you just provided me with an opening.
This is an area where a modified version Hanlon’s Razor is relevant: don’t assume malice (or disinterest) when ignorance would also explain things. When someone is in the position of always being the one to initiate contact, that doesn’t necessarily mean that their friends and acquaintances don’t care as much.
It’s often as likely that this is the dynamic that grew up in the relationship – one person tends to be the initiator, facilitator or organizer of plans. That doesn’t mean they’re necessarily the best or most suited for the role so much as they’re the one who did it first or most often. Many times, the rest of the circle aren’t thinking about this dynamic. It’s just… how things happened. They themselves may be in a similar role in the parts of their social circle that don’t necessarily overlap with the others’.
It’s also entirely possible that people are so head-down in their own various responsibilities, dramas and messes that they don’t have time to stop to think that they’re not the one who reaches out… or they might want to reach out but are afraid to do so because they worry that they’re going to annoy or bother others.
(That sound you hear just now are hundreds of people yelling “OH GOD ITS ME” at once.)
Because the others may not realize that this is the dynamic they’ve fallen into and/or they’re one of the classic “I would, but what if…” types, they may not realize that the person who does all the reaching out, all the planning and all the inviting feels unwanted and would probably have the Forehead Smack of Dawning Realization if it were pointed out to them.
This is why it can be good to say “Hey, sometimes it feels like I’m the one who always reaches out first; I’d love it if you (individual or plural) might reach out to me, too.” After all, if they don’t know that you feel this way, they can’t do anything about it. Hoping that others will read your mind (or assuming that “if they were really your friend, you wouldn’t have to say anything”) ultimately just means that nothing is going to change. So speak up about it – clearly and directly. It may take a time or two before folks change their patterns of behavior; that’s more of a matter of breaking the inertia, not a lack of caring.
But with that out of the way, let’s talk Thomas. Thomas seems like A Lot. Not that he’s necessarily a bad person, but he’s A Lot of person and that can be hard to take in large doses. This can be especially true if he’s the sort of person who doesn’t realize he’s often the source of a lot of his own struggles. For example: you don’t mention why he felt it was appropriate to make a disparaging comment about someone he apparently doesn’t know and never met. It may have been because of his jealousy of your burgeoning relationship with Chris and Elliot. But it was still uncalled for, and his retreating back to being an UWU Smol Bean when called out on it makes it that much harder to address the problem.
While it’s understandable that he might feel jealous of your relationship with Chris and Elliot – a relationship he used to have with you – the fact that he makes it your problem is… well, the problem. The same applies to his not reaching out and with generally being a bum hang; it makes it harder to want to include him. If he can’t take a “dude, what the hell” or a “could you maybe just not?”, then it makes everyone that much less inclined to spend time with him – especially when the other option is hanging out with folks who don’t act like that.
This is why, yes, it’s fair to say that maybe you have outgrown him – or at least this current iteration of your relationship with him.
Not every relationship – romantic or platonic – is meant to be forever. Relationships are made out of individuals who’ve come together and are growing together. But sometimes those individual components separate over time. Sometimes the people who were right for you at one stage of your life aren’t right for you once you’ve grown past it, and you grow apart. That doesn’t mean that anyone necessarily did anything wrong, nor does that mean that the separation is forever. Sometimes you grow apart, then come back together again. Sometimes the cycle repeats: you grow apart, then come back together, then grow apart again.
Now, it may well be that he’s the sort of friend who’s best handled in small doses; you see him every few months (or years) because over time he eventually builds back up to being insufferable or you just naturally drift apart. That may just be the dynamic of your relationship, and when circumstances are right, you’ll be friends again… if that’s something you’re open to.
But if it really is reaching the point that you just can’t stand the idea of putting up with his shit again, it may be worth telling him “hey, I think we’ve been growing apart,” and calling it. You don’t need to give him a laundry list of why, and if he asks specifically, you can give him the gently edited version. But at the end of the day, anyone can leave any relationship for any reason, without needing to justify it to the other person or people. If you’re feeling like this relationship no longer fits or fulfills your needs or the cost of being in it with him is too much, you’re well within your rights to go your separate ways.
Good luck.
***
Hello Doc,
I am a 23-year-old male (by the time you read this though, I might be 24) who will be graduating from undergrad May 2024. I’m writing to you because my “college experience” has been less than stellar and I don’t know how to move on and what I should do as I leave my early 20s and enter my mid-20s.
First of all, this past fall semester, as a second-year senior, I ended up joining a fraternity of all things. Yes, I know…it’s bizarre that I joined something that most guys would do their freshmen or Sophomore year of college but anyways, I did so because joining a fraternity is something I wanted to do earlier in my college career but lost it due to the COVID pandemic occurring my Freshmen and sophomore years. Of course, a main (but not only reason) I joined was because I wanted to be able to attend parties and meet other girls. And this is where it gets bad…
At the most recent party I went to, one of my fraternity brothers asked to meet with me privately. He told me that there were anonymous reports that some female party guests felt uncomfortable around me at other parties and that I had apparently been too persistent in talking to girls who had made it clear that they were not interested in me or told me they had boyfriends. The conversation we had was amicable and he didn’t accuse me of anything, and he told me he just wanted to make sure I was aware of my actions, but later that night after I got back to my apartment, I immediately broke down and started crying. I had no intention whatsoever of making any women feel scared or pressured by me and had made me start to assume that I might be neurodivergent to some degree if I was that blind to making women feel uncomfortable at parties.
The other reason why I broke down is because a similar incident happened way back in 8th grade. I realized my mistake and believed that I would never do that again but it’s now clear that I haven’t learned proper social cues. Not learning proper social cues is also probably why I am a virgin at 23 (almost 24) and have never even kissed a girl and didn’t date at all throughout high school (although I managed to go on one date in my life as a junior in college).
I remember believing when I was graduating high school that college was where people who couldn’t find luck in high school with dating would succeed. That just did not happen for me at all. I almost failed my freshmen year and then covid happened and I lost my sophomore year. I was only able to talk to one girl my junior year and she rejected me. My first senior year, I still couldn’t seem to just be able to meet girls who were interested in me and single.
At this point, I just feel numb and lost. I’m soon to be 24 because there aren’t many girls at my school who I would even feel comfortable dating now since the age gap between me and some girls is now six years and I couldn’t imagine having a girl who is only 18 or 19 as my first girlfriend. Also, I feel seriously behind many of my fellow students even though I am a good two to three years older than a lot of them! They have experience with drugs, sex, relationships, and alcohol that I have only just begun to experience in that past year or so (drinking and nicotine, I haven’t had anything harder than those, not even cannabis yet). It almost feels like now as a senior, about to graduate, I’m going through the process that most students go through as freshmen or sophomores at the latest. This isn’t good since I can’t afford to screw around this close to graduation and I don’t want to turn into that 30-year-old guy who still hangs around the fraternity house in an attempt to feel young.
What should I do?
Too Little Too Late
First off: dude, stop apologizing for things that you don’t need to apologize for and making unwarranted assumptions and comparisons about everyone else. I realize you’re trying to get out in front of someone making comments that you expect to hear but… that’s actually part of the problem you’re having. You’re in this preemptive defensive crouch, and that’s making it a lot harder for you to actually engage with people or take on what they’re actually saying or doing.
Let’s take take joining a frat as a senior as a starting point. Is it weird to join a frat when you’re almost out of college? Enh, it’s not how most people seem to go about it, but I highly doubt you’re the only person who has. But more to the point: if this wasn’t the done thing, then you wouldn’t be in the frat in the first place. It’s not like fraternities are notorious for taking on charity cases or bringing people on to be… I dunno, the Greek system equivalent of a carnival geek in the sideshow. Fraternities tend to be choosy about who they let in and they’re sticklers for tradition. If your frat bros are cool, then when you got there is less important than the fact that you are there, now.
Plus, fraternities and sororities offer a number of benefits and opportunities to their members (networking and an instant social circle, especially), so it’s not like there aren’t reasons why you might want to be part of one, even if you got there later than others. And then there’s the fact that your first couple of years in college were interrupted by COVID. Seeing as the world went through 2020 together, I think most folks understand that the last few years have a great big asterisk over them about how much the pandemic fucked everything up and we’re not even vaguely done with all the disruptions. If someone were to look at you askance for joining later than the average, all you really need to do is shrug and say “COVID” and most folks will nod, knowingly.
But that defensive crouch is getting in the way of other areas, too. Let’s take your frat brother pulling you aside and saying “hey, just so you know, this is something you should be aware of.” From the way you’ve related this story, it sounds like he was trying to be a friend and do you a solid: he’s trying to be non-judgmental and understanding while saying “here are some things that you’ve been doing. Everyone knows it’s unintentional, so nobody’s mad, they just would like you to be aware of it so you stop doing it.”
It’s understandable that this is upsetting to hear; nobody likes finding out that they made people uncomfortable. But part of the point of someone taking you aside like that is so that you can learn from it and not make those mistakes again.
This is where that defensive crouch becomes a problem. You don’t mention whether he gave you specifics (“You did X, which is why someone felt Y”) or not. If he didn’t give you specifics, it might be good to ask, so you can make sure you don’t repeat them. It might also be (or have been) worth asking him if they would be ok with your apologizing to them directly, or if it would be better for him to convey those apologies.
Assuming that he did, then this is the time to actually take that information onboard instead of just falling into a ball of “OH GOD I’M THE WORST PERSON EVER”.
(Please notice I said just falling into a ball. Nobody expects you to be a robot or to be able to take upsetting information without batting an eyelash and pivot on a dime. But doing better means taking those corrective measures in, not just flagellating yourself in penance and avoiding people forever.)
Most people can recognize genuine mistakes and tend to be pretty forgiving of them. But part of taking responsibility for making mistakes is to be mindful of what those mistakes were, be mindful of why and how you made them and to avoid making them again. The vast majority of people would rather see a good faith effort to learn from those mistakes than just for you to exile yourself from all company ever.
There’s also the fact that you’re assuming that everyone’s growing, maturing and having experiences at the same rate and that you’ve somehow fallen behind because… well, because. And that’s not true. There is no Universal Growing Experience, no Unified Theory of Social Progression or any other pan-humanity yardstick of growth and maturity. Right now it feels that way because you’re in college; you’re surrounded by people who are more or less in the same place you are in life. But this is just the illusion of uniformity; even within your fellow classmates, there’s a wide diversity of experiences, growth and maturity. I promise you that there are many people who’ve had wildly different experiences growing up and going through college than the people around them.
I promise you: there are students at your college who’ve been working since they were sixteen and people who’ve never had a paying job in their lives. There’re ones who started smoking at an absurdly young age and others who never have and never will. Some may drink like alcoholic fish, some may not drink at all, some may be wine or beer snobs and some may not give a fuck as long as it kills brain cells. There’re folks who’ve fucked around, folks who’ve had exactly one partner and folks whose only partner has been Mr., Ms. or Mx. Rosie Palms.
And as you grow older and go out in the world, there will be an even wider diversity of experiences and maturity levels out there. You’ll meet people who are younger than you who will seem to have done far more than you ever have, and people who are older than you who will look at you and think the exact same thing. That doesn’t mean you’re more advanced or less advanced than any of them; it just means that your experience is your experience, just as theirs was their experience. There is no yardstick that you’re being measured by, nor are you expected to be “caught up” by a certain age. You don’t need to be dating someone much younger than you because you hadn’t had a romantic or sexual relationship; you’re not expected to be at exact parity with the people you date, no matter what red-pill shitheads and the RETVRN/TradLife fuckbrains try to sell you. What you want are partners who are excited to be with you, specifically. As I keep saying: people aren’t dating your resume or “body count” (I hate that term), they’re dating the holistic person. If someone is going to give you shit because you haven’t dated as many people as them… congratulations, you met an asshole. That is the definition of a “them” problem, not a “you” problem.
I mean, ask yourself: why would you want to date someone who is that dismissive, that short-sighted and that judgmental? What about that sort of attitude is attractive to you? Would having a relationship with someone who thinks that way make you happy?
You really need to calm down, unclench and get those knee-jerk reactions under control. It may well be worth your time to take advantage of the resources available to you as a college student and go see about talking to a counselor at health services. Talking to someone who can help walk you through these issues and anxieties will do you a world of good. The sooner you can stop anticipating the next blow – a blow that may never come – and start working towards self-acceptance, the sooner you’ll start feeling better about yourself.
And trust me: feeling better about yourself and accepting yourself will make it much easier for you to start having some of the experiences you feel like you’ve been missing. It’s a lot easier to have them when you’re not pre-emptively apologizing for having never had them in the first place.
Good luck.
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This post was previously published on doctornerdlove.com and is republished on Medium.
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